Let's Play: the Fatimid Caliphate

[angel of derp]

Okay, let's play thread because I'm needy that way, sh** already got real in the game, & I don't feel like setting up a blog.

This is the first scenario thing, Anno Domini 1066, William isn't the conqueror of England yet, yadda yadda yadda.

I'm the Emir al-Majid of Alexandria, heir to the Fatimid Caliphate. This is quite possibly one of the easier Ducal/Emir starting positions, I think, due to a lack of internal factions. On the other hand, I am a Catholic, myself, so it's more natural for me to be yelling DEUS VULT! However, I'm choosing a Muslim ruler for this playthrough... my first real attempt at Islamic rule.

First thing I notice... marriage rules and options are VERY different in Islam as compared to a Catholic ruler. I notice there's like NO noble-born female characters to marry. Perhaps it reflects a scarcity of Islamic women in the history of that era, or something. In any case, that means zero family alliances for me at the start of the game, which stinks. (It's nice when your brother in law, the Kaiser, brings the pain to your enemies) BUT, there's no Prestige penalty for marrying Lowborn females for my Emir, and I'm guessing there is no Matrilinear option... so I pick the woman that 1) has the best combination of Martial & Intrigue (stuff that I like), 2) looks pleasing to my eye, 3) is most favorable to Emir al-Majid, relationship-wise.

Second thing... WTF is al-Majid doing as heir? He's the middle son of 3 sons, I think. Maybe he's the first son of the first wife? Just when I thought I figured out Christian inheritance in this game, I start an Islamic dynasty.

Third thing... elder brother is annoyed at me. He is Emir Abu Mansur al-Nizar of Jerusalem, and he has a MUCH larger/more important demesne. Well, come at me brah! I initiate some actions against him because I know he's coming to get me at some point (I might be the heir to the Caliphate, but he's got the stronger position). I plot to assassinate him, stir up dissent against him with my Vizier. If I can knock him out, then my position as heir will be more secure, and I might survive until the Crusaders come to the Holy Land.

Fourth... event reminders already? Hajj NOW? Really? Is the Hajj going to be a persistent bother in my menus until I go on the Hajj? I know it's a pillar of Islam, but do I have to be reminded of that Event all the time? What's that thing Joker said about the AI on the new Normandy in Mass Effect 2... "it's like ship cancer"? Well, that's how I feel about the reminders about the Hajj.

...

So, I start to playing. I've married a good Egyptian maiden, and plant my seed. She bears me a daughter, unfortunately... so no heir to my line as of yet.

Elder brother must be getting annoyed with me, so I shift my Grand Vizier away from Jerusalem to the island of Sicily because I feel like fabricating claims already. Maybe if I conquer a piece of Sicily (they appear to be misguided Sunni faithful), then I can escape to other holdings when the sword comes for my neck. And I really want to conquer at least part of Europe.

BUT... too late. Emir Abu Mansur al-Nizar is totally annoyed with me, and declares WAR. His levies outnumber mine... the ratio is about 5 to 3 in his favor. I cannot march my armies to Jerusalem and win by those odds. I can't hire any Mercenaries (none of the cheap armies are available, and I can't hire the expensive ones)... I'm pretty much dead in the water unless I get lucky.

My primary option, force the Emir to come to me, stay within the province that's highlighted as his target (his message didn't even say he wanted a province. He just seemed to want me dead since I was trying to kill him & I sent my Vizier against him. Oops). If I can buy time, maybe other plots will work against him because the numbers are all against me. So I hunker down in Gizeh.

(Realistically, him marching through the Sinai to get me would be a stupid move... but he attacked me. Maybe it was provoked by my actions, but he attacked me! I take comfort in believing that I made what would be a more defensible action in a history book, even though I should lose now.)

So, yes, 5:3 against me in terms of numbers. The Emir marches almost 2,000 strong against about 1,200 of mine, and I await with my armies in Gizeh. He runs forward with his men to attack my positions...

DING! Event window pops up.

My men catch Emir Abu Mansur al-Nizar in the midst of the battle, AND CUT HIM DOWN LIKE A DOG (may he enjoy his eternal feast of flea-bitten camel balls in the company of Shaitan like he deserves). Enemy is dead, no heir of his line. Crisis OVER. According to the numbers, that shouldn't have happened, and I should have lost the game right there, but A WINNER IS ME.

My father, the Caliph al Mustansir, inherits all of the lands of Abu Mansur al-Nizar, and I survive to scheme another day.

/TL:DR

[Nef]

Nice story so far! That outcome of the battle is one of the things I like about the game. Even when all seems lost, victory can come from the jaws of defeat. It's happened to me more than once!

Some general tips on Islam:
i) marriage. There's no prestige issue with marriage at all, so it's all about alliances and stats. I have noticed that at the start of games, with several starting dates I've tried, there's a lack of Islamic adult women to marry (for some reason there's about a million female babies though. Annoying to have to scroll through). Don't forget you can be married to up to 4 women at once, and you take a prestige hit for not marrying enough. Sultans need 4 wives, Emirs 3 and Sheikhs 2 - or you lose prestige per month based on the difference between how many wives you should have and how many you do have. Personally I try to marry at least one for stats and at least one for alliance. Of course, more wives means (likely) more sons, which leads to increased issues with succession (see below) and Decadence (which can destroy you if left unchecked).

ii) Under Islamic inheritance rules, 'Agnatic Open', the most powerful son inherits. The only time it would be the oldest is if there is literally no difference in power between them, an the only way that's likely to happen is if none of them hold land (but this would also increase your Decadence). This allows you some leeway in choosing an heir - if you have a son with really good stats, give him enough land to become heir. Be warned, though, he becomes a target for intrigue from his jealous brothers - and other brothers with land are likely to revolt on succession!

iii) Hajj - don't let the reminder annoy you, just go on Hajj! It gives you a nice stat modifer while you are on it, and a permanent one when you get back. It also helps reduce decadence and gives some other potentially useful events, and it only takes a few months during which your country is ruled by a Regent; and it's also, usually, pretty cheap to do.

iv) Decadence - keep an eye on this. You get bonuses if it is under 25%, but if it gets over (I think) 75% there is an increasing chance of nomads invading and bringing down your rule. Having lots of family members hanging around doing nothing is the biggest factor in increasing Decadence.

[boozermonkey]

"iv) Decadence - keep an eye on this. You get bonuses if it is under 25%, but if it gets over (I think) 75% there is an increasing chance of nomads invading and bringing down your rule. Having lots of family members hanging around doing nothing is the biggest factor in increasing Decadence."

Yah, that's true, but if you follow the advice here..

http://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/showthread.php?589469-GUIDE-In-depth-Guide-to-CKII

You have to consolidate your power, and that means you need to control every county in at least one Emir. You then go about installing counts in odd counties you control with innefective puppets that cant threaten you, especially on succession. This, of course, will cause lots of decadence because you will have lots of relatives sitting around, and to take care of that problem you either marry them off or get rid of them in "other ways". Your not Catholic so you dont have to worry about "kin killer". The advice in that thread above still holds effective when playing a Muslim ruler, but you have to be a bit more creative. I have found that keeping your vassals happy is much easier, and you can amass massive armies even with just one Emir's holdings. Have fun, and yeah, worry about alliances because they are seriously important when the crusades come.

[Arkeangel]

Originally posted by boozermonkey:

Your not Catholic so you dont have to worry about "kin killer"

That isn't true. If you are caught assassinating a kins man you will get that trait.
I try to marry the first lady with stewardship or for an alliance and then the rest need to be as close to 40 as possible.
The Fatmids are possibly the easiest dynasty to play. Minimal chance of fighting someone more powerful. Lots of easy targets. A mildly aggressive Caliph can easily keep his decadence at 0%. Vassals love you. Crusades are generally easy to deal with. I don't play as them because it is dull.

[Nef]

Holy Wars are indeed a good way to keep Decadence down. As long as you win! But sometimes it is not possible and you have to get rid of family members. Just be careful about imprisoning/executing someone who is the son of a ruling Sheikh or Emir, because their parent will not be very happy with you. Also bear in mind you can't imprison your own children (unless they are plotting against you) without a penalty (I think it is the Tyranny penalty).

[boozermonkey]

Oh right. Its executing same dynasty members that won't incur a serious penalty other than costing you 20 piety. I also marry women at 40 for the non primary spots with a focus on alliance building. I still get the occaisional "oops" baby out of those marriages though.

[angel of derp]

The marriage thing... that was a surprise. I hadn't noticed the Prestige hit at first, but then I had nothing to do after killing the elder brother in battle. It's as if an Emir is EXPECTED to maintain 3 wives, not just that he's able to marry 3 wives due to his status.

With wives comes an avalanche of babies. There are times, as a Catholic king, that I look for Fertility+ traits (even Lustful). As a ♥♥♥♥♥♥ Emir, I'm thinking, "ARE YOU KIDDING ME?" Even without a fertility trait, there's an avalanche of babies if you have many wives.

I think I will do more betrothals & try to balance the ages of my wives in the future. Marrying wives at 40 also sounds like a great idea. It's just too much to have too many wives of child-bearing age all at the same time. There's always the Divorce option, especially with Lowborn, but even that seems somehow un-Islamic to me.

And, yes, the Fatimids are kind of dull, but let me tell the story first...

Having dealt with the elder brother, Emir al-Majid of Alexandria literally had nothing left to do. The younger brother had a weak Emirate, and all the newer brothers (due to the Caliph's wives) were too young to do any harm.

I was conscious to avoid the Kin-slayer trait, having had that numerous times as a Catholic ruler. My diplomacy was low enough as it was. *sigh* Ah, decadence. I could also use them to lower my decadence later, I think, so I didn't want to reap them all now when they were underage boys. Of course I was severely tempted to start killing off my young brothers to make it easier as Caliph, but I did not give in to the temptation. I enjoyed strong relations with the Caliph.

So... in the absence of an internal challenge to my rule as Emir, I decided to embrace the Events first.

Observing Ramadan was the first thing that I did after killing the elder brother. A pile of money goes out for Ramadan, a pile goes out for charity... it's just a gigantic money pit. *sigh* Finally, the final pile of money goes out for Eid al Fitr. As a non-Muslim in reality, I'm very happy to go celebrate Eid with my Muslim friends... but as a Muslim ruler in a video game, who tried to be very observant during Ramadan, THAT WAS A LOT OF MONEY. The biggest benefit to Ramadan was the way it brought my low level of Decadence to about 0%, but it took a lot of my wealth at the time. So, when you see the tooltip say how much it costs to observe Ramadan, the tooltip kind of lies.

Next, the Hajj. Again, with no challenge to my rule, I wanted to clear the Event reminder. I could afford the time on pilgrimage because nobody was trying to kill me. Everything was dandy, I picked up a number of permanent beneficial traits along the way, which was unexpected. This is probably one of the more powerfully beneficial events in the game that you can elect. The big downside... we dealt with some robbers along the way, and I got Wounded. Seriously?! I can imagine that robbers and Bedouins would plague rich pilgrims on Hajj, though, back in the day... so I get a bunch of scars with all my other traits that I picked up while on Hajj.

So... having Observed Ramadan, and gone on Hajj, I decided to conquer Sicily. I wanted my piece of Europe, and I had to set my own goals without any issues to deal with in my Emirate.

I had already Fabricated Claim to Kerkent (again, they are misguided Sunnis). They had just ended being a part of a war with one of the Doges of Italy, so they were weak... a laughably easy conquest, having almost died at the hands of my elder brother on the sands of Gizeh years before.

Next up, I had my eyes on Messina, a traditional gateway for the Crusaders in history. The Norman rulers in southern Italy had some internal conflicts, so I was in a perfect position to attack. I waited until I had a (fabricated) claim to Messina, though. I didn't want to roll it up into a Holy War that might drag more powerful neighbors into the fray.

I would say that the conquest of Messina was more difficult, but not really. The biggest thing that happened during that time was infighting amongst my wives. During this time, they were all trying to be the first wife... so I divorced and exiled one of my minor wives. When my first wife tried to assassinate one of my sons, I had her executed. And then, because I was an Emir, I had to get more wives all over again. *sigh* The challenges of an Islamic ruler are certainly different than the Catholic kings I've played as. I got myself a Catholic wife (a lowborn courtier of a Catholic ruler who didn't despise me) because I wanted to see what happens when I brought an infidel into my household.

At that point, with the Sheikhdom of Messina under my rule, I hit the limit for demesne. I had not parcelled out any Sheikhdoms because I had no Sheikhs to start the game! So there was no powerful sub-rulers to complain, "Demesne too big". All I saw were the hidden parts related to overly large demesnes... bands of smugglers, thieves, and other problems afflicting my provinces. I had no idea that the size of Demesne had an impact on the smugglers, thieves, and other problems! Alexandria rose up in revolt... and I realized I had a problem.

I quickly parceled out my territory to my sons (and realized what Agnatic Open actually means when the eldest was passed over for the second son).

And, just having wrapped up Messina, I get the message that the Pope calls for a Crusade to take Jerusalem. *sigh* Just when you think it's too quiet, you have a Crusade to deal with.

I sail my forces back from Sicily to the Levant, and I go about swatting smaller groups of Crusaders. It's primarily France, England, Scotland, and Ireland in this Crusade... I don't really spot the Kaiser's forces. So, with France landing piecemiel (they seem to lend the most on this one), the Caliph's armies make mincemeat of them.

As I march my army back to Alexandria to disband, and then reinforce the levies, the window that I didn't want to see came up... I am now Caliph.

The old Caliph died in battle to one of the Doges of Italy (may their diseased infidel ♥♥♥♥♥♥ give them a lifetime of genital discomfort!), and I immediately assumed the defense of the Caliphate. I had numerical superiority, and I was about at 90% win by the time the old Caliph died a martyr... so it was just a matter of grinding Frenchmen into the dust after that.

If anything, the Crusade came at a good time. With Europe drained of soldiers, I had time to consolidate my rule as Caliph. I didn't WANT to become Caliph, *sigh*, but that was simply the role I inherited.

Okay, TL:DR point, I think.

[boozermonkey]

And that in a nutshell sums up CK2! Best single player game I have played in a very long time!

[Nef]

Sounds like you're having fun! One thing regarding Ramadan - you actually don't get a Reminder for that, the events reminder you mentioned probably only referred to Hajj. The same ruler can repeat Ramadan every few years so it's worth considering if you have Decadence issues down the line!

Regarding Divorce being un-Islamic - I don't think it actually was/is. If anything, the Christians have a much bigger issue over Divorce, certainly in this period (remember Henry VIII of England! And he was 100 years after the end of CK2). As I understand it, women may have even had more right to divorce than men. You will probably get at least one event in this game from a wife demanding a divorce, and you can try and persuade her not to, but you can't actually stop it if she really wants to go. This also gives you a prestige hit. So it's worth keeping your wives happy if possible, though this can be expensive.

Also, any Muslim man can marry up to 4 wives. The 2, 3, or 4 wives thing refers to how many you are expected to have, not how many you *can* have.

[angel of derp]

So... Caliph al Mustansir, my character's father & former Caliph (now dead & martyred while fighting Crusaders in the Holy Land), was a busy man. He had another TEN children after the start of the game, in addition to the 3 sons who began the game (including my own character, the Emir al-Majid, now Caliph). Each of them had their own children as well.

One of my nephews, the Emir Ibrahim of Baghdad, thought it would be a good idea to usurp the Caliphate from under me... while, at the same time, one of my half-brothers began formulating his own rebellion.

So, the idiot Emir Ibrahim of Baghdad (may stinking vultures vomit worms upon his open wounds), peddles off two Sheikhdoms to the Seljuk Turks, drags the young and impressionable Emir Abdul-Jaq of Cairo into his nonsense, and launches his war against ME after I conclude the war against the Crusaders. The Turks, being friends of mine, do not intercede on his behalf... but neither do the Turks come to my aid later.

The war is long and pointless without the aid from the Turks for either side. And, to at to the futility, THE STUPID BOY DIES. Emir Ibrahim of Baghdad, being lowlier than a one-legged camel, DIES OF EXCESSIVE STRESS. He embroiled the Caliphate in a civil war... and was too weak to deal with stress?!!

So, while the idiot Emir of Baghdad was stressing himself out, the Sheikh Ghiyasaddin of Amman (my half-brother) decided it would be a good time to rebel. Well, his whole scheme depended on... something. Maybe the nephew not being a cowering maiden? I don't know. However, having only the reach of a Sheikh, Ghiyasaddin slightly overextended himself. Especially when the Emir of Baghdad failed and died.

So, while we can do stupid things as players, the computer also does dumb things to us in return. So we're even! I just wanted to vent my frustration at the worthlessness of the dogs yapping at my heels.

[Nef]

They're out to get you!

It's interesting to parrallel with my own current game, which is also Muslim - I started as Emir of Cyrenaica in 1189. By some weird twists of events in my case, though, Ilkahnate never converted to Islam (it normally does) and in fact remained Tengri until long after the Golden Horde showed up, which led to the horde moving south through Ilkahnate to find somewhere to conquer rather than heading west like it normally does, leading to a bizzare situation where a Catholic Golden Horde rules most of Arabia and the Middle East while an Orthodox(!) Ilkhanate holds the east side of the map, Shia Islam clinging on at the south of Arabia and me facing off against the might of Christian Asia, wondering how long I can hold Jerusalem for, as the Almohads collapse in Iberia and then Mauretania... while a Sunni Volga Bulgaria seems to be surrounded by Christians in the North!

I've not had the same troubles you've had internally, though - at least not so far! The Pope helped recently by declaring a Crusade and losing horribly, giving me lots of Piety and Prestige and wiping out all Decadence - thanks Pope!

Would be nice if you could upload some map screenshots so we can see the crazy world you've made :)

[angel of derp]

My world isn't so crazy. It's just the Fatimid infighting that's crazy. I have 3 of 5 provinces in Sicily, but I waited too long while helping my (mostly) allies, the Seljuk Turks. Now, the Kaiser has grown up, and he took the other parts of Sicily... so I'm debating starting a big war against the Kaiser with my Caliph around age 55 right now. I am getting kind of bored already with the Fatimids, so a catastrophic holy war sounds like fun.

In my last game, the Ilkhanate got MASSIVE and strong. The Golden Horde ran into stiff opposition in Rus & Sweden, and so the Horde got sucked north into Scandinavia while I was ruling England. The Horde ended up with Norway, parts of Sweden, and then (strangely) they went over the sea to Iceland, the Orkneys, etc, and ended up threatening Scotland. From a northern, seaward invasion.

[angel of derp]

So, in the absence of a decision to attack the Holy Roman Empire or Byzantium, the Caliph al-Majid set forth to consolidate the realm... attacking the Ethopians, dealing with problem Emirs, and so on.

I was totally surprised at how a Caliph can handle Emirs. You can just strip them of the Emir title, with a relationship hit & a 5% chance of revolt. There's no Caliphate-wide vassal relationship issue for a Caliph, unlike a Catholic King! So when problem Emirs popped up, I could just revoke! Revoke title, award title to a more loyal Sheikh. This cured ALL SORTS of faction issues without a single plot, assassination, or war. I just rearranged the Emirates to ensure loyalty to the Caliph al-Majid.

There was literally no conflict at the time due to aggressive handling of Emirs, so that's when I attacked southward.

During the second campaign against the Ethiopians/Axum, however, my heir (the Emir Kamaladdin of Sicily) died of natural causes at the young age of 41. This left his 14-year old son, Prince Sha'ban, as the heir to the Caliphate! MAJOR ISSUES. How would an underage child run a Caliphate?

However, with all of Caliph al-Majid's other sons either well over 40 years old or well underage, Prince Sha'ban was closest to maturity & did not have the burden of an extensive number of wives/children to dael with.

And, at the conclusion of the second campaign against Axum, the Caliph al-Majid died a natural death at the age of 70.

At that point, all hell was about to break loose. The young Caliph Sha'ban had too many demesnes, having all of Sicily from his father as well as Alexandria & Cairo from the old Caliph. With all manner of uncles and kinsmen having Emirates throughout the Caliphate, that led to multiple Emirates on the edge of rebellion.

Caliph Sha'ban parcelled out minor holdings... Mosques, conquered parts of Ethiopia/Axum. He also immediately set a betrothal to the youngest wife of the former Caliph for the illusion of dynastic succession... which seems to prevent other betrothals at this time, unfortunately.

Oh well. On to the game...

[angel of derp]

First issue... Emir Walid II of the Shams Emirate. He is a member of several factions against my rule. And the Shams Emirate is practically my backyard, sandwiched between Alexandria and Cairo. I MUST deal with this Emir before tackling the rest of the realm.

However, upon trying to Revoke, I get a rebellion instead. So, immediately, the Caliph Sha'ban has to switch to a war footing. Half of the armies are still returning from Ethiopia, which makes this even more of a problem.

As I begin to crush Emir Walid II's forces, the Sheikh of Gizeh, my cousin Ahmad, also rises up in his bid for the rulership of the entire Caliphate. However, at the same time, ALL the other rebellious Emirs rise up and demand Independence.

At this point, I had at least 3 Emirs demanding independence, Emir Walid II of Shams in open rebellion, and Sheikh Ahmad of Gizeh trying to rally the Emirs to his banner for a succession war.

In this case, I opted to allow the Independence group to have their way. A massive, multi-front war was not a good option. If one of the succession factions had rose up first, to press another claim to the Caliphate, I probably would have tried to surrender the Caliphate and return to life as a simple Emir... but the Independence faction stepped up first, and I gave in to their demands. Was this good or bad? I'm not sure.

In any case, the previously antagonistic Independence movement Emirs suddenly had very favorable opinions of Caliph Sha'ban. I called a number of them into the conflicts in Egypt on my side.

Anyway, back to the game. Too much to do when a kingdom changes hands... *sigh*

[angel of derp]

Haha... wives. So, with the wars against Emir Walid II of Shams and Sheikh Ahmad of Gizeh entering the end phase, I also attempted to settle domestic issues.

Caliph Sha'ban took the youngest wife (age 26) of the former Caliph as a wife. Next, I engineered a betrothal to one of my cousins (the daughter of a loyal Emir)... which didn't count as a marriage for Prestige purposes! *Grrrr*. That's an automatic Prestige hit right there.

So, I looked for adult daughters of nearby stronger countries... and there were none worth marrying. *Grrrr*.

So, I looked for an older adult female so that she wouldn't be in reproductive mode forever, unlike younger brides. That was an easy condition to fulfil.

Last, I looked for an infidel just because... and, somehow, I was able to arrange a marriage to Oda, the eldest daughter of King Boleslav of Bohemia! I don't quite understand that one. I think she was a courtier somewhere other than Bohemia, so that made it easier to arrange the marriage. Maybe my heir will have a claim to Bohemia!

[angel of derp]

After some crashing & general issues, which seem to be sorted out, it's now anno Domini 1137.

Caliph Sha'ban died at the age of 25, and reigned only briefly after fragmenting the Caliphate. He was ill, and died due to an unknown sickness. I was in the midst of arranging the succession of the Caliphate, and ended up even more messed up.

Caliph Kermaladdin succeeded Sha'ban, and became Caliph at 4 years of age (!). His mother was a lowborn courtier, not the son of Oda (the daughter of the King of Bohemia)... which was unfortunate, but it's not as if I had a shot at taking over Bohemia. So, whatever.

Of course, being age 4 as a ruler has certain complications. All the pretenders are gunning for you even harder, and your options (especially towards heirs) seem a bit more limited. Kermaladdin's elder brothers were still underage, though, so that made them less likely to kill off the young Caliph right away. Other pretender cousins/uncles did pop up, but I managed to handle those factions fairly easily. Simply revoking Emirs was effective in redistributing Emirates to more loyal subjects, thus defusing all of the succession issues.

The biggest problem during the years of Kermaladdin's reign (to date)... the Second Crusade for Jerusalem! With the Fatimids relatively at peace, and no internal struggles despite the young age of the Caliph, Pope Silverius II announced the crusade.

I was concerned about the division of the Caliphate under Sha'ban, and how I would be able to defend against the armies of Christendom with a smaller number of vassals. In spite of that, due to having built up good relations with my neighbors as much as possible, I had strong support amongst neighboring Emirs who were not my vassals. I also hired an Islamic mercenary outfit to aid in the defense of the Holy Land.

It was just a slugfest, and any numerical superiority of the Catholics was reduced due to the distance & their tendency to land scattered armies... while my forces were containd to two large stacks. Of all the battles in the Holy Land, the Muslim armies lost only 2... and won dozens of significant battles in return.

Now, at age 13, having defeated the Infidels in the defense of the Holy Land, dealt with several pretenders to the Caliphate, Caliph Kermaladdin has finally gotten a bit of job security after starting his reign at an extremely uncertain time.