Is it just me, or are unique faith weapons generally bad?

[Rithm Fluffderg]

Like, okay.

Grant is slow as ♥♥♥♥, suffers most from split damage, and the WoG special isn't boosted by rings and you can only use it three times before your weapon's about to break. Also requires high stats.

Astora's Straight Sword's sole purpose is as a newbie weapon to pick up on a new Cleric with the Master Key so you can deal some nice damage to enemies early on. A Divine Longsword is literally better in every single way.

Crescent Axe is decent, but boring.

Dragonslayer Spear only really shines with high stats, otherwise other weapons do better damage with less investment (especially the Demon's Spear)

in comparison...

Moonlight Butterfly Horn and Moonlight Greatsword are both solid Int weapons, dealing pure magical damage, and Moonlight Greatsword is, of course, that legendary weapon that From really loves to put in their games.

And while Pyromancy doesn't scale with a stat, it does synergize well with dex builds, and so it goes great with literally any weapon - but the Quelaag's Furysword is a very thematic weapon that scales with Dex *and* Humanity and deals mostly fire damage.

It just kinda seems like Faith got the short end of the stick in this game.

[CherryKakyoin]

Why do you want faith only weapons when you can get a +15 weapon +max rank darkmoon blade?

[John]

Origineel geplaatst door ElitistChiruno:

Why do you want faith only weapons when you can get a +15 weapon +max rank darkmoon blade?

This
There are few split damage weapons that are ok even for pve because of the way damage is calculated in this game. Faith has both darkmoon and sunlight blade in it's arsenal making it more versatile than int in a way.

[MaenaZ]

That's because balance doesn't mean 'everything is the same'.

Divine Weapons are stronger against skeletons and cause necromancer-revived or Nito-revived skeletons to die permanently. That's their strong side. However, they do perform remotely well in the areas where other weapons with split damage would also perform remotely well.

In my opinion Crescent Axe is actually a good weapon, and Dragonslayer Spear has some very good scaling so it's worth using on higher levels. Definitely agree on Astora's Straight Sword. Grant is as fast as every great hammer so whatever.

[Rithm Fluffderg]

Origineel geplaatst door ElitistChiruno:

Why do you want faith only weapons when you can get a +15 weapon +max rank darkmoon blade?

Because
A: Gotta have something in hand while working your way up to +15 weapon dankmoon/sunlight blade.
B: Unique weapons are cool

Origineel geplaatst door MaenaZ:

Divine Weapons are stronger against skeletons and cause necromancer-revived or Nito-revived skeletons to die permanently. That's their strong side. However, they do perform remotely well in the areas where other weapons with split damage would also perform remotely well.

Thanks, bro, for that, but the problem isn't divine weapons, it's unique faith weapons.

As in, "picking up a random claymore and making it a +10 Divine Weapon is loads better than using Grant".

I was being very specific with my topic title.

Also, there's no unique occult faith weapon. You do have Velka's Rapier, but that's an int weapon with an occult modifier (which is pretty cool, I'll admit)

[MaenaZ]

Thing is, unique divine weapons have a higher modifier than divine weapons and thus their extra damage on skeletons is higher. It's still their asset compared to unique weapons of other types as well.

Another thing is that pretty much any boss, dragon, or twinkling titanite weapon ends up either inferior or barely rivaling the equivalents of +14/+15 normal weapons. (almost) Anything that only upgrades to +5 is worse off than stuff you can both buff and upgrade to +15 in the long run.

In case of unique faith weapons, Grant and Astora's Straight Sword are inferior to regular weapons (as many +5 boss and Twinkling Titanite weapons are, eventually), Crescent Axe rivals related regular weapons (as the rare, occasional +5 weapons are to +14/+15 equivalent weapons), and Dragonslayer Spear has a lot of potential but it needs time to bring it out (sort of like Artorias' swords).

[Rithm Fluffderg]

Origineel geplaatst door MaenaZ:

Thing is, unique divine weapons have a higher modifier than divine weapons and thus their extra damage on skeletons is higher.

I don't know how exactly the holy damage is calculated (is it added onto the damage as its own AR, or does it serve as a multiplier for the rest of the damage?)

Though to be honest, comparing a Crescent Axe +5 with a Divine Battle Axe +10 (which felt like the only fair comparison), it seems that the Crescent Axe has slightly worse base damage, but better scaling. Though it also weighs more.

Divine Battle Axe +10 - 160/195/0/0 (110 Holy) D/E/-/C, 4.0
Crescent Axe +5 172/172/0/0 (120 Holy) - D/D/-/B, 7.0

However, as far as base damage goes, the Divine Battle Axe is better when facing opponents that aren't skeletons, crow demons, or those "Masses of Souls" found in the New Londo ruins. Hmm.

(Of course, the Dragonslayer Spear doesn't have Holy damage at all)

[Vasthe]

MAGIC XDXDXD

[MaenaZ]

Origineel geplaatst door Space Wizard Zach:

Origineel geplaatst door MaenaZ:

Thing is, unique divine weapons have a higher modifier than divine weapons and thus their extra damage on skeletons is higher.

I don't know how exactly the holy damage is calculated (is it added onto the damage as its own AR, or does it serve as a multiplier for the rest of the damage?)

Though to be honest, comparing a Crescent Axe +5 with a Divine Battle Axe +10 (which felt like the only fair comparison), it seems that the Crescent Axe has slightly worse base damage, but better scaling. Though it also weighs more.

Divine Battle Axe +10 - 160/195/0/0 (110 Holy) D/E/-/C, 4.0
Crescent Axe +5 172/172/0/0 (120 Holy) - D/D/-/B, 7.0

However, as far as base damage goes, the Divine Battle Axe is better when facing opponents that aren't skeletons, crow demons, or those "Masses of Souls" found in the New Londo ruins. Hmm.

(Of course, the Dragonslayer Spear doesn't have Holy damage at all)

The holy damage looks like some sort of weird multiplier (I believe 130 Holy modifier *doesn't* mean the damage against holy-weakness enemies is 130%).

Issue with comparing the Crescent Axe to the Battle Axe is that while it is the most fair comparison, it doesn't take into accord two factors :
- Reach (Crescent Axe does have a better reach)
- Effort ('is it worth making weapon X if I have weapon Y?).

Crescent Axe can be brought up to +5 soon after you get it since both Anor Londo and Crystal Cave provide one with plenty of Twinkling Titanite.
On the other hand, getting a weapon to +10 Divine requires a white slab, which are significantly more rare, and plenty of white chunks. The Crescent Axe is one of those cases where a Twinkling Titanite weapon is often actually good enough to be used for whole game in instances where such a weapon might be useful.

Of course, when making an optimized end-game / PVP build, it'll be rare to see it over an actual +15-equivalent axe.

[Hoonsy]

To be fair, I was wondering as well why there isn't a single weapon in the game (to my knowledge) that deals pure magic or lightning damage with faith scaling. Like the mentioned MGS or MBH

[The Fountaineer 🖋]

Crescent Axe is great. Haven't used Grant yet, but it's a great hammer so ofc the speed is slow. I personally don't see a problem with split damage weapons, I like to use them because they draw out my fights and make it more interesting.

[Rithm Fluffderg]

Origineel geplaatst door Mr. Carcosia:

Crescent Axe is great. Haven't used Grant yet, but it's a great hammer so ofc the speed is slow. I personally don't see a problem with split damage weapons, I like to use them because they draw out my fights and make it more interesting.

Well, the attack speed being slow is normal, yeah.

The annoying bit is how slow the WoG effect is. Especially with how telegraphed it is.

And the fact that you can only use it three times before your weapon is "at risk".

[The Fountaineer 🖋]

Origineel geplaatst door Space Wizard Zach:

Origineel geplaatst door Mr. Carcosia:

Crescent Axe is great. Haven't used Grant yet, but it's a great hammer so ofc the speed is slow. I personally don't see a problem with split damage weapons, I like to use them because they draw out my fights and make it more interesting.

Well, the attack speed being slow is normal, yeah.

The annoying bit is how slow the WoG effect is. Especially with how telegraphed it is.

And the fact that you can only use it three times before your weapon is "at risk".

Well, that's why on buiilds with those types of gimmick weapons I carry lots of repair powders so I can spam the "weapon arts" to my heart's content. I think with Wrath of the Gods it's about baiting people into coming closer while you do it, so you probably need some poise to benefit at all from it.