Any use for Gremio

[Captain Steve]

So did a basic party final boss in Suikoden 1, and after getting his weapon sharpened, armor decked out, leveling him up to about 60, I realized Gremio is beyond terrible. I knew he wasn't great, but I figured with a flowing rune maybe he could do some healing. Nope, he can't even cast past level 2 spells. The only thing he's useful for is uniting with Pahn. I read that his stats go up much better than others after level 60, but anyone else is usable before that and you can beat the whole game before level 60. So is Gremio truly Gremio tier below even non-playable characters?

[Zeo]

He's only useful to unite with Pahn early game, the problem with Suiko 1 is that they force way too many irremovable characters in your party, so for the final mission for example, why in the world you would put Gremio in your party instead of Valeria?

This game need a remake the most, a better writing to showcase how legendary Mathiu is, get rid of the annoyances of multi-menuing, key NPCs on our headquarters more accessible (can only save on 1º floor for example), better sprites, rune system should work like suiko 2 and many many more, they can't slap all those changes without making another game.

[Tenshu]

His STR grows more after Lv.60 so he becomes a beatstick but his uses are neutered because of the game's design (too easy). He has good defense and HP and will protect Tir when Tir is at critical low hp, combined with his higher STR growth post-60 he's pretty good on paper. But as you notice you don't need to be Lv.60 to steamroll the final area and Tir is too beastly to be at critically low HP.

[Tatra]

Originally posted by Captain Steve:

So did a basic party final boss in Suikoden 1, and after getting his weapon sharpened, armor decked out, leveling him up to about 60, I realized Gremio is beyond terrible. I knew he wasn't great, but I figured with a flowing rune maybe he could do some healing. Nope, he can't even cast past level 2 spells. The only thing he's useful for is uniting with Pahn. I read that his stats go up much better than others after level 60, but anyone else is usable before that and you can beat the whole game before level 60. So is Gremio truly Gremio tier below even non-playable characters?

Y'know, I always find it annoying when I ask a question, and someone parrots the question back to me as though it's the answer. "Why is sugar bad to put in omelettes?" "Oh, sugar doesn't go well in omelettes." I know that Becky, I am trying to figure out the reason, that's why I asked "why".

So I'm sorry to do basically that but; I think you answered your own question. Everything in the game is beatable by about level 60, and Gremio lags behind until after that point. With that, and nothing else especially notable to them (except the unimportant benefit of guarding Tir when they're critical, something which having beaten the game a couple of times I still don't think I knew until Tenshu's comment above; thanks Tenshu, informative!), that's all she wrote; the game's over before Gremio could be useful.

[Captain Steve]

Originally posted by Zeo:

He's only useful to unite with Pahn early game, the problem with Suiko 1 is that they force way too many irremovable characters in your party, so for the final mission for example, why in the world you would put Gremio in your party instead of Valeria?

This game need a remake the most, a better writing to showcase how legendary Mathiu is, get rid of the annoyances of multi-menuing, key NPCs on our headquarters more accessible (can only save on 1º floor for example), better sprites, rune system should work like suiko 2 and many many more, they can't slap all those changes without making another game.

I do group themes end game generally. Took him, Pahn, and Cleo. Just the starting characters. Next time might take the elves or such.

[AshaMarie]

Gremio is nice to have with Pahn but not at the endgame. I don't even need or want to use Pahn by then either. If it was not for forced Viktor and Flik, I would use Pahn with the 2 other fist users for punching glory.

[Minneyar]

From levels 20 to 60 he basically has mage-tier PWR gain and fighter-tier MGC gain, which means that yes, he pretty much has the worst stats in the game. To be fair, keep in mind that stat gains are semi-randomized; it is possible that if you're lucky and he rolls very well on level up, and other characters roll badly, he could still have stats on par with other bad characters like Gon or Hix... but, it's unlikely.

But as noted, the game is beatable with any combination of characters, so there's nothing stopping you from using him if you like him. This isn't a game where you have to optimize.

[Dragnier]

You are forced to take Viktor and Flik so the other 3 slots are free.
Gremio is good if paired with Pahn, so you could take Gremio, Pahn, and Cleo just for the feelings as they were the initial party. Cleo is a decent magic user, if you do that I would put her as healer and pummel your way with the rest.

Now, there are better stars you could bring that will do more damage than them, but in the end as long as you can beat the boss you will be good. There is no special scene nor different ending based on the chars you bring to the final battle.

As a tip you can bring chars that could be imported into Suikoden 2 as if they are above 60 they can get a boost at their starting levels in S2. You can save at the last save crystal and then backpedal and change to a stronger party if you want to have an easier time with the final boss.

If you are struggling with the final boss (not implying that you are, of course) feel free to ask for party recommendations and people would be happy to share who they like to bring.

[Tenshu]

Originally posted by Dragnier:

You are forced to take Viktor and Flik so the other 3 slots are free.
Gremio is good if paired with Pahn, so you could take Gremio, Pahn, and Cleo just for the feelings as they were the initial party. Cleo is a decent magic user, if you do that I would put her as healer and pummel your way with the rest.

Now, there are better stars you could bring that will do more damage than them, but in the end as long as you can beat the boss you will be good. There is no special scene nor different ending based on the chars you bring to the final battle.

As a tip you can bring chars that could be imported into Suikoden 2 as if they are above 60 they can get a boost at their starting levels in S2. You can save at the last save crystal and then backpedal and change to a stronger party if you want to have an easier time with the final boss.

If you are struggling with the final boss (not implying that you are, of course) feel free to ask for party recommendations and people would be happy to share who they like to bring.

If someone were to have issue, the best advice is focus down the left head lol.

[Furry Wrecking Crew]

Originally posted by Zeo:

for the final mission for example, why in the world you would put Gremio in your party instead of Valeria?

For story and role-playing reasons. The good thing about Suikoden is that it's easy enough to take whoever you want. I was constantly changing my party to see what Unites I could find.

[Tenshu]

Originally posted by Furry Wrecking Crew:

Originally posted by Zeo:

for the final mission for example, why in the world you would put Gremio in your party instead of Valeria?

For story and role-playing reasons. The good thing about Suikoden is that it's easy enough to take whoever you want. I was constantly changing my party to see what Unites I could find.

"Can I Beat The Final Boss of Suikoden Using Only The Boar Rune?" By DanteRavioli

[Zeo]

Originally posted by Captain Steve:

Originally posted by Zeo:

He's only useful to unite with Pahn early game, the problem with Suiko 1 is that they force way too many irremovable characters in your party, so for the final mission for example, why in the world you would put Gremio in your party instead of Valeria?

This game need a remake the most, a better writing to showcase how legendary Mathiu is, get rid of the annoyances of multi-menuing, key NPCs on our headquarters more accessible (can only save on 1º floor for example), better sprites, rune system should work like suiko 2 and many many more, they can't slap all those changes without making another game.

I do group themes end game generally. Took him, Pahn, and Cleo. Just the starting characters. Next time might take the elves or such.

I used the elves in two playthroughs (one on normal and other on hard, blame Leon for this) and they are very good until you reach endgame, because they have low lv4 MP. I endend with Valeria, Eileen and Cleo for their unite attack and I didn't knew that it also makes enemies lose a turn.

Originally posted by Furry Wrecking Crew:

Originally posted by Zeo:

for the final mission for example, why in the world you would put Gremio in your party instead of Valeria?

For story and role-playing reasons. The good thing about Suikoden is that it's easy enough to take whoever you want. I was constantly changing my party to see what Unites I could find.

This wasn't the OP point, we could make a party with whatever and still beat the game, I also like to build my party around unites, next time maybe I will try the Kasumi comp (Kasumi, Tengaar and Camille), also Hix here isn't irremediable bad like he are in Suiko 2, so maybe he can fill a S slot.

[Tenshu]

Originally posted by Zeo:

Originally posted by Captain Steve:

I do group themes end game generally. Took him, Pahn, and Cleo. Just the starting characters. Next time might take the elves or such.

I used the elves in two playthroughs (one on normal and other on hard, blame Leon for this) and they are very good until you reach endgame, because they have low lv4 MP. I endend with Valeria, Eileen and Cleo for their unite attack and I didn't knew that it also makes enemies lose a turn.

Originally posted by Furry Wrecking Crew:

For story and role-playing reasons. The good thing about Suikoden is that it's easy enough to take whoever you want. I was constantly changing my party to see what Unites I could find.

This wasn't the OP point, we could make a party with whatever and still beat the game, I also like to build my party around unites, next time maybe I will try the Kasumi comp (Kasumi, Tengaar and Camille), also Hix here isn't irremediable bad like he are in Suiko 2, so maybe he can fill a S slot.

Really? I'm killing it with Hix with Fury rune and playing the long game on heavies with his Exertion rune. 1k crits early is lovely lol. I forget if he unlocks more rune slots though.

[AshaMarie]

Imagine people coming up with challenge runs like using bunch of mages and not allowed to use rune magic lol.

[Tenshu]

Originally posted by AshaMarie:

Imagine people coming up with challenge runs like using bunch of mages and not allowed to use rune magic lol.

"Can I Beat Suikoden Without Battling?" By DanteRavioli

[Zeo]

Originally posted by Tenshu:

Really? I'm killing it with Hix with Fury rune and playing the long game on heavies with his Exertion rune. 1k crits early is lovely lol. I forget if he unlocks more rune slots though.

Yeah I geared him properly and he sweep the floor with Necklord lol, too bad I can't use him alongside the female trio for the last mission.