Is there a point to the Charlemagne start

[Fritz Bittenfeld]

Play as Charlemage, can't make Francia without cheesing it because of RNG related to piety and all the events that make you lose it, you make Francia, you lose it by making the HRE. Win the Saxon Wars With mercs because you can hardly raise any number of vassal levies and they have more from tribal vassals, then be depleted when Windukind's 12k gamers rise up, lose more piety and prestige.

Seriously is there any point to trying to ironman this as him or what?

[kazaddum]

Originally posted by WOWDoT.PLPAmazong:

Play as Charlemage, can't make Francia without cheesing it because of RNG related to piety and all the events that make you lose it, you make Francia, you lose it by making the HRE. Win the Saxon Wars With mercs because you can hardly raise any number of vassal levies and they have more from tribal vassals, then be depleted when Windukind's 12k gamers rise up, lose more piety and prestige.

Seriously is there any point to trying to ironman this as him or what?

The saxons have tribal troops - light infantry and archers, some heavy infantry.
You have feudal ones - Heavy infantry, cavalary, archers, some pikemen and light infantry.

If you manage to lose, you're seriously gifted.

The only weird thing is that you can not sell pagans into slavery, that was Karls mayor source of income.

[Fritz Bittenfeld]

Originally posted by kazaddum:

Originally posted by WOWDoT.PLPAmazong:

Play as Charlemage, can't make Francia without cheesing it because of RNG related to piety and all the events that make you lose it, you make Francia, you lose it by making the HRE. Win the Saxon Wars With mercs because you can hardly raise any number of vassal levies and they have more from tribal vassals, then be depleted when Windukind's 12k gamers rise up, lose more piety and prestige.

Seriously is there any point to trying to ironman this as him or what?

The saxons have tribal troops - light infantry and archers, some heavy infantry.
You have feudal ones - Heavy infantry, cavalary, archers, some pikemen and light infantry.

If you manage to lose, you're seriously gifted.

The only weird thing is that you can not sell pagans into slavery, that was Karls mayor source of income.

I had 2.3k during the first war, they miraculously stayed in a stack giving them a good 7k. I don't care how much RNG is in ocmbat, no way 2.3 k win against 7k. Almost immediatley after Windukind rose up and I had 800men available. It should be noted I was trying to cheese this run and save on piety (IE not lose 100 to divorcing that Lombard) so I did not hold Italy (Not like that would help because f that foreign conquerer malus) and my vassals mostly didn't mind me. Probably 30-70 of the duchies in both Frankish realms were made to save on cash and crown authority for both realms was the second option.

[eastcoastceo]

If you have the Monks & Mystics and the Way of Life DLC, you can have Charlemagne join one of the monastic societies, and take the Theology Focus to get the piety.

When I did that, I didn't have to wait too long after finishing all the necessary wars before I had enough piety to create the Empire of Francia. I was able to do that two different times to get the various Charlemagne achievements, and I even formed Francia once as Karloman just to get that achievement too, and am I not a great CK2 player.

Check out the below guide which I found very helpful, as you need to assassinate a duke or two and transfer 10+ count vassals to make your dukes more friendly:

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=901795650&searchtext=holy+roman

[werdry]

You cant just go there and conquer Saxony. Viking powah 4eva :)

[Fritz Bittenfeld]

Originally posted by eastcoastceo:

If you have the Monks & Mystics and the Way of Life DLC, you can have Charlemagne join one of the monastic societies, and take the Theology Focus to get the piety.

When I did that, I didn't have to wait too long after finishing all the necessary wars before I had enough piety to create the Empire of Francia. I was able to do that two different times to get the various Charlemagne achievements, and I even formed Francia once as Karloman just to get that achievement too, and am I not a great CK2 player.

Check out the below guide which I found very helpful, as you need to assassinate a duke or two and more around some count vassals to make your dukes more friendly:

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=901795650&searchtext=holy+roman

Problem is (atleast since the HF update) when you make the HREall other king/empire titles are destroyed and the HRE is the only title higher than duchy. Ended up testing a run on non-ironman after the series of bad starts and terrible luck (Charles mom dying of flu canceling the events and having no vassal levies somehow) to test it. Made Francia after uniting the realms, got the reichskrone for doing that somehow, then the HRE when I conquered Italy.

Much to my shock (Havng thought that I would get a second eichskrone and still keep Francia since HRE sis always elective now) Francia is destroyed similar to how you can make Leon out of Asturias.

[Soulbourne of the Midlands]

Been a bit, but last time I found my biggest killer during the wars was vassal limit-going over reduces tax income and levy size, and with all the kingdoms you conquer in fairly short succession, especially with most duchies unformed and a lot of count level vassals, you tend to go way over unless you devote a lot of money towards realm management. Conclave helps some by boosting vassal limits a bit if you fully empower council, since that decentralizes the realm into a true historic fuedal society, but generally it's a touch start to manage.

However, generally you probably dont want two empire tier titles anyways because gavelkind is a pain then :P

[Fritz Bittenfeld]

Originally posted by Soulbourne of the Midlands:

Been a bit, but last time I found my biggest killer during the wars was vassal limit-going over reduces tax income and levy size, and with all the kingdoms you conquer in fairly short succession, especially with most duchies unformed and a lot of count level vassals, you tend to go way over unless you devote a lot of money towards realm management. Conclave helps some by boosting vassal limits a bit if you fully empower council, since that decentralizes the realm into a true historic fuedal society, but generally it's a touch start to manage.

However, generally you probably dont want two empire tier titles anyways because gavelkind is a pain then :P

Yeah but if I want that start I certainly want both Francia and the HRE (Which defauts to elective unless from what I can surmise very late game with getting crown authority up). If I pick that start date I might try another Germanic run or go to that Jewish Black Guy

[Sonic Titan]

The start is fine, CK2 has some rng and yeah a stack of mostly light infantry will get decimated by heavies or pikeman, even at a qtr of the size.

[g0r3yl0v3rz]

Starting as Charlemagne requires a bit of timing. You cant rush every event just because you feel powerful. After taking over your brothers land, consolidate. Then attack your first claim, Lombardy/Bavaria or Saxony.

Key is to consolidate and stabilize your empire before making another big move.

Trading Francia for HRE is optional. But why would you be upset that you have to trade 1 empire title for another? Whats the point in having 2 empire titles?

[werdry]

Originally posted by Ismelly?!?:

Trading Francia for HRE is optional. But why would you be upset that you have to trade 1 empire title for another? Whats the point in having 2 empire titles?

+10cm to реnis gauge, more prestige for dynasty and some troubles...

[Fritz Bittenfeld]

Originally posted by Ismelly?!?:

Starting as Charlemagne requires a bit of timing. You cant rush every event just because you feel powerful. After taking over your brothers land, consolidate. Then attack your first claim, Lombardy/Bavaria or Saxony.

Key is to consolidate and stabilize your empire before making another big move.

Trading Francia for HRE is optional. But why would you be upset that you have to trade 1 empire title for another? Whats the point in having 2 empire titles?

Saxon War is either say no and lose massive amounts of piety and prestige, all others are bide your time ones. Kind of sucks because otherwise I wouldn't have so much trouble consolidating before the Saxon Wars pop up.

Originally posted by werdry:

Originally posted by Ismelly?!?:

Trading Francia for HRE is optional. But why would you be upset that you have to trade 1 empire title for another? Whats the point in having 2 empire titles?

+10cm to реnis gauge, more prestige for dynasty and some troubles...

This. Especially since white people have small penises, having more empires helps a lot.