Everything I can think of that's wrong with DDO.. from a FAN

[Doug]

DDO is not the perfect MMO. Maybe such a beast resides out there in the far reaches of cyberspace.. if so, I haven't seen it yet. I have tired of the ongoing ridiculous stuff I have seen posted about DDO, and I would like to try to set the record as straight as I can. I'll try to keep to one negative per post, and I WILL post my thoughts on each, fwiw.

This thread's been around for a VERY long time. Some of the things it mentions no longer exist in the game. Still, it's a pretty good primer for the things players have complained about over the years.

It's been just about a decade now since I made this posting. Yet some of the things it covers are STILL relevant.

[殺してあげる]

*grin* you splitting it up into posts did rather avert Wall of Text handily. The worst offenders are the ones that don't bother to paragraph and have a word dump post.

Another issue (at least in my view) with DDO is consistency. That dove-tailing with 'nerfing' to prevent obsolescence of classes or favouring races (e.g. why they nerfed warforged), or forcing only one way through a new system. It's not a game-breaker, but it is an irk.

<#include meandering.rnt>

Likely not overly noticed by many unless they twink or TR..but a lot of early doors (like in catacombs) you can fireball open. A lot you can bash down..then that option just disapears. Okay, ignoring the 'magic fireball' supposedly has zero pressure (cue "fills it volume" arguements of old and so forth)... I have disintigrate..why doesn't that work on those old doors? Why does neither work on later doors? Why can't that 110 str barbarian use his axe on a wooden door?

Speaking of doors...grates...why can't my halfling slip through them? Why can't I through daggers or use ray spells through them? Why can I use sonic blast and hit them on the other side of the grate, but my cloudkill doesn't pass through? Earthquake effects things on the other side, but the heat from wall of fire doesn't?

Why can't I walk under that low ceiling (that is still above my head level)? Some sort of Political Correctness 'cuz the halforc won't fight, we won't let the halfling through? Fine then, why can't I just disintigrate the wall?

Why o bloody why are NPCs immune while giving speaches? Talking is NOT a free action when you're monologuing dammit! If it is, why can't I give a 'why you suck' speech back? (okay, well, as a monk I can..but was more thinking be great to coordinate the party moron into being useful :P )

Traps... what ever happened to friendly fire? Okay, sure the bear traps seem to be pretty much agnostic...but even if a spellward only triggers on the party, it should hit enemies in the area too. It used to be so much fun leading mobs through their own traps to die...only time seeing that lately was the fire traps in the backroute of the Mystra Temple. Sure it'd be only fair if friendly fire applied to both sides..but that'd be kinda hillarious too. In the Gold Box games sometimes you had to roll the hard six and include a friendly in the AoE. (That said, Silence 15' on a fighter and have him zerg the casters..weeee).

Enemy casters..cheat. They never roll con checks, they never run out of spell points. HAX. Give them all blue bars and a stack of mnem pots (like hirelings), but sheesh.

Dim door..why can't I use it to move in Line of SIght? Teleport..why can't I use it to teleport to the start of a dungeon?

Why are upper levels more and more just 'hp bag' mobs that are immune to most things, shake off that which they aren't immune to in seconds? Is tedium the new difficulty?


etc etc etc

Point? I think I had one..once... long ago... :P

[Doug]

I think this post covers the stuff that DDO could improve quite well. Basically, there's a lot of physics rules bent or broken, and only an occasional eye toward bringing things back toward consistency (don't even IMAGINE that they might KEEP them consistent). Even so, game mechanics are game mechanics.. we may wish they were different, but once you know what they are, you're golden (play-wise.. what you may think about it is something else). I will admit that the advantages of enemy casters seem a bit unfair, and I wish someone had found a better way to manage high-level content rather than just insane amounts of HP and lots of immunities (for mobs, that is).

Still, until the day we have some kind of VR immersive or direct brain stimulation type gaming, every game is gonna have compromises in what physics they implement and what they ignore. While all of this can be irritating, it's hardly an indicator of bad gameplay.

[Exothermically Eclectic]

Doug eredeti hozzászólása:

For my money, it's not P2W.. others may disagree. Surely it's not the worst offender by far, in any event.

Oh come now, surely no-one would constantly rant about it being P2W all over the forums to the point where basically every post of theirs is either covering it being P2W or a setup for a later post saying it is?

[Realitysleeps]

People will always complain, sadly its human nature. Ive played Neverwinter, that is p2w, I've playyed DDO, its not - simple reason being taht I can achieve everything a paying player does, it just takes me a bit longer. DDO Forums often have players complaining about the lack of new content or things that are introduced in the store etc and many argue for weeks / months / years that the game is p2w, but usually when you get down to it they are complaining that they have had to buy this quest pack or that quest pack. Grinidng quests for favour isnt the most fun in the world when you solo play, when your running with friends its really not that bad.

I subscribe these days, not to win but to give something back to the game. The reality is that I;ve spent thousands of hours over the years (and only recently through steam) playing this game and it has evolved and continues to do so.

Yes, if you spend money things can get easier (specifically spell pots and healing pots that are more pwoerful than the ones available from the vendors), but they are not game changing and really are only needed by players zerging through the game. In you run each quest smooth;y there are plenty of shrines and the normal post are enough to keep you going in between.

If the game was, as some people would say, truly f2p, in that all content was completley free, Im curious as to what byusiness model people think would be in place. How would they actually make any money to keep developing it. And it is still being developed, update 22 is due out soon with yet more changes. Its constantly evolving and that takes resources, that takes investment and yet they are doing that with a model that allows anyone to play any of the content as long as they put in the time.

I subscribe to give something back and because I can afford to, I enjoyed this game when I coudlnt afford to buy others, still manaqed to play very happily and although I often ran with players that to me seemed super powerful, with time it became clear that there 'super' characters were down to the actual build choices that they had made and the equipment they had than any financial advantage.

If you truly believe the game is p2w its unlikely anyone is going to convince you otherwise, we each have our own opinions on that and we each have our own reasoning behind it. What really matters is do you feel the game is unplayable because of the way its managed. If eth answer is yes then simply move onto another game, if its no, then enjoy the game and the pople you meet along the way, and if your not sure, then play the game - you dont really ahve anything to lose but time, and if you have time enough to read forum threads then you probably have time to play.

DDO isnt perfect, butu nothing is. My friends within the game are a mixture of f2p, premium and subscribers yet we all play together and have a lot of fun.

There is no real way to 'win' ddo (Ok, you can get the completionist feat which says you've won but still), its an eternal game that encorages players to keep replaying the same material over and over again. The fact that so many do must say as much about it as all the forum debates on whether its f2p...

[Doug]

Well said, Realitysleeps. P2W is obvious in some games and open for debate in others. Lots of F2P players I know certainly don't think it's P2W. There HAS to be advantage to stuff you pay for, to encourage people to do so. Without those 2 mechanics, the game would not exist. It's not a charity. Certainly paying players can get more powerful (a LOT) faster.. but the top end's the same, and the cooperative play concept means it's not all that relevant. You may feel marginalized when playing alongside some multi-TR player who gets more than his/her fair share of the kills, but you will still contribute and one day could have an equally powerful toon without paying a cent IF you have the patience.

People can short-circuit their way there with money, but the 'there' is virtually identical. And some of us think some of the shortcut steals the joy in the journey.

[Doug]

Also.. don't get me wrong... I'm not even against P2W F2P games. I just wish they said so up front: 'You can try our game for free, but to compete, you WILL have to subscribe' or WoW's straightforward: "You can play free for this long and no longer". It's the ones that SAY you can play free forever, but clearly you will simply get stymied because everyone else is SOO much more powerful than you and you DO play PVP. Those are the P2W games I personally detest.

[Doug]

Highly Heretical eredeti hozzászólása:

Doug eredeti hozzászólása:

For my money, it's not P2W.. others may disagree. Surely it's not the worst offender by far, in any event.

Oh come now, surely no-one would constantly rant about it being P2W all over the forums to the point where basically every post of theirs is either covering it being P2W or a setup for a later post saying it is?

DDO's forums contain a highly-suspicious, sometimes ridiculously negative subset of the playerbase. OTOH, they are arguing about it while they play it. Appears to me that they love it enough they're defending 'their' turf. The level of ownership they feel in the game is such that they are suspicious of every change. I don't like to hang out there because of the negativity, but their vocal feedback helps keep Turbine honest and imo makes the game better.

Specifically, every negative that I've posted on this thread has been expounded at length with much higher emotional tone and associated 'DOOOOOOMMMMM!!!' on the DDO forums, not just the question of whether or not DDO is P2W. And others as well, which no longer exist in the game BECAUSE of those expositions. So to suggest that the quantity of posts on the topic indicates it is true is nonsense... if it were true, there'd be an exodus in droves and far fewer people to make the accusations/raise the concerns. That's how I see it anyway. Frankly, hearsay isn't ideal evidence imo.. play the game and decide for yourself. (It's free to play, so you can :) )

[殺してあげる]

There is also the TINY but vocal subset who have quit ages ago, stay around 'because they like the community', and chime in on changes. Their contributions to discussion range from helpful to hindering to trollish, depending on which is the one in question.

Suspect though HH had something specific in mind though....~


----

And Realitysleeps is wrong: DDO has an "I win" button, available in the DDO store. So there! =D

[Doug]

殺してあげる eredeti hozzászólása:

----

And Realitysleeps is wrong: DDO has an "I win" button, available in the DDO store. So there! =D

Right.. forgot about that. And people actually bought it, too. So I guess it IS P2W.. by Turbine's own definition of 'winning'. Still, joke items aside....

[</PAiN\> rAALph SiC]

<-- Also feels that this is still the best mmorpg experience, even when compared to the latest ones i have bought into and/or tested. Just my two cp :)

[Exothermically Eclectic]

殺してあげる eredeti hozzászólása:

Suspect though HH had something specific in mind though....~

I'm sure I have nooo idea who what you could possibly mean by that.

[Doug]

殺してあげる eredeti hozzászólása:

Suspect though HH had something specific in mind though....~

Ooops. I missed that connotation. I read it as a general forum flavor comment. I have certainly met people who were adamant that DDO is P2W, I just find their arguments .. not compelling.

[殺してあげる]

Forum posts[imperialentanglements.thecomicseries.com]

[Davister]

I quite agree

[dark]

ddo is the best rpg out end of story