DPS in TFD, is it a failure?

[Valtaya]

After some failed void intercept battles (and I mean realy hurtig bad critical failures, not just "ok that didnt go well"), I decided do something testing, and it looks like this (a few runs, surely not enough, but definitely more than one ^^):

Void Intercept Battle, Swamp Walker, normal (solo)
recommended DPS: 75.000
my DPS: 400.000 (number is rounded down, as it is closer to 400k than 500k)

I had to use all rounds of my weapon to bring the shields of the Swamp Walker down to 0. After it, the Swamp Walker entered its "immunity" phase, but I had no ammo to destroy the tubes, my other two weapons are just useless. So for the next 15min I killed trash mobs and hoped for a drop, since the "Support Drone" only replenishes general rounds, and only one ammo pack for my rounds dropped. Pointless to say, the whole undertaking was well... pointless. (And I do not want to hear stupid stuff like "you need 3 high DPS weapons"...no way, realy? that is not the point here.)

Lets break it down to some more managable numbers. Lets assume I do 100 damage and the mob have 10.000 HP, which means, I would have to hit 100 times to kill it. Now, if I had a weapon that does 400 damage, I would only need 25 hits, which is just 1/4 of what it was before.

Back to the Swamp Walker... I have a weapon that does 5.3 times more damage than is required. Should I be able to beat it with relative ease? I would say yes.

I mean, if I went versus a colossus that requires 750.000 DPS, I would not be realy surprised if it went south. But this?

[It is my CAT]

You need mods, that converts another weapon into "ammo bank".
For example, I have Tamer for this, it gives me 800+ ammo for my Enduring Legacy. It also converts green bullets into white. When I pick up white ammo with Tamer it gives me 200 bullets and 100, if I pick up green ammo.
Third my weapon is Piercing Light for Hailey.
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3292064419

[Valtaya]

That does not help/solve the DPS problem.

It helps with ammo (only) just a little bit IF ammo drops, I had way too many missions (battlefield, infiltration, and void interception, without a single ammo drop). Whatever, this setup is meant for the spray & pray folks, not a real solution.

[It is my CAT]

Originally posted by Valtaya:

That does not help/solve the DPS problem.

It helps with ammo (only) just a little bit IF ammo drops, I had way too many missions (battlefield, infiltration, and void interception, without a single ammo drop). Whatever, this setup is meant for the spray & pray folks, not a real solution.

You are probably don't understand dps meaning. DPS is your damage per second and you must take into account, when you reloading weapon (0 damage), swap weapon (0 damage), run to pick up ammo (0 damage). So this setup, mentioned earlier, helps a lot with this.
As for missions without "single drop of ammo", it can't be true. You are maybe too slow to pick up ammo and it vanishes. It maybe the case especially in defense/400% missions.

Anyway, you can complain or improve your build. If not ammo build, than make your weapon 700k dps at least.

[fx!]

Both weapon DPS and colossi recommended stats are unreliable. Tooltip DPS ignores a lot of factors and recommended stats are just a meme pretty much. In terms of making a character tanky prefer HP/shields instead of defence/resistances. Infinite ammo trick is also pretty neat.

[Valtaya]

Originally posted by It is my CAT:

You are probably don't understand dps meaning. DPS is your damage per second and you must take into account, when you reloading weapon (0 damage), swap weapon (0 damage), run to pick up ammo (0 damage). So this setup, mentioned earlier, helps a lot with this.
As for missions without "single drop of ammo", it can't be true. You are maybe too slow to pick up ammo and it vanishes. It maybe the case especially in defense/400% missions.

Anyway, you can complain or improve your build. If not ammo build, than make your weapon 700k dps at least.

Consumable loot (ammo, MP, HP) only vanish is there is too much in the area, which is usualy a problem in "defense" missions.
It also vanishes when a mission ends in the "open world" zones. I think both are bad design choices.
But during an infiltration mission, nothing vanishes. So being slow is not an issue. And if it did not happen so often, I would not mention it (that no ammo drops). But if you do not believe it, so be it. There are enough missions, where you just fight the "boss", so no trash mobs, which means no drops. In this scenario, that mod build is pointless.

There are players out there, who do not care for recoil and accuarcy of a weapon, just hold the shoot button and shoot all over the place, hardly hitting. This people just waste ammo and for those such a build is meant.

Originally posted by fx!:

Both weapon DPS and colossi recommended stats are unreliable. Tooltip DPS ignores a lot of factors and recommended stats are just a meme pretty much. In terms of making a character tanky prefer HP/shields instead of defence/resistances. Infinite ammo trick is also pretty neat.

Yah this makes more sense. Wonder if they can somehow improve it? I wish to be helpful and not be a burden and relying on people who can carry me.

[NDM]

yes, 75000 dps is a bit low. but anyway, these are just recommendations for newbies. honestly, i don't remember what the average dps and weapon level is when this boss becomes available. maybe it should be like that..

[Ave]

the issue is on your side.

post your build and stop looking at ''dps'' becuase its gives a false sense of performance, my haily 3 shots swamp walker on hard.

[Jundah 101]

swamp walker on normal dificulty solo have 27mil HP, that 75k DPS is for weapon DPS not how to melt the boss , if you ran out of ammo that means your 400k DPS weapon didnt perform well due to many things ,
were you hitting weak spots?
were you far away and do less dmg from dmg fall off
what gun were you using?
is that 400k DPS because of fire rate?
how big the dmg per bullet hitting?

edit : here is the SS that proof normal mode swamp walker solo is 27mil HP
https://imgur.com/a/zI93NOt

[Plasmasnack]

Actually this is not your fault at all. Swamp Walker is bugged currently.

Solo Normal Swamp Walker uses the hard version's health value. I realized this when I was farming some rocks and felt like it should have been much faster. I saw I did 25 million damage. Hanged man only has 6 million hp solo. Swamp Walker, specifically only 1 player normal has bugged health.

[Jundah 101]

Originally posted by NDM:

yes, 75000 dps is a bit low. but anyway, these are just recommendations for newbies. honestly, i don't remember what the average dps and weapon level is when this boss becomes available. maybe it should be like that..

swamp walker iirc is around white night gulch area so by then player have access to tamer and if my memory serve me right, that gun with no investment and basic 3-4 module can give you around 400K DPS

[Jundah 101]

Originally posted by Plasmasnack:

Actually this is not your fault at all. Swamp Walker is bugged currently.

Solo Normal Swamp Walker uses the hard version's health value. I realized this when I was farming some rocks and felt like it should have been much faster. I saw I did 25 million damage. Hanged man only has 6 million hp solo. Swamp Walker, specifically only 1 player normal has bugged health.

how do you solo hangman? that boss is pub only afaik, and dmg testing on hangman is kinda unreliable due to someone might doing a lot of dmg instead which makes you do less dmg at the end result screen

[Plasmasnack]

Originally posted by Jundah 101:

Originally posted by Plasmasnack:

Actually this is not your fault at all. Swamp Walker is bugged currently.

Solo Normal Swamp Walker uses the hard version's health value. I realized this when I was farming some rocks and felt like it should have been much faster. I saw I did 25 million damage. Hanged man only has 6 million hp solo. Swamp Walker, specifically only 1 player normal has bugged health.

how do you solo hangman? that boss is pub only afaik, and dmg testing on hangman is kinda unreliable due to someone might doing a lot of dmg instead which makes you do less dmg at the end result screen

If people leave the match, the game actually scales down the health values if the Colossus has scaling. It's a feature not many people will notice I imagine. I was only bringing up Hanged Man to show a comparison using the same player count that the next boss has literally 1/4 the health of the one before it. Pretty insane.

-Edit- Also, this website has accurate values for all bosses:
https://tfdtools.com/bosses/

[Captain Worthy]

Originally posted by Valtaya:

After some failed void intercept battles (and I mean realy hurtig bad critical failures, not just "ok that didnt go well"), I decided do something testing, and it looks like this (a few runs, surely not enough, but definitely more than one ^^):

Void Intercept Battle, Swamp Walker, normal (solo)
recommended DPS: 75.000
my DPS: 400.000 (number is rounded down, as it is closer to 400k than 500k)

I had to use all rounds of my weapon to bring the shields of the Swamp Walker down to 0. After it, the Swamp Walker entered its "immunity" phase, but I had no ammo to destroy the tubes, my other two weapons are just useless. So for the next 15min I killed trash mobs and hoped for a drop, since the "Support Drone" only replenishes general rounds, and only one ammo pack for my rounds dropped. Pointless to say, the whole undertaking was well... pointless. (And I do not want to hear stupid stuff like "you need 3 high DPS weapons"...no way, realy? that is not the point here.)

Lets break it down to some more managable numbers. Lets assume I do 100 damage and the mob have 10.000 HP, which means, I would have to hit 100 times to kill it. Now, if I had a weapon that does 400 damage, I would only need 25 hits, which is just 1/4 of what it was before.

Back to the Swamp Walker... I have a weapon that does 5.3 times more damage than is required. Should I be able to beat it with relative ease? I would say yes.

I mean, if I went versus a colossus that requires 750.000 DPS, I would not be realy surprised if it went south. But this?

This is an ammo management error created by yourself, and not by the game. Even a 50 billion dps weapon would be completely useless if you have no ammo for it.

The game doesn't give us just guns of different ammo types, there are also mods which convert some of the ammo pickups into other ammo types. I suggest you use these.

[Grimzy]

What captain said, or use Enzo xD

[TrioAngelamVA.WliaAlfaD.A.S]

To be fair the whole info about DPS should just be changed to-
recommended DPS : just get maxed Enzo or Freyna dude !