Conclave, Can someone help me understand it?

[JC]

I picked it up a while back, but havent spent much time playing since then so it's kinda new to me. I have close to 1k hours into the game so i get it, but this expansion has me lost.


For one, the only play through with it i have been doing is starting as a count in picland. It So far as a member i see very litttle use with it outside of getting spammed for favors. I don't know what i am voting for, or why i need to change my voting focus.

Every now and again it asks me about if i wanna change a law, but that seams like about it. If i have taken a favor that doesn't even happen.


So what is the deal with being a member? How can i use the conclave to help me, or help/hurt the dutchy/kingdom/empire i am part of?


So far it seams like a way to make the game much easier for the king, other than that i don't really see much helpful with it. (new education system is different but i don't know if i like it better or worse)

Can anyone help me understand this expansion and the ins/outs with it?

[local gay cryptid]

Check your liege's laws--or your own council laws if you are not a vassal. Under the council tab, there are various laws that can be passed to give or retract the council's power. Votes on these I believe can only be called in via favor; however, councillors tend to enjoy starting factions to increase council power.

[JC]

yea, that was what i was trying to do, Start a faction to rise up against my Leige.. or just make him more miserable as he was plotting against me.

[Admiral Obvious]

Conclave means, you, as a councilor have a say in every thing your liege tries to push through, unless they manage to abolish council voting rights.

Accepting a favor in lieu of your vote on a council will put you in line with the AI you signed up for the favor with. Usually malcontents will ask for it to block everything the liege tries to do, but sometimes other councilors will ask you for favors too. Your liege might ask you for one to push laws through as well, and those generally get the most useful favors.

Favors are extremely powerful if used well. From arranging a marriage with a characters second born through a favor (ex, the count of Paris can use a favor on Karloman to snag a marriage with his second born child, and kill the firstborn to inherit the empire).
You can also use favors to get out of a criminal conviction, assuming you haven't been imprisoned first.
There are a variety of other things you can use them for, but those are the most common, and powerful uses.

[JC]

Well i am confused with how all the mechanics work..

say i wanted to make a marriage like you said.. How would i get the favor, and then how do i collect it?

Or there are war favors right? How would i make the king not call for peace? OR how would i get them to call peace in my favor?



It never seams like i am voting on things either.. or have much effect.. I must be missing aspects of how all this works

[Admiral Obvious]

Originally posted by JC:

Well i am confused with how all the mechanics work..

say i wanted to make a marriage like you said.. How would i get the favor, and then how do i collect it?

Or there are war favors right? How would i make the king not call for peace? OR how would i get them to call peace in my favor?



It never seams like i am voting on things either.. or have much effect.. I must be missing aspects of how all this works

There are two easy ways to gain favors.

Pay money to the target using the "buy favor" action, and you get a favor. The second way is accepting council support, which will prevent you from having a mind of your own on council LAW decisions.

Generally, the game won't ask you to vote on EVERY LITTLE THING the liege want a you to do, but it will make you vote for or against law changes. In the case of "smaller" stuff, you're assigned a "stance" just like the AI would be when the liege consideres something you'd have to vote on through the council LAW.

When actually USING the favors, most diplomacy dialogs will have a "recycling" button in the bottom left corner of the dialog. Hitting that button would force them to accept to pay off the favor once you send the offer.

[JC]

ok..

So as far as stances go, it seams like that one is the one i am asked about most often. How does a count use them in their favor?

I also must be missing that law tab too, that might explain more. (can you post a screenie by chance?)

[Admiral Obvious]

Originally posted by JC:

ok..

So as far as stances go, it seams like that one is the one i am asked about most often. How does a count use them in their favor?

I also must be missing that law tab too, that might explain more. (can you post a screenie by chance?)

I'll post what I mean as soon as I can.

Look at your council for example, and see what type of councilors they are Loyalist, Malcontent, Pragmatist, Glory Hound, Zealot? You are assigned one of those types of councilor, which you can't change, because reasons.

Laws usually need to be voted on by the council, unless there is no tribal organization, which might be the case for you in Scotland.

[JC]

ok, that makes sense then.. Perhaps why i am not seeing much in the way of council, is the tribal thing.


On a side note, i could swear i can swap my stance.. like glory hound and such.. you just can't do it often. Maybe it is a tribal thing?

[Admiral Obvious]

https://ck2.paradoxwikis.com/Council_vote#Stances

This explains what I was trying to say better.

[JC]

ok that helped a bit.


So as a Count, what can i do as a member to help things, or hurt them, or make them better in my favor?

Is it worth not doing something to collect a favor? Should i try to collect lots of favors? I'm guessing times i wouldn't want to right?


It is definatly a new aspect, and it just feels like all i do is get asked to do something for a favor lol at one time i had like 5, and no clue where to go with it

[Admiral Obvious]

Originally posted by JC:

ok that helped a bit.


So as a Count, what can i do as a member to help things, or hurt them, or make them better in my favor?

Is it worth not doing something to collect a favor? Should i try to collect lots of favors? I'm guessing times i wouldn't want to right?


It is definatly a new aspect, and it just feels like all i do is get asked to do something for a favor lol at one time i had like 5, and no clue where to go with it

Depends on how you want to play, and how you think your liege would affect laws which may help or harm you.

For example, a common one would be voting on wether or not title revocation is allowed. If you know your liege despises you, you want to buy up favors with the council to force them to vote with you to reject the proposal. Generally councilors would vote no on that regardless, and the liege usually needs to spend favors to pass it anyways, unless the council is more than half loyal.

Also, if you can get a favor over your liege, and you aren't on the council, you can force yourself onto the council onto a position of your choice, including spymaster if you wanted.

You want favors with people who can help you, not necessarily everyone you can get them from.

[JC]

ok, that was helpful :)


So it's better to be on the council then i gather.. But what about being apointed commander? I have not done so because i don't wanna die in battle lol.

[Admiral Obvious]

Originally posted by JC:

ok, that was helpful :)


So it's better to be on the council then i gather.. But what about being apointed commander? I have not done so because i don't wanna die in battle lol.

Good call. No, being a commander is usually bad for your health, unless you have a notably high personal combat skill and a pretty good martial skill.

If you aren't in your own wars however, there can be some positive, and a few rare negative events associated with commanding an army.

[JC]

well i've had some really good leaders.. like 20+ martial and a bunch of good fighting traits.. basically a leader to drool over.. But i hate even leading my own wars.. i swear i die more often than not..

I guess i'll try it someday, but not when i am really in with making moves. for instance in this play, i am on the council, and a great warrior, but i've been trying for 15+ years to get my last claim i need to become a duke which will be a war to do so.. can't have this guy dying on me.

I don't even wanna be his martial because he has no one else good :P I've turned it down many times, though i am his diplomate

[JC]

ok here is another thing that confuses me. Some random member will say, Hey vote with me and I'll owe you a favor. But i can't find what i'm actually agreeing to. How do i see what they are asking me to support?