Why I'd be happier to see "Lethal Company 2" rather than more updates for this Lethal Company.

[GaskinZ]

Go ahead and get your pitchforks out, I know the quality of comments on these forums.

However, I have to say it: Lethal Company 2 would be better than more updates for Lethal Company 1.

It comes down to the six biggest problems with Lethal Company today:

- Matchmaking is barebones: It has to be because the game wasn't built with that kind of stability in mind.

- Mods provide more than 40% of content now, and there's no sync : Even if you want to play with mods, 80% of lobbies aren't going to want to play with *your* mods.

- The Game itself is unstable : Even without mods, a lot of entities such as the nutcracker and coilhead become desynced from the host way too often.

- The Game is PC only : The game really can't be ported to consoles due to the nature of how unstable (and potentially hazardous) the lobbies are.

- Zeekers himself is a single developer who's built everything so far : Meaning he's not working with a team.

- There is no financial incentive for this game to further production : 95%+ of players aren't going to purchase this game a second time for themselves, there are no microtransactions(thank god), and Zeekers doesn't make money if people are playing the game, he gets money when people PURCHASE the game.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Now: How does "Lethal Company 2" remedy any of that?

Well quite frankly it addresses all those issues.


Imagine a remake of Lethal Company, only instead of just zeekers working alone on Unity, it's a team of 5-10 people working together on something stronger like Unreal (ok maybe that's one's a bit too strong).

The game can not only include all your favorite moons and monsters from the base game, but can also include new moons, new monsters, and even new mechanics.

Benefits:

- Better matchmaking : If rebuilt from the ground up matchmaking can be vastly improved.

- Built-in-mods only: While normal lethal company 1 remains active for the modding community, this game wouldn't allow for mod creation. Rather instead, the game could include unlockable "Moddifiers" for different runs. Tired of normal gameplay? Maybe try to play with lower gravity, or more/less stamina, or maybe try to survive a new entity that wouldn't appear otherwise...

- Better stability: With a better baseline, things like coilhead desync can be vastly minimized.

- Console inclusivity : Self explanatory.

- More frequent updates : Working with a team means way more production can be focused on the game.


- More opportunities for equity : The game being released on more platforms isn't the only opening for the game to provide more funding for itself. With a more stable system, the concept of purchasable cosmetics or even purchasable game-modifiers is on the table to keep the game "alive" for much longer.


- More long-term mechanics added : Things like achievements and leaderboards are easier to implement when the product is known to survive a longer period of user engagement. In addition, this may even allow for further expansion into the longterm lore and story behind the game.


Downsides:

- You'd have to re-purchase the game : It's a new game, even if it's built to replace an established game.

- No Mods : Mods are a definitive positive for the game, but ultimately they directly conflict with connection stability and console support. However, the original Lethal company would still be available for mods to continue to dominate the scene.

- Likely higher price : Fact of the matter is more production means a higher price-tag.



And quite frankly I think the benefits outweigh the downsides.

Go ahead and comment what you think about this, and if you have your own objections or ideas go ahead and post those too.

[Underpaid Janitor]

over watch 2

[GaskinZ]

Originally posted by Observer the sign inspector:

over watch 2

Actually the opposite problem. Overwatch re-made the same game when it didn't need to because the first game worked fine and could continue to be profitable indefinately, but they changed it and shut down the original game for no dirrect benefit.

Lethal has run out of profitability, is severely lacking in means of progressing, this scenario doesn't pull the plug on the initial game either, and doesn't have anything from the first game like cosmetics that have been earned over multiple games.

[Joe, aka. The Man]

Its an early access game. I paid for the full scope as written in the description.

This game is not finished.

Finish your project before starting a new.

Keep your promises.

Dont be like Trump, Zeekers. You took 50+ mil and started working on another project, without hiring not even one developer to continue Lethal Company.

[Du_umah]

The last thing we need is a sequel to a game that's still in early access.

[GamingWithSilvertail]

Originally posted by GaskinZ:

Go ahead and get your pitchforks out, I know the quality of comments on these forums.

However, I have to say it: Lethal Company 2 would be better than more updates for Lethal Company 1.

It comes down to the six biggest problems with Lethal Company today:

- Matchmaking is barebones: It has to be because the game wasn't built with that kind of stability in mind.

- Mods provide more than 40% of content now, and there's no sync : Even if you want to play with mods, 80% of lobbies aren't going to want to play with *your* mods.

- The Game itself is unstable : Even without mods, a lot of entities such as the nutcracker and coilhead become desynced from the host way too often.

- The Game is PC only : The game really can't be ported to consoles due to the nature of how unstable (and potentially hazardous) the lobbies are.

- Zeekers himself is a single developer who's built everything so far : Meaning he's not working with a team.

- There is no financial incentive for this game to further production : 95%+ of players aren't going to purchase this game a second time for themselves, there are no microtransactions(thank god), and Zeekers doesn't make money if people are playing the game, he gets money when people PURCHASE the game.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Now: How does "Lethal Company 2" remedy any of that?

Well quite frankly it addresses all those issues.


Imagine a remake of Lethal Company, only instead of just zeekers working alone on Unity, it's a team of 5-10 people working together on something stronger like Unreal (ok maybe that's one's a bit too strong).

The game can not only include all your favorite moons and monsters from the base game, but can also include new moons, new monsters, and even new mechanics.

Benefits:

- Better matchmaking : If rebuilt from the ground up matchmaking can be vastly improved.

- Built-in-mods only: While normal lethal company 1 remains active for the modding community, this game wouldn't allow for mod creation. Rather instead, the game could include unlockable "Moddifiers" for different runs. Tired of normal gameplay? Maybe try to play with lower gravity, or more/less stamina, or maybe try to survive a new entity that wouldn't appear otherwise...

- Better stability: With a better baseline, things like coilhead desync can be vastly minimized.

- Console inclusivity : Self explanatory.

- More frequent updates : Working with a team means way more production can be focused on the game.


- More opportunities for equity : The game being released on more platforms isn't the only opening for the game to provide more funding for itself. With a more stable system, the concept of purchasable cosmetics or even purchasable game-modifiers is on the table to keep the game "alive" for much longer.


- More long-term mechanics added : Things like achievements and leaderboards are easier to implement when the product is known to survive a longer period of user engagement. In addition, this may even allow for further expansion into the longterm lore and story behind the game.


Downsides:

- You'd have to re-purchase the game : It's a new game, even if it's built to replace an established game.

- No Mods : Mods are a definitive positive for the game, but ultimately they directly conflict with connection stability and console support. However, the original Lethal company would still be available for mods to continue to dominate the scene.

- Likely higher price : Fact of the matter is more production means a higher price-tag.



And quite frankly I think the benefits outweigh the downsides.

Go ahead and comment what you think about this, and if you have your own objections or ideas go ahead and post those too.

Lobbies arnt unstable. Not sure what you are talking about. Game can easely be ported to console, althou I dont advice zeekers to do it himself if he does but hire a third party port company.

o.O

[alliennator123]

Originally posted by GaskinZ:

Go ahead and get your pitchforks out, I know the quality of comments on these forums.

However, I have to say it: Lethal Company 2 would be better than more updates for Lethal Company 1.

It comes down to the six biggest problems with Lethal Company today:

- Matchmaking is barebones: It has to be because the game wasn't built with that kind of stability in mind.

- Mods provide more than 40% of content now, and there's no sync : Even if you want to play with mods, 80% of lobbies aren't going to want to play with *your* mods.

- The Game itself is unstable : Even without mods, a lot of entities such as the nutcracker and coilhead become desynced from the host way too often.

- The Game is PC only : The game really can't be ported to consoles due to the nature of how unstable (and potentially hazardous) the lobbies are.

- Zeekers himself is a single developer who's built everything so far : Meaning he's not working with a team.

- There is no financial incentive for this game to further production : 95%+ of players aren't going to purchase this game a second time for themselves, there are no microtransactions(thank god), and Zeekers doesn't make money if people are playing the game, he gets money when people PURCHASE the game.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Now: How does "Lethal Company 2" remedy any of that?

Well quite frankly it addresses all those issues.


Imagine a remake of Lethal Company, only instead of just zeekers working alone on Unity, it's a team of 5-10 people working together on something stronger like Unreal (ok maybe that's one's a bit too strong).

The game can not only include all your favorite moons and monsters from the base game, but can also include new moons, new monsters, and even new mechanics.

Benefits:

- Better matchmaking : If rebuilt from the ground up matchmaking can be vastly improved.

- Built-in-mods only: While normal lethal company 1 remains active for the modding community, this game wouldn't allow for mod creation. Rather instead, the game could include unlockable "Moddifiers" for different runs. Tired of normal gameplay? Maybe try to play with lower gravity, or more/less stamina, or maybe try to survive a new entity that wouldn't appear otherwise...

- Better stability: With a better baseline, things like coilhead desync can be vastly minimized.

- Console inclusivity : Self explanatory.

- More frequent updates : Working with a team means way more production can be focused on the game.


- More opportunities for equity : The game being released on more platforms isn't the only opening for the game to provide more funding for itself. With a more stable system, the concept of purchasable cosmetics or even purchasable game-modifiers is on the table to keep the game "alive" for much longer.


- More long-term mechanics added : Things like achievements and leaderboards are easier to implement when the product is known to survive a longer period of user engagement. In addition, this may even allow for further expansion into the longterm lore and story behind the game.


Downsides:

- You'd have to re-purchase the game : It's a new game, even if it's built to replace an established game.

- No Mods : Mods are a definitive positive for the game, but ultimately they directly conflict with connection stability and console support. However, the original Lethal company would still be available for mods to continue to dominate the scene.

- Likely higher price : Fact of the matter is more production means a higher price-tag.



And quite frankly I think the benefits outweigh the downsides.

Go ahead and comment what you think about this, and if you have your own objections or ideas go ahead and post those too.

Overall i agree, even if to be honest, i don't really have much complaint with the game, sure i would love to have more update, maybe a moon that as a bit less obstacle and is more flat for the cruiser for example.

And there is that weird mic issue that some player have with echoes i would love to see gone, for example my friend has NO echoes issue on other way to vocal, be it in game chat of another game or discord/steam voice chat, but in lethal company even when his mic is mute, i can hear my and other friends echoes through him, that the only real problem i have.

Me and my friends never had an issue with desync, heck, even with pubs i never felt this issue even tho all the server i connect too are far/world wide. At best i get the "unable to connect", "impossible to get lobby data, are you offline ?" error when i try to join, which is bothersome but it's okay.

I would leave modding on pc for Lethal company 2, but make it a steam workshop instead of modifying files or using third party like Thunderstore, and have a dedicated filter for modded and none modded, the game that come to my mind first having this system is Black ops 3, you can play it on console, sure, but if you have a pc you can have custom zombie maps.

But one of the thing i would love to see before Zeeker do officialy stop updating lethal, is the to get the kidnapper fox back, we didn't even have time to learn how to deal with it and it was already gone because of all the people complaining about it

(Some quick random idea about making it more viable) The bare minimum would be to make it so it doesn't spawn on every moon, so if you want to avoid it just don't go there, and buff a little the weed killer effect against weed maybe ? Give a reward for getting rid of it, so it doesn't just feel like a waste of time on top of being a tedious process ? It would be nice if Vain Shrouds could multiply slower, cause from what little i played, i remember how FAST they would multiply, top it off with weed killer being slow, tedious, and the vain would spawn the next day and it was just pain. The hit box of weed killer where kinda bad, sometime even tho you sprayed right on top it would miss, so fix that too.

I haven't played enough fox to really say what would need change about it, or if it even need a change to begin with

Maybe it doesn't spawn at all first quota, (Vain shrouds would start to have %? chance to spawn vain shrouds starting at the last day of first quota so that the fox could spawn day 1 or 2 of second quota or more depending on your luck. This will give you time to get more money at the start of your run, so for new player this will give them the opportunity to get flashlight/shovel or other stuff to start calmly and discover the game at first, while still getting to the fox fairly fast and discovering this dangerous foe) maybe health nerf ? since 7HP is more than 1 shotgun shot so make it 5HP ? maybe if you hit the tongue it does 1 damage ? lots of possible option with the fox to make it more viable/less annoying to player, but i first would need to have it back, got a mod for that but haven't played with it yet.

It still need to be strong enough to be an ominious monster tho, the designed idea was good, but like i said, we didn't have enough time to have learned how to deal with it, it was on every moon, Vain Shrouds was multiplying SUPER FAST (from what i remember) getting rid of Vain Shrouds was a tedious process which didn't really give you anything worth the trouble and the fox was STRONG, but i did like it for the little time i remember playing against him. (destroyed me everytime still :'( )

Anyway, for the 10$ this game cost, im VERY happy with what i've gotten, even without counting the mods, came back and played more of it recently with pubs none modded, and i've been having lots of fun, i can't understand most people complaining about the price for the hours of fun i had (with our without mods) on this game, There are game that cost so much more and aren't even gonna be played that long, it's ridiculous, but i do understand some of the complaint, which are okay, or even rightfully somethign to be mad of, if true, but some people out there just...seems to like to rant about nothing and everything.

Thanks you for reading this far, hope you have a good day :)

[provokedartist]

Ah yes, I can't wait for Lethal company 50.

[Anter84]

Wouldn't the games full release be similar to this? The game is still in early access and the reason more content gets added is because its building up towards a full release. I certainly hope the full release adds more content, fixes server bugs, makes joining easier, and gets ported to consoles. Not to mention, nothing is stopping the developer from hiring more people to work on the project, he could do something like what Toby Fox did to Deltarune and hire more people throughout if its too much.

[Sasha Mason]

I feel like a Lethal Company 2 would get significant amount of backlash if it was done while Lethal Company 1 is still in Early Access. I can see the general logic behind it though. He could develop LC1 further, but financially, he might end up spending a lot of time on updates that don't generate more revenue. I suspect that this is also why development on this game has slowed down so much. (Aside from them feeling burnt out too)

At the same time though, if he were to develop and released a Lethal Company 2, not only would it somehow have to out-perform the still incredibly popular Lethal Company 1, he would also have to deal with all the negative reception that would come from releasing another game before finishing the last. A Lethal Company 2 would have to be absolutely EXCEPTIONAL to really have a chance of overshadowing all the negativity that would come from LC1 never being properly finished.

From personal experience though, I feel like it would be very likely for a Lethal Company 2 to end up being "subpar" or disappointing. Even big budget game companies struggle making good and worthwhile sequels at times. It would be much safer to continue development of Lethal Company 1 until it is finished and out of Early Access.

[GaskinZ]

Originally posted by Sasha Mason:

A Lethal Company 2 would have to be absolutely EXCEPTIONAL to really have a chance of overshadowing all the negativity that would come from LC1 never being properly finished.

Nah, it'd just have to be available on console. At any point Zeekers can just claim Lethal Company 1 has finished production, wait a few months, then announce LC2/LCReborn or whatever, show it being on a stronger engine with a bunch of new content on top of the original content.

Also he gets a significant amount of backlash even when he just updates the game normally, and it's not like there are investors either. Any hate people throw at him he's seen 1000 times before. Hell its not like it'd even split the fanbase either as LC2 would have total access to the console playerbase.

[GaskinZ]

Originally posted by GamingWithSilvertail:

Lobbies arnt unstable. Not sure what you are talking about. Game can easely be ported to console, althou I dont advice zeekers to do it himself if he does but hire a third party port company.

o.O

To be clear, I don't mean lobbies break regularly, I mean they're not protected. That's the biggest issue with porting to console. It's built off unity which can be ported yes, but matchmaking is it's own can of worms.

Just porting it doesn't solve that issue.

[Sasha Mason]

Originally posted by GaskinZ:

Originally posted by Sasha Mason:

A Lethal Company 2 would have to be absolutely EXCEPTIONAL to really have a chance of overshadowing all the negativity that would come from LC1 never being properly finished.

Nah, it'd just have to be available on console. At any point Zeekers can just claim Lethal Company 1 has finished production, wait a few months, then announce LC2/LCReborn or whatever, show it being on a stronger engine with a bunch of new content on top of the original content.

Also he gets a significant amount of backlash even when he just updates the game normally, and it's not like there are investors either. Any hate people throw at him he's seen 1000 times before. Hell its not like it'd even split the fanbase either as LC2 would have total access to the console playerbase.

I would argue otherwise.
There's always people complaining on the forums, reviews sit at a nice 97% total, and 96% recent though. There's not been any updates that ever changed that, so the supposed backlash couldn't have really been much.

There is a difference between there just being some haters, or having something like what happened with Helldivers 2 where the backlash resulted in significant review bombing that dragged the game down to "Mixed".

[GaskinZ]

Originally posted by Velvet_Thorns:

Do you think he would handle LC2's development cycle better, or do you think it would be the same? Not trolling/baiting, genuinely curious.

I don't think there'd be a point in releasing a second version of the game if there wasn't some more focus on the production of the game.

[sweetcheese]

Originally posted by Sasha Mason:

Originally posted by GaskinZ:

There is a difference between there just being some haters, or having something like what happened with Helldivers 2 where the backlash resulted in significant review bombing that dragged the game down to "Mixed".

Around 70 percent of LC discussions are about zeekers not updating, zeekers being rich, zeekers not hiring a team.

Honestly, it makes sense, but the thing is that the game is not necessarily bad, so people don't feel like they need to badly review it.

In my opinion, the game just has so much potential it's not using.

It could be fixed, but I'm not sure a LC2 would help out and would almost certainly be review bombed by people angry that he gave up only after a year and started a new game. The ratings would, I'm 80% sure, be at most mixed or lower.

[GnomeSlayer]

What is happening to this game? Can someone give me a summary?