Recommendations for a player without DLCs?

[El viejo de la bolsa]

[galadon3]

get DLCs^^

Well not necessarily the game is fine without em too, but in earnest, you might wanna be a bit more specific on what you need recommendations for exactly
- Wich DLCs to get?
- Where to start in the game?
- Starting tips for the game?
- other stuff?

[Alex]

Without the DLC, this game is little more than a demo, to be honest. So the recommendation is to get them, preferably on sale, those prices (for a 10 years old game!) are ridiculous.

[shiggies713]

you don't need them all, some of them like iirc sunset invasion is actually pretty stupid and most people leave it off. I only have all of them up until Way of Life excluding the sunset invasion one and its pretty good. I hear people complaining about religion being completely screwed up one way or the other with holy fury so I haven't been too keen to pick up more dlc since playing again.

[Chill°bucket]

Would be helpful to understand what you mean. a bit more input?

is this a question for
-recommendations of most important DLC's?
-recommendation how and where to start?
-recommendation of a special land to start?
..... ???

This game is NOT a Demo without DLC's. It is good playable. But you have some limitations like you can't play muslim factions, don't have some important nice roleplay functions like "Way of life" DLC give and don't have the more detailed law and court management of "Conclave" DLC.

[steve]

I agree with the comments that the game is perfectly playable without DLCs. It's probably easier to learn without all those extra mechanics (people always say that Victoria has a steep learning curve, but I think this is far steeper).

If the question is where to start, the tutorial will teach you the interface, but the best place for a new player to start is Ireland in 1066 (the Count of Mumu seems to be the most popular recommendation). You've got a couple of centuries to unify Ireland before you have to deal any major powers trying to invade you. I would strongly suggest turning off defensive pacts and shattered retreat, and not playing in Ironman mode. This will make the game easier and the learning process much, much less frustrating.

If the question is about DLCs, then you can pay for a month's subscription to test all of them out. But here's a brief summary of what they actually do to gameplay:

Mostly affect particular areas/religions

Sword of Islam, The Republic, and Rajas of India do very little beyond unlocking certain religions/government types. Sons of Abraham adds a whole load of features for Christians and Muslims (and makes Jews playable).

Charlemagne and The Old Gods add earlier starting dates. The Old Gods also makes pagans playable, boosts rebels, and adds the threat of landless adventurers trying to steal your land. Charlemagne's most obvious other feature is custom kingdom and empire titles.

Horse Lords adds the silk road and turns the Steppe tribes into nomads, who have their own set of mechanics.

Jade Dragon enables interaction with China and also adds the silk road. The effects will filter into areas a long way from China, as Chinese artifacts do eventually end up in the hands of characters nowhere near China

Sunset Invasion adds a massive Aztec invasion on the west of the map. It's only worth getting, if you want to add extra challenge to the game, you want to get all of the achievements, or if you want to take advantage of the way it changes the Americas if you convert your game to EU4 (if you get that DLC).

Ruler Designer allows you to customise your initial character.

Have major effects wherever/whoever you play as

Legacy of Rome adds retinues (standing armies). Almost everybody plays with this one on.

Way of Life adds focuses (a fun way to develop your characters). Almost everybody plays with this one on.

The Reaper's Due adds a lot of depth to the disease system, and balances it out with the prosperity mechanic. It also makes it possible (though difficult) for your character to become immortal. I would highly recommend it.

Conclave is controversial. It radically changes the education system and the way your realm's laws work. Some people love it, others hate it, quite a few like some of the changes but not others.

Monks and Mystics adds a range of new mechanics. There are new ways to get artifacts, and a whole range of new societies. There's lots of good content, but it adds an extra hurdle to learning the game.

Holy Fury adds half a dozen new mechanics, to the point that it's practically a whole new game. It's generally good, but because it adds so much to an already complex game I'd strongly recommend mastering the basics before you play with it.

[Alex]

Originally posted by RAY°451°:

This game is NOT a Demo without DLC's.

Fine, call it a teaser, then. Paradox really likes to milk the players with this ridiculous DLC model, even the portraits and unit models are still separate!

As to the DLCs themselves, I would recommend against using the Conclave for the first few playthroughs, the council mechanics in particualr can be really complicated.

[Blade]

1) Play Tutorial (it lets you play one of the rulers in Spain);
2) Play as a ruler in "Newbie Island" (Ireland, that is);
3) Enjoy the game (both in the Ironman and custom mode, especially the former if you're looking for a challenge and the achievements);
4) Start getting the DLCs you prefer according to the content you wish to play (Examples: want to play as a Muslim character? Get the Sword of Islam DLC; or do you want to play at an earlier starting date than the regular one, 1066? Then buy Charlemagne and/or The Old Gods). Particularly recommended on sale.

Originally posted by Alex:

Originally posted by RAY°451°:

This game is NOT a Demo without DLC's.

Fine, call it a teaser, then. Paradox really likes to milk the players with this ridiculous DLC model, even the portraits and unit models are still separate!

Completely agree. All of that cosmetic sh*te could be (have been, tbh) easily added in free patches and/or on the other expansion contents. But no, they thought otherwise (money-grabbing at the maximum level....).

[Chill°bucket]

I agree that Paradox milks people with DLC's like crazy.
I disagree to call this game without DLC's a Teaser or Demo.
I agree that if you played it without DLC's and like it it is very likely you buy DLC's.
I disagree that you need cosmetics.
I agree that some DLC's are a musthave if you like the game.
I agree that Paradox milks every cent out of people ;)

Buy DLC's only in special offers from HumbleBundle, Fanatical, HRK game, Greengame, or in special sales from Paradox or Steam as bundles. You pay 1/10 of the off. prices. The only way to buy Paradox games.

For example you get at the moment the complete!! surviving mars with all DLC's (published from Paradox ofc.) for 8,75€ from Humblebundle! Just keep your eyes open and don't pay the official prices. Paradox milks like crazy, so be clever.

[LSD]

Originally posted by Alex:

Originally posted by RAY°451°:

This game is NOT a Demo without DLC's.

Fine, call it a teaser, then. Paradox really likes to milk the players with this ridiculous DLC model, even the portraits and unit models are still separate!

As to the DLCs themselves, I would recommend against using the Conclave for the first few playthroughs, the council mechanics in particualr can be really complicated.

Their DLC model and pricing is obscenely greedy, and the total lack of character portraits in the base game is hilariously awful...but CK2 is the most complete PDX game they've put out. If anything, no-dlc is much closer to a strategy game than the weird anime sim we have with all dlc.

[Alex]

Given how the game is now 10 years old, the prices are still ridiculously high. Things like the ruler designer and the graphics should've been integrated into the base game long ago.

Unfortunately, some of the DLCs are pretty much must-have, otherwise the game lacks depth and complexity. For a new player, I'd recommend Reaper's due and Horselords (even though not for actually playing the nomads, just to have them). Then you can try out Legacy of Rome for the retinues, afterwards move onto the Conclave for the council mechanics. The other DLCs can be added later if you want to experience their content.

[Donathan Cheadledge]

Originally posted by shiggies713:

you don't need them all, some of them like iirc sunset invasion is actually pretty stupid and most people leave it off. I only have all of them up until Way of Life excluding the sunset invasion one and its pretty good. I hear people complaining about religion being completely screwed up one way or the other with holy fury so I haven't been too keen to pick up more dlc since playing again.

The big complaint about holy fury at the time was religious cults - a gamerule was added to turn them off and the dlc is now strictly pogged.

[LSD]

Originally posted by Donathan Cheadledge:

Originally posted by shiggies713:

you don't need them all, some of them like iirc sunset invasion is actually pretty stupid and most people leave it off. I only have all of them up until Way of Life excluding the sunset invasion one and its pretty good. I hear people complaining about religion being completely screwed up one way or the other with holy fury so I haven't been too keen to pick up more dlc since playing again.

The big complaint about holy fury at the time was religious cults - a gamerule was added to turn them off and the dlc is now strictly pogged.

Aren't cults Monks and Mystics?
The big issue with Holy Fury is that it's so hilariously imbalanced. Warrior Lodges, huge money from doing nothing in crusades, stuff like that. Totally destroyed what little remained of game balance.

[Lisato]

Just use the subscription

[Alex]

Originally posted by Lisato:

Just use the subscription

Such an outrageous scheme shouldn't be encouraged at all, so better not. Steam has a refund system, use that instead.

[Lisato]

Originally posted by Alex:

Originally posted by Lisato:

Just use the subscription

Such an outrageous scheme shouldn't be encouraged at all, so better not. Steam has a refund system, use that instead.

Outrageous scheme? The game is super old, has a lot of expensive dlcs and the best option right now is to use the subscription. It's way cheaper than buying all dlcs and you can stop whenever you want. It was an amazing idea from Paradox to add it.