Why Neverwinter has more players than DDO?

[neuronfly]

Both Neverwinter and DDO are D&D games but Neverwinter has huge amount of players compared to this game. On pc, ps4 and xbone combined Neverwinter has over 1 million active players whereas DDO has barely 2k players, What is the reason behind this?

[LexCondran]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Doug:

DDO's a harder game to play. Learning curve's much steeper. It's also a lot older, and some people are always off to the newest thing.

So if there's a difference, I'd expect those things are part of it.

the only thing i liked about neverwinter was is map maker
but, on consoles, they removed that, and it become so over convoluted to play

[NavFamG]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από neuronfly:

DDO's graphics look like potato... very outdated and ugly graphics. Thats why many people don't play this game. When I first started this game and looked at the character creation screen I was horrified by how ugly this game is.

And you know many people don't play because of the graphic's ........ HOW?

[The Pants]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από neuronfly:

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από El Pantalones:

DDO is much, much older.

DDO's graphics look like potato... very outdated and ugly graphics. Thats why many people don't play this game. When I first started this game and looked at the character creation screen I was horrified by how ugly this game is.

oh it's you

I actually do agree with you, DDO's greatest weakness is how it looks(also its age). There never has been anything like it, and in the age of the streamlined modern mmo having to care about things like "is there a trap here" and "how well can I swim in this armor" as well as having utility like being able to slow how fast people are falling and how high they can jump is incredibly refreshing. But yo it looks BAD son.
That's just not easy to fix. If you're a billionare passionate about old MMOs, please invest in this game to overhaul the engine to allow it to look better as well as put in physics for bull rushing and throwing objects to do damage.

[Jaxom]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από El Pantalones:

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από neuronfly:

DDO's graphics look like potato... very outdated and ugly graphics. Thats why many people don't play this game. When I first started this game and looked at the character creation screen I was horrified by how ugly this game is.

oh it's you

I actually do agree with you, DDO's greatest weakness is how it looks(also its age). There never has been anything like it, and in the age of the streamlined modern mmo having to care about things like "is there a trap here" and "how well can I swim in this armor" as well as having utility like being able to slow how fast people are falling and how high they can jump is incredibly refreshing. But yo it looks BAD son.
That's just not easy to fix. If you're a billionare passionate about old MMOs, please invest in this game to overhaul the engine to allow it to look better as well as put in physics for bull rushing and throwing objects to do damage.

That is one thing I don't understand. The BIGGEESSTTT reason I cant get people to play this is the looks of the game. Why have they not done a graphics overhaul?? Lots of games do it, some games have done 2 or 3 over their life span. very odd.

[Soap]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Jaxom:

That is one thing I don't understand. The BIGGEESSTTT reason I cant get people to play this is the looks of the game. Why have they not done a graphics overhaul?? Lots of games do it, some games have done 2 or 3 over their life span. very odd.

Because none of all these supposed people who must have better graphics to play something want to pay for it. It's not odd at all; really standard gaming industry stuff. Very few games ever do graphics overhauls, and when they do they often raise prices. Here's a related article if you want to read more about the nitty-gritty... https://kotaku.com/the-video-game-industry-cant-go-on-like-this-1836606033

[Krazuka]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από neuronfly:

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από El Pantalones:

DDO is much, much older.

DDO's graphics look like potato... very outdated and ugly graphics. Thats why many people don't play this game. When I first started this game and looked at the character creation screen I was horrified by how ugly this game is.

personally its part of its charm for me

[Rommell8]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Myriad:

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Doug:

DDO's a harder game to play. Learning curve's much steeper. It's also a lot older, and some people are always off to the newest thing.

So if there's a difference, I'd expect those things are part of it.

I'm sure this has a lot to do with it.

Also I never played Neverwinter, but in reviewing it, it's not true D&D. It's just a flashy MMO with the D&D name, and maybe more people just go for that flashy stuff, especially the younger generation.

I also imagine the fact that it's on Consoles has something to do with more people knowing about it.

DDO is even further from D&D than neverwinter

This game is horrible
Constantly nerfing Builds and powers players like--it's like a merry go round covered w razor blades.

Force pay to play
DDO has made most of the previous equipment useless.as the game raises the enemy max lvl..and player cap.Leaving you helpless to run the newer raids unless you Buy their content.

Not to mention they raised pack pries a lot ..like they think this a popular game! No wonder the population is next to zero.


Its suspicious to say the least- every time I had a great build...and out performed in elite raids>my build's multiplier would be nerfed a few weeks later.

This game sucks so bad..i came out of retirement just to say...It Sucks

[Doug]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Rommell8:

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Myriad:

I'm sure this has a lot to do with it.

Also I never played Neverwinter, but in reviewing it, it's not true D&D. It's just a flashy MMO with the D&D name, and maybe more people just go for that flashy stuff, especially the younger generation.

I also imagine the fact that it's on Consoles has something to do with more people knowing about it.

DDO is even further from D&D than neverwinter

This game is horrible
Constantly nerfing Builds and powers players like--it's like a merry go round covered w razor blades.

Force pay to play
DDO has made most of the previous equipment useless.as the game raises the enemy max lvl..and player cap.Leaving you helpless to run the newer raids unless you Buy their content.

Not to mention they raised pack pries a lot ..like they think this a popular game! No wonder the population is next to zero.


Its suspicious to say the least- every time I had a great build...and out performed in elite raids>my build's multiplier would be nerfed a few weeks later.

This game sucks so bad..i came out of retirement just to say...It Sucks

Haven't seen you trolling here in quite a while.

As usual, your assertions are either outright false or misleading at best.

DDO is most assuredly not further from DDO than is Neverwinter. And if your assertion is based on build nerfs, that's not even logical. If not, you've provided zero evidence for your position.

DDO is not pay to play. But you may choose to pay to play specific content, races, classes, etc. And the assertion about needing to buy their content to play the newer raids is at best ingenuous, since all the newer raids ARE pay to play.

And I'm not aware of a single case in which they've raised a pack price. The latest expansions are more than previous ones, but that's considerably different from raising prices on existing content.

And finally, maintaining play balance is a constantly-moving target, so yes, if you create a toon based on the latest flavor build or exploit, you can expect it to be quickly nerfed. You can either like that (play the latest build so as to gain its advantages while they last) or hate it and avoid flavor-of-the-month builds. Not sure how either one makes the game bad overall.

[The Pants]

The idea that DDO(where you can multiclass and your skills that you put POINTS into actually do important things) is less like pen and paper than Neverwinter(where you pick one class, have no choice about how to build it, and skills don't exist) is absurd. It's not even worth discussing. As a long time P&P guy, seeing how DDO solves long time D&D problems like "fighters are boring and just attack every turn" and "my wizard either sucks ass and doesn't do anything or he trivializes every encounter" is one of the most exciting things about it. I guarantee you no one would've had any problems with the Book of Weaboo Fightan Magic if the classes in there worked like the enhancements for fighters, rangers and rouges.

As for pay to play, I'll actually agree. DDO was, if I remember correctly, the first actual premium ass big MMO to go free in the west, and their monetization revolves around trying to get you to sub like you would other MMOs at the time. The game with a sub is just a much better experience than one without; and not in a p2w or monty haul way like a lot of other F2P games with a vip option. It does it by opening up a lot of content and gameplay options, then rewards you with points in its store to buy things. Rather than relying on social pressures of lootboxes and timed rewards, it tries to get you to pay for the game by putting more of the game behind paying for it. It's an older method of this type of monetization, but I think it's more honest and more fun.

[Soap]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Rommell8:

DDO is even further from D&D than neverwinter

This game is horrible
Constantly nerfing Builds and powers players like--it's like a merry go round covered w razor blades.

Force pay to play
DDO has made most of the previous equipment useless.as the game raises the enemy max lvl..and player cap.Leaving you helpless to run the newer raids unless you Buy their content.

Not to mention they raised pack pries a lot ..like they think this a popular game! No wonder the population is next to zero.


Its suspicious to say the least- every time I had a great build...and out performed in elite raids>my build's multiplier would be nerfed a few weeks later.

This game sucks so bad..i came out of retirement just to say...It Sucks

You're using the words "nerfing" and "retirement" incorrectly; and I don't think it's fair to suggest that DDO is harmful to kids just because you find it too difficult without exploiting (It's perfectly clear that's what you were doing because the only other option is that the devs were conspiring against you, following you're every move instead of working on the game; and for no reason what-so-ever). Instead of whining about it, maybe go find a game you can handle. Here's some I think you'll find are better suited to what you are looking for:

https://play.barbie.com/en-us/games

http://letmegooglethat.com/?q=easy+kids+games+for+pc

Enjoy!

[drunken.dx]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από neuronfly:

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από El Pantalones:

DDO is much, much older.

DDO's graphics look like potato... very outdated and ugly graphics. Thats why many people don't play this game. When I first started this game and looked at the character creation screen I was horrified by how ugly this game is.

As mentioned multiple times, overhauling graphics is EXPENSIVE and time consuming.
And for your "2k players" claim...
When SSG released season pass (only 1000 were sold) it was sold out fast.
Are you claiming that half of playerbase bought fairly expensive season pass?
Third: if you actually wanna complain, go to DDO forums, since steam discussion is never read by SSG, and is mostly used by new players who still did not realise DDO has dedicated forum.

[Diogenes]

Don't forget that Neverwinter is available cross platform. I play Neverwinter on my Xbox 1. I would play DDO on my Xbox 1 if I could, but the developers don't seem to be interested in making the game available cross platform.

Honestly though, I don't care about the graphics. Basing everything on graphics and nothing else, is a very noobish thing to do, in my opinion. To me, game play is far more important than the graphics alone. What's the point in playing a game that looks fantastic, but plays like a turd, to the point that you actually don't want to play it? Graphics aren't everything.

Neverwinter's character building is very bland and linear, and game play makes it feel too much like I'm playing an "arcade" game, with no clear reasoning behind is as to why we're all doing what we're doing. It's a game that boils down to nothing more than go here, kill that, go there, fetch that. That's all I was doing for over 30 levels in Neverwinter.. Then there are the other obvious problems, like paid loot boxes and a way over priced MTS. DDO's MTS prices seem tame in comparison to Neverwinter's. For instance, I was looking at unlocking the Dragonkin race in Neverwinter the other day. I took one look at the price, and walked away. They wanted almost £100 (If I remember right) just to unlock the Dragonkin race. ♥♥♥♥ that.

DDO has the best character building / development system that I think I have ever seen in a game. That's what keeps me coming back to the game. If it wasn't for that aspect of the game, then I think that I would have left the game a long, long time ago. As it is, DDO is the one game that I have played the most in my Steam Library, and that is because of the way the class creation system works. Most of my game time has been spent building, developing and testing, in most cases, vastly different classes.

I like to tinker, to try and make new and interesting classes. I can do that to wonderful effect in DDO, but I can't do that in Neverwinter.

Where as I can see myself still playing DDO in 10 years time, doing the same thing that I'm doing now, provided that the developers continue releasing new content like skill trees, races, classes and wilderness areas etc, I can't see myself playing Neverwinter in 10 months time, yet alone 10 years time. DDO I can spend 8 hours a day on, quite easily, just on testing classes and what not. I see Neverwinter as a much more casual crash and bash game that you play for an hour or two a week and then put down, which requires almost no thought or planning to pick up and play. Consequently, I've already played Neverwinter for several periods before now, put the pad down, and forgotten that the game exists, simply because it doesn't really interest me, and that's down to issues like the game play and character development.

[Exothermically Eclectic]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Diogenes:

I would play DDO on my Xbox 1 if I could, but the developers don't seem to be interested in making the game available cross platform.

[Screams in Spaghetti Code]
Iä! Iä! Bugfix fhtagn!

[Doug]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από dnddiehard:

The reason that DDO has less players then Neverwinter is that the DDO/SSG team is god awful. They crap on their players consistently. They care more about cash grabbing than they care about making a quality product. Also Neverwinter is truly F2P, you can go everywhere for 0$ investment. In DDO if you want a new player (a friend/family etc) to join you, they need to fork over 150$+ to go where I can go. In Neverwinter they can go anywhere I can go for no money. It stands to reason that an outdated game with quite possibly the worst dev team in any game, old tired graphics, buggy game play and 100s of exploits, that the population would be tiny when you want 150$ for it. I mean you can buy a brand new PS4 title and a used PS4 for close to the amount they want just to get into every quest.

Then go play Neverwinter. But to imply that NW is better than DDO because in DDO you pay for access to some of the content, whereas in NW you pay for power (gear enchantments, for example).. and NW has PvP, where a difference in power matters.. is ingenuous at best and outright BS at worst.

Not sure what evidence you have that DDO is not a quality product, but if it's as biased as your comparison of their F2P mechanisms, it's not worth bothering to read.

[NavFamG]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από dnddiehard:

In DDO if you want a new player (a friend/family etc) to join you, they need to fork over 150$+ to go where I can go.

Not really. If you really want to play all the Adventure Packs you could do it by just getting a sub. Also WHY would you want all the Adventure packs? Or even all the Expansions? I'm getting by quite nicely on the 7 (of of 46) Adventure Packs and the 1 (out of 4) Expansions I own and it didn't cost be all that much to get them.

You don't NEED everything, just what you want to play. And yes that does put DDO behind Neverwinter since all the content there is f2p.

On the other hand, the speed you can level up to max in Neverwinter is so accelerated that within 2 weeks you're either having to grind Massively or get a sub so that off-set's that benefit.

Not to mention, if I want something that reflects D&D I'll play DDO. If I just want to play a 'wack of mole' type standard MMO, than sure Neverwinter.