Killmonger Needs to be Nerfed.

[jamezilla]

Killmonger's on reveal needs to be switched to destroying all 1 cost cards AT HIS LOCATION, only. As it stands right now, he's cheap, overpowered garbage.

[Cursed Life]

Ahahahahaha

[laveley]

Yeah, and than 1 cost power cards would dominate. Killmonger is the healthier tech card for the game. Absolutely necessary.

[ShaneCamp]

If you're a zoo deck in pool 1-2 try to hide big power 1 costs behind armor or don't play them out until turn 6 that way you probably don't have priority if you're that scared of a singular card. If you're higher than that learn how to play the game better.

[aegis3d]

It really depends on what rank you're talking about. He makes sense against some of the much more powerful cards in the higher ranks. In lower ranks, and really probably up to close to 1500-2000 CL he's ridiculously powerful in changing an entire game compared to everything else below 4 power, even against non-zoo decks. There's quite a range of CL where people simply don't bother playing 1 power cards because he's so frequent, and even zoo decks at that level don't make sense. Even in the later levels. He's the main reason why probably 75% of energy 1 cards are never used once he's available. Unless it's filler junk used for abilities like Korg or Iceman, or a few of the extremely powerful single ones that can be defended because there's only one, he basically single-handedly obsoletes probably a dozen cards and most people's first turn altogether.

So I empathize with the OP. It's a really hard problem to fix. He's needed in the later meta-game, but his ability is out of whack with basically everything else for a while after, especially since you can get him so early. Maybe if he even just destroyed one 1-energy card in each location, that would be a good mix. He'd still wipe out a chunk of later zoo decks, usually enough to make a difference, but people might actually start playing turn one more frequently again.

[Tray]

aegis3d lähetti viestin:

It really depends on what rank you're talking about. He makes sense against some of the much more powerful cards in the higher ranks. In lower ranks, and really probably up to close to 1500-2000 CL he's ridiculously powerful in changing an entire game compared to everything else below 4 power, even against non-zoo decks. There's quite a range of CL where people simply don't bother playing 1 power cards because he's so frequent, and even zoo decks at that level don't make sense. Even in the later levels. He's the main reason why probably 75% of energy 1 cards are never used once he's available. Unless it's filler junk used for abilities like Korg or Iceman, or a few of the extremely powerful single ones that can be defended because there's only one, he basically single-handedly obsoletes probably a dozen cards and most people's first turn altogether.

So I empathize with the OP. It's a really hard problem to fix. He's needed in the later meta-game, but his ability is out of whack with basically everything else for a while after, especially since you can get him so early. Maybe if he even just destroyed one 1-energy card in each location, that would be a good mix. He'd still wipe out a chunk of later zoo decks, usually enough to make a difference, but people might actually start playing turn one more frequently again.

Killmonger is irrelevant to zoo decks piloted by decent players, they simply play their buff cards out mid game, then vomit their ones on the final turn without priority.

If the cards aren't lining up and you have to drop a few 1s early armor is a thing.

Changes don't need to happen to good cards to help bad players feel better.

[SILENCE UK]

cards fine get out of series 1-2 and come bk

[aegis3d]

Tray lähetti viestin:

aegis3d lähetti viestin:

It really depends on what rank you're talking about. He makes sense against some of the much more powerful cards in the higher ranks. In lower ranks, and really probably up to close to 1500-2000 CL he's ridiculously powerful in changing an entire game compared to everything else below 4 power, even against non-zoo decks. There's quite a range of CL where people simply don't bother playing 1 power cards because he's so frequent, and even zoo decks at that level don't make sense. Even in the later levels. He's the main reason why probably 75% of energy 1 cards are never used once he's available. Unless it's filler junk used for abilities like Korg or Iceman, or a few of the extremely powerful single ones that can be defended because there's only one, he basically single-handedly obsoletes probably a dozen cards and most people's first turn altogether.

So I empathize with the OP. It's a really hard problem to fix. He's needed in the later meta-game, but his ability is out of whack with basically everything else for a while after, especially since you can get him so early. Maybe if he even just destroyed one 1-energy card in each location, that would be a good mix. He'd still wipe out a chunk of later zoo decks, usually enough to make a difference, but people might actually start playing turn one more frequently again.

Killmonger is irrelevant to zoo decks piloted by decent players, they simply play their buff cards out mid game, then vomit their ones on the final turn without priority.

If the cards aren't lining up and you have to drop a few 1s early armor is a thing.

Changes don't need to happen to good cards to help bad players feel better.

There's a fairly substantial time for many players, we're probably talking about 2-3 months of play for free players, where Killmonger will be a big factor and if you haven't bought specific powerful 1-cost cards, or might put in Iceman/Korg and don't care if they die (which still is a pretty low chance of them showing up in your starting hand), then 1s are just too dangerous. Needing to bring along Armor if you want to play 1s not only uses up a substantial part of your deck just to make many 1s relevant at all, cramming them behind Armor leaves very little option to have power at that location and requires multiple cards in combination at the right time. Basically from somewhere in the mid 200-500 CL range when people start getting Killmonger, people stop using 1s almost altogether until somewhere around the 1000-1500 range where a few start to show up again. Even in Infinity rank 1s only show up in specific circumstances, other than the aforementioned Korg/Iceman, or Nebula because she's ridiculously powerful compared to other 1s.

Overall I just find it really odd with the way the game is set up that 1s generally become obsolete. It wouldn't be a big issue if the game went from 2-7 power on each of the turns instead of 1-6, and people could choose to start with a 2, or two 1s. But as it is, *so* many games start with one or both players skipping turn one. 1/6 of the entire average game. Literally the singular reason why decks stop using 1s as a whole, and skips at the beginning of the game are so common, is because of one card: Killmonger. But I think starting at 2 power and counting up might actually be a better solution than modifying Killmonger somehow.

[Zlehtnoba]

aegis3d lähetti viestin:

Overall I just find it really odd with the way the game is set up that 1s generally become obsolete. It wouldn't be a big issue if the game went from 2-7 power on each of the turns instead of 1-6, and people could choose to start with a 2, or two 1s. But as it is, *so* many games start with one or both players skipping turn one. 1/6 of the entire average game. Literally the singular reason why decks stop using 1s as a whole, and skips at the beginning of the game are so common, is because of one card: Killmonger. But I think starting at 2 power and counting up might actually be a better solution than modifying Killmonger somehow.

You can't do that, the whole game is balanced around the 1-6 energy progression. Just remember how broken some decks are if you get the +1 energy location early.

The Killmonger problem you talk about is a necessary learning experience. As players progress, many start with a basic Zoo deck, and then need to adapt to the Killmonger presence in middle CL. And again, when they rich high CL.

[Getsomnuts]

Killmonger Is the only card you can counter loads of 1 cost cards with

[Cujo999]

It's a multipart issue. Being realistic, no single card should be an instant "I win" button in which someone can shut down an entire common deck archetype with a single card play. On the other side of the coin, 1 drops are so terribly unbalanced in the game with the majority having a 200% cost to power rate and useful abilities to boot that they would run completely rampant if KM didn't exist. Unless they're going to go through and completely rebalance 1 drops, he's kind of a necessary evil at this point, though I could see a cost increase and/or power reduction. Elektra has a similar role and never sees play due to KM being too good, and that's a good reasoning for either an Elektra buff or KM nerf.

[GalloglassCA]

Lmao, killmonger is fine.

[aegis3d]

Cujo999 lähetti viestin:

It's a multipart issue. Being realistic, no single card should be an instant "I win" button in which someone can shut down an entire common deck archetype with a single card play. On the other side of the coin, 1 drops are so terribly unbalanced in the game with the majority having a 200% cost to power rate and useful abilities to boot that they would run completely rampant if KM didn't exist. Unless they're going to go through and completely rebalance 1 drops, he's kind of a necessary evil at this point, though I could see a cost increase and/or power reduction. Elektra has a similar role and never sees play due to KM being too good, and that's a good reasoning for either an Elektra buff or KM nerf.

Well the balancing factor to the 2:1 power to cost ratio is that there is quite limited space on the board to play them. 12 spaces is it, so barring their abilities playing 1.5:1 power/cost energy 2 cards would win (even only being able to play 10 of them with the normal amount of energy through a game). Power 3 cards only need about 1.1:1 to keep up, etc. The abilities do shift this, but still it generally has more to do with other power cards buffing a full/nearly full board that gives them their ultimate power rather than their own abilities as far as raw power is concerned.

Anyway, I still think Killmonger destroyed one power 1 card each location would be a good compromise. It makes him roughly even with Elektra (3 kills for 3 vs. 1 kill for 1), still with the advantage of being able to be put in any row, which is huge. It would still incapacitate decks that fully rely on 1 power cards, probably enough to shift the victory. What it wouldn't ruin in general are people who just have a few 1-power cards mixed in with others. They could have a chance of protecting one by buffering it with another 1-card at the same location. And while it potentially can turn the tide against certain decks, it would still require a bit of backup against them rather than being the sole factor. But most importantly in my mind is that it would help bring back turn 1, and even more variety in turn 1 for those that actually play a card. I mean, honestly, when was the last game that you played that didn't start with one of about 5 options for the first turn, with skip being one of those probably happening near half the time? It happens, but it's rare.

[Kurziel]

aegis3d lähetti viestin:

Overall I just find it really odd with the way the game is set up that 1s generally become obsolete. It wouldn't be a big issue if the game went from 2-7 power on each of the turns instead of 1-6, and people could choose to start with a 2, or two 1s. But as it is, *so* many games start with one or both players skipping turn one. 1/6 of the entire average game. Literally the singular reason why decks stop using 1s as a whole, and skips at the beginning of the game are so common, is because of one card: Killmonger. But I think starting at 2 power and counting up might actually be a better solution than modifying Killmonger somehow.

This is most definitely not the case. I stopped using many 1's when I realized there was more efficient ways to use my deck space. You only get 12 slots to put cards in. In a lot of my decks I find it more beneficial to use that space for a 2 or 3 drop.

Yes, I may have to skip first turn but it improves the reliability and versatility in the later rounds.

[Dax]

One costs are already super strong. Nebula, Sunspot, Iceman & Kitty pretty much require KM to be where he is for them to be as good as they are.

If they nerf these 1 drops, then a KM nerf might be more warrented

[kingts]

I also disagree that Killmonger, needs any nerf.
Disrupt cards, have to be in the game.
1. Cost and Power are right on him
2. Effect is not overpowered, he has plenty of counters, Cosmo, Armor, Locations, Yondu, Angela, Bishop. Enchantress is more of a counter to Kazoo decks. To Nerf him or change him would also undo the destroy mechanic
3. Not usually a key card used mid to upper rank. Also future Affiliation mechanic they add, for Wakanda affiliation cards, could damage that theme if Killmonger is nerfed.