Rapier builds?

[inlimbo35]

I am asking in general, of rapier builds for Dark Souls PvE or PvP. I enjoy both and am finally coming around to the appeal of a rapier. For PvE I don't so much mind bs'ing enemies but in PvP I try to stay honorable and all of that nonsense. Any of you guys got pointers?

[cua_bien02]

I suppose u know how to build a rapier build so I won't talk abt that. Now there's nothing wrong w/ a particular build, as long as u don't use spam Dark magic and the TWoP + WoG or other TWoP combo BS ><. Even backstabs take some skills, lagstab aside. If u really want to be "honorable", learn how to pvp parry w/ a chaos rapier at 10 humanity. Even the most low-life dare not complain abt a riposte kill.

[inlimbo35]

Thank you, I appreciate the advice. I suppose you're right about the backstabbing, and anyways with even just a little bit of lag it's possible to land one you didn't plan. Honestly I don't know too much about it other than what's completely obvious. Specific equipment and soul allocation is where I'm a little lost.

[slacker]

Low level or high level builds? If it's a low level build, obviously some elemental weapon. If it's a high level build, +15 normal a weapon or if you're magic +5 enchant or CMW the rapier or something. Depends alot on the factors.

[cua_bien02]

in_limbo35 a écrit :

Thank you, I appreciate the advice. I suppose you're right about the backstabbing, and anyways with even just a little bit of lag it's possible to land one you didn't plan. Honestly I don't know too much about it other than what's completely obvious. Specific equipment and soul allocation is where I'm a little lost.

Rapier, specifically the normal rapier dropped from parrying Balder Knight, or the rapier class in general? Normal rapier has highest crit, so like Hannul says, for a low to mid sl build I'd use a chaos rapier +5 @ 10 humanity. Other rapier-class swords (Estoc, Velka's,...), though still rapiers, don't have crit as high. For high sl, from 90 onward, pump Dex to 40, Vit and End to what u're comfortable w/ (ppl in this range usually have 1200 - 1600 hp). That leaves u enough sl for Sorcer or Faith investment for buffs. CMW is the best sorcery buff (25 Int). Darkmoon blade and Sunlight blade require 30 Faith. You'll want to be light weight so find ur own armor combo, but know that any armor sets upgraded on the normal path usually turn out to be better than special path (twinkling titanite). Now, Hornet Ring, this is a thorny issue. Some people hate it. Some ppl don't. Just go w/ what you feel best, just remember that blatant backstab fishing annoys everyone :).

[The Fatalist]

Hmm. I tried a rapier (estoc) build, but it didn't really turn out, so I made it a 40 str/dex build, so I'll put a few things I experienced.

First off, coming from someone who uses great/ultra greatswords, don't expect to stagger or do massive 1-hit damage to anyone with a rapier. It simply won't work. That means that you more or less need to bug bite them to death, unless you are facing someone brave/stupid enough to run with 0 poise or 10 vit or something rediculous.

Secondly, from what I've seen, you want to be lightweight. I'm only ever truly comfortable with a mid-roll (don't ask, I don't know, I've just adapted so well to it that fast rolls and flips disorient me) so for me, that's probablly why my rapier build failed. You want to jump in, hit, then immediately jump out before they counterattack. You don't have the range or speed to go heavy armour with a rapier, like you can with a spear.

Lastly, as others have said, rapiers have a great critical bonus, so backstab and (Preferably) rispotes work to a great effect. Just don't try to backstab fish constantly, anyone competent will stop you. For example, I'd either easily catch you in my ultra greatswords dead angle, or simply counterbackstab you.

I have no idea how buffs affect what is above, as I've never placed a high-level buff on anything but a greatsword.

[MMMMM]

The first thing you're going to need is a roll of duct tape and a panel van...


...oh Rapier build. Gotcha. Hell I dunno man.

[hghwolf]

PvP rapier build - PvE too to be honest - amounts to using Ricards, buffing it and using the heavy attack. Full buff damage everytime, very rapid, 5 hits. It`s kinda like a melee HCSM.

Also parry riposte.

[SageHashirama]

well 4 Rapiers u ned 2 do dex-faith or dex-magic build

[Skeleton Witch]

hghwolf a écrit :

PvP rapier build - PvE too to be honest - amounts to using Ricards, buffing it and using the heavy attack. Full buff damage everytime, very rapid, 5 hits. It`s kinda like a melee HCSM.

Also parry riposte.

I actually find the standard rapier and the estoc much more practical than Ricard's rapier, their heavy attacks are more useful, the rapier's heavy has relatively long range and is very fast and can be easily comboed in with light attacks with little penalty to speed, while the estoc's heavy attacks are wide and quick, they allow for easy dead angles too, plus, the estoc has the longest reach of all three for a very, very slight penalty to speed (almost unnoticeable).

Ricard's heavy is entirely too situational to really be useful, you really need to catch your opponent offguard to make use of it else you will be punished for sure, that goes for both PvE and PvP, it only really shines when combined with poise.

Both the rapier and estoc also deal more damage than Ricard's on backstabs and ripostes, the difference is small, but it's there.

I can't speak for Velka's though, I never tried using it, from what I gather it has the reach of the estoc but the speed of the rapier, there are also people saying its heavy attacks are nasty, I'll need to try it eventually.

Mail breaker is worthless, but that's something everyone knows. I feel that people very often underestimate piercing swords due to their lower damage output than most other weapons, but they can be very dangerous in the right hands.

EDIT: Oh, limbo, try to learn to use your running attack to dead angle opponents, even if you don't get the angle perfectly right and hit the shield chances are the second hit will still deal damage as the running attack is a two hits attack, it's very useful, but you need to be careful not to get parried when you do so.

[hghwolf]

Hot Tramp a écrit :

hghwolf a écrit :

PvP rapier build - PvE too to be honest - amounts to using Ricards, buffing it and using the heavy attack. Full buff damage everytime, very rapid, 5 hits. It`s kinda like a melee HCSM.

Also parry riposte.

words.

PvP melee build without poise ? Pull the other one, s got bells on. Sure you get the flippers and dancers, but those fish for stabs and use poison anyway.

[Skeleton Witch]

hghwolf a écrit :

Hot Tramp a écrit :

words.

PvP melee build without poise ? Pull the other one, s got bells on. Sure you get the flippers and dancers, but those fish for stabs and use poison anyway.

I know having some poise is necessary in PvP, the poise bit mostly has to do with PvE, the heavy attack is just not practical.

[Murrsalt]

Avoid sheilding and attacking too, doesn't have enough range and leaves you WAY TOO OPEN for a backstab.