NOT EVEN A GOD CAN KILL THE CALIPHATE

[CrossLegLuke]

I feel certain this is a recurring topic both here and on the games actual forums, but I just felt I should make a new discussion to bring to light the severity of this issue.

Ahem...

Playing a game as a duke of Georgia (First time admittedly leaving Western Europe for a game) I started at the old Gods start. Very interesting things happened, I ended up King of Alania when the Muslims invaded Georgia. (I declared independence when it was clear the king was losing. and managed to hold on to the Georgian Coast. after about a Decade A joint effort of Alanian, Georgian, and Byzantine troops set about a reconquista of Kartli and Dergbent. We Won!

But the Byzantines suffered for it. In their weakened state the Abassids steamrolled their way into Anatolia. Georgian-Alan troops marched to their aid, but defeat was inevitable and as soon as we crossed the border we turned around and went home.

I thought the Catholics would save us when they called for the Crusades... But... they chose to invade Hungary for some reason as opposed to the Abassids.

got me thinking that I have never seen the Abbassids split up, or even have any major internal strife. so I set about making it on my own.


Using console commands I spent an hour and a half of my life killing, converting, and just screwing with Muslim Society. Including making all independent Muslims ♥♥♥♥♥♥.

I killed the entire Abassid Family, Converted all vassals to geographically appropriate religions other than Sunni, ensured a Hashamid child was Caliphate... everyone was negative opinion.

Come back 3 months later? EVERYONE IS POSITVE OPINION. THere was no civil-war, not even a Crown law revolution. I even killed the Caliph again, quickly saved the game Swore fealty to the Caliph only to realize theres an independence faction sitting there with 300% power. fast fowarded 2 years and it fell to 104% and still never fired off.

Not even the power of a Console God can destabilize muslim Empires...

What is this pixie-a$$ bull-♥♥♥♥♥♥?

[Jirki88]

Yeah, these muslim empires are a bit too stable. They never actually split up from what I've seen - occasionally they have a decadence revolt that wins, or a revolt that wins, but they're always the kind that will just put a new dynasty on the throne.

[Aristocats]

In the majority of my games the Abbasids start to facture around the 950s. Admittedly they usually remain the most powerful Empire in the game albeit with the odd occasion when the Byzantines overtake them in terms of unit count.

If you manage to keep them and the Umayadds contained in the first 100 years or so eventually they will tumble to internal rebellions and decadance revolts. It varys game to game though. You just have to hope they are not too agressive early on.

Also has anyone actually seen a successful Shia revolt? I always get the notifications but I never see them do any damage.

[Jonocat25]

Use console command to make every charecter in the Caliphate a Jain. I doubt they'll expand then.

[himax]

Increased stability:
+3 Demesne limit
+30 vassal opinion
No short reign penalty
Ability to designate primary heir from among one's children
Reduced revolt risk

Expectation of non-violence:
No Holy War CB
No tiger hunts
No hunting focus
Purity (piety) lost when taking certain event choices
Monthly purity gain while at peace

Two sects:
Digambara jain.png Digambara gives +1 Health.
Svetambara jain.png Svetambara gives a further +5 vassal opinion.


They won't expand but they won't collapse either.

[Taiwan Number One]

Paradox is horrible at balancing anything. To be fair, it isn't as bad on patch 1.11 where decadence actually works though rolling back that far is ridiculous.

[Zednaught]

In my last game, I observed 100+ years of Muslims empires battling each other at nearly perpetual negative cash. Despite almost never going positive, and sometimes going as low as -1000 gold, they always had massive mercenary armies who'd never desert. Once, after I'd looked away, one empire had shot up to positive 6000 gold in the space of a year. There's no way I can figure out how an empire that small did that.

[Thundercracker]

Originally posted by Zednaught:

In my last game, I observed 100+ years of Muslims empires battling each other at nearly perpetual negative cash. Despite almost never going positive, and sometimes going as low as -1000 gold, they always had massive mercenary armies who'd never desert. Once, after I'd looked away, one empire had shot up to positive 6000 gold in the space of a year. There's no way I can figure out how an empire that small did that.

they probably have the mamluks as a vassal.

also, muslems make a ton of cash. with low decadance, and a lot of counties of foreign religion, you are almost earning as much as a republic.

there's also money eventually going to the ruler. might be very broken right now
due to baronies never building.

[Cheese]

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=380179657

[Reverend Belial]

So far the only thing I've ever seen destabilize/destroy the Abbasid Caliphate is the Idrisid Caliphate. And only once. Every other time they've eaten everything south and east of the Byzantines.

[matsu]

Odd, I didnt have a whole lot of problems. I guess you could try and wait it out and perhaps it'll start to crack down, I've seen that happen before.
http://cloud-4.steamusercontent.com/ugc/530632767057471201/7A2CA88A7140676DE230275A13D8D1AF1560BA72/

[Metamucil Monk]

Originally posted by cw380:

Also has anyone actually seen a successful Shia revolt? I always get the notifications but I never see them do any damage.

I've seen several playing as the Byzantines. But they usually do something stupid right after they successfully revolt, like declare a Jihad against me...which ends in miserable failure for them, followed by them immediately being eaten by the Abbassids again while in their weakened state.

I just played a 1337 start as the Byzantines. The Egyptians collapsed the last 30 years, but the Ilkhanate never collapsed or lost any territory, regardless of 1 decadence revolt after another as soon as the previous ended, 5 times in a row. Fortunately neither Mongol power and I came to blows, which was kind of nice.

I played a Latin Empire start for a little bit before this, and the Seljuks had the entire eastern side of the map from Persia to Outer Mongolia within 125-150 years. They weren't intollerable, but it was pretty annoying.

[Qwar]

The break and revolt against eachother just fine in the iberian peninsule, allowing to actually conduct a reconquista just like it did in reality.

[One Mad Bastard]

Stopped reading at '' used the console commands''....

Seriosuly noobs get good...

[biochimera]

Playing my first catholic game, started off as duke of Franconia, consolidated it under my control, then went and took over Bavaria and Saxony so I could get independent from the Karlings, which for whatever reason (maybe they start off as?) were cathar, and hated me. Hell, my first duke even got assassinated about 10 years after start. Anyway, now around 930AD, and wow. The Umayyads are chewing through France, and have 150% of the troops I have. The Abbasids, 300%. I basically have all of Germania, Denmark and the Netherlands under my control. The decadence score for both? 0%. No likelihood of rising either. The Abbasids have obliterated the Byzantines, and are probably eyeing off Italy next. Hate to say it, but can't see catholicism performing well this game, really missing the slavic bonuses right about now. To be honest, I think I've only ever seen the Abbasids implode spectacularly once, the Umayyads tend to be more fragile but easily less than 50%, and recently I always just have to take care of them the old fashioned way.

[CrossLegLuke]

Originally posted by ♆♕420neMLGBastard♕♆:

Stopped reading at '' used the console commands''....

Seriosuly noobs get good...

I only used the console to see if it was even possible to break them up. Which aperently in this game-- it is not.