Please, Do Fantasy, not AoS.

[Baron]

Warhammer AoS is a one dimensional power rangers meets he-man rip off. Please for the love of god, do warhammer fantasy. Age of Reckoning is good, End Times is fine, AoS is hot garbage.

Save this investment by converting it to warhammer fantasy, listening to player feedback about mechanics, and release it as a free optional DLC to owners of the base game. And when it works to save this game and bring in more players, release another paid DLC to expand on that.

Fixing the game along isn't enough to save it, because AoS is bad source material to begin with and not nearly enough people want it to be worth developing.

[uSIHitMan]

Sure bud. Most rts enjoyers dont care if its old world or AoS. Both have great factions.
Games mechanical core design is what makes it bad in its current state.

[Boss Jimbei]

go cry else where.

[Titanic_Toddler]

AoS today is better than Fantasy ever was

[Wilk09]

No man, stop nostalgic ♥♥♥♥. AoS it's much better than fantasy.

[Unknown Traveller]

1. MMORPG Warhammer Online: Age of Reckoning failed in the most pathetic way (and painful, because my money for months of subscription was wasted). Despite Games Workshop and EA throwing millions of dollars into advertising, renowned Dark Age Camelot developers etc — but fantasy fans didn't сome in mass to this game to make it viable. New people didn’t like the raw, unfinished game and no one liked the world.
Failure of this game has given "fantasy battles" reputation of being a poor Warcraft clone for years.

Vermintide saga is not an Old World story, it's an End Times adventure. The End Times is literally a prologue to Warhammer Age of Sigmar (and so the main reason why I play Vermintide regularly, if it were just another fantasy game I would pass it by).

Needless to say, there was other quite forgotten, abandoned and simply bad videogames based on “fantasy battles”.

2. From January 6th of this year there is no longer any "Warhammer Fantasy". Forget it!
Now in its place Games Workshop triumphantly presents a new tabletop game: Warhammer the Old World! New game, new (retconed) lore!
And we will judge on this only, and not on what was before, because all new videogames will be based on the new Old World now, and not on the old "fantasy battles" (unless the developers made a licensing contract before this date).

And what do we see in the new Old World?
The Shining Forces of Good attack the Ravening Hordes of Evil on the copy map of Europe, (as in every second fantasy).
Bretonnia is a bastion of nobility without flaws with brave (female and foot) knights.
The evil dummy tyrant Settra wants to enslave or kill everyone in the world! He puts his statues and writes titles everywhere, so Settra is absolute evil!
Empire of Man in civil war, but its enlightened, civilized, GOOD state, much more technologically advanced than centuries later. There are no crowds of flagellants for example.
Is there anything more boring and soy than such lore?

On the positive side, however:
Malekith is no more, now his name is Malerion. Like in Age of Sigmar.
The death of the world in the plan of the Great Old Ones to give life to the Mortal Realms.
Although the new story takes place 300 years before Karl Franz, the events of the End Times are a fact.
Warhammer Age of Sigmar is a fact too. Not replaced, not removed. Games Workshop could have canceled this many times over if it was "bad" and brought back the Old World years ago.

P.S: does anyone doubt that Vermintide 3 or the next non-historical Total War can only happen in the Age of Sigmar setting? Developers just have no other choice.

I wish everyone a good in 2024! This is already being heralded as a MONUMENTAL year for Warhammer Age of Sigmar!

[Aedwynn]

Originally posted by Unknown Traveller:

Vermintide saga is not an Old World story, it's an End Times adventure. The End Times is literally a prologue to Warhammer Age of Sigmar (and so the main reason why I play Vermintide regularly, if it were just another fantasy game I would pass it by).

Oh really?
Not an Old World story, despite taking place in Old World, with Old World characters.
End Times is just a specific chain of event in Old World, but it is still part of it.
So you can't be honest even about that?
Well, that just shows how biased and hypocritical you are.

[Shield]

This game would be mediocre if it was WHFB too. That IP isn't some golden ticket... just look at Age of Reckoning.

[Silvertongued Devil]

Age of Sigmar is fine, honestly.

The crap the old GW HQ pulled in End Times outraged Fantasy players (and rightfully so), coupled with the catastrophic fumble that was AoS on release created such a hatred towards the game that there are a huge glut of players who just refuse to entertain the possibility that it could be rehabilitated.

Yet, ironically, it was. The people in charge changed and the game got significantly better and, particularly in 2nd Edition, we got interesting factions, rules, and lore - stuff that made the setting actually fun to engage with. Though, as I alluded to earlier, a lot of people will react with disbelief or mockery at the mere thought that it could have gotten better.

The problem with this game, ultimately, is that it was a polished excellent game in every way - except the one that mattered: gameplay. They've got excellent models, storytelling, additional features; I swear game designers must've had a field day with this thing. When it came to the actual gameplay, though, it feels like they got into this weird situation of trying to emulate the tabletop (a bad idea) while also trying to emulate DoW2 (again, bad idea) and came away with just... a confusing mess that felt like nobody had actually played it until it was too late to change the fundamental gameplay.

Now imagine this game but more in the style of Warcraft 3 or Spellforge: notable heroes leading small (or decently sized) armies of various iconic units, angling towards asymmetry and fluff rather than emulating rules for an entirely different genre of game.


At this point, though, I mostly just feel sorry for the developers. They clearly put a lot of effort into the game but stumbled at the last hurdle and I don't see a way they can fix the game without functionally remaking the game itself. I mean, that's possible, but much like AoS on release I don't think it's gonna happen.

[GhOsT]

Age of Sigmar is awesome, stop crying. Fantasy died for a reason. You want to play fantasy go buy total war warhammer. This game sucks. Fantasy, AoS or 40k setting wouldn't have made a difference.

[Tezz Da Man]

AOS all the way , total war has done the old world to death.

[Wish]

Please, Do and continue with AOS, not Fantasy. For Fantasy setting everyone could play TotalWar Warhammer, this buggy piece of greedy donation ♥♥♥♥...
So, please make new a DLCs for the Realms of Ruin, we need a good RTS

[Herodotus]

Fantasy is back with The Old World, but it's trotting old themes, old miniatures (most sprues in the box release are dated 1998 and 2003) and it just to appeal to the nostalgia of old. Many never stopped playing Fantasy, but for me The End of Times is fine, but AoS is really where it's at, never embracing Fantasy. I'm more Sci Fi and this fits well with that.

[mayrc]

Well each to their own.... but AOS is sooo crappy Scify-Fantasy lore its like watching Twilight..... Not totaly bad movie but every Adult fantasy fan will vomit watching it.

And thats whats wrong with AOS. Its realy REALY hard to like it as a fantasy fan.
If you love tolkin.... you will hate AOS.
If you love forgotten Realms..... you will hate AOS.
if you love Warhammer Fantasy..... you will hate AOS.
if you love Midgard.... you will hate AOS.
if you love Ravenloft.... you will hate AOS.
If you love call of cthulhu..... you will hate AOS.

If you love Powerrangers.... You will love AOS.

[Silvertongued Devil]

You sound like somebody who knows nothing about it beyond the atrocious launch and "lol Sigmarines." AoS is fine, it's just its own setting with its own lore now. It's not Warhammer Fantasy - it never has been - and it's gotten plenty of interesting and unique content since then.

Like, I get it: End Times was horrible and the early days of AoS were similarly comically bad. The game has changed quite a bit since then.

We've got contagious insanity leading deformed cannibal pseudo-vampires living in a fantasy of being chivalric knights in shining armour, worshipping the sun because it's their god, despite their flesh smoking (and incinerat
We've got wraiths that jealously destroy the living not because the living have committed some grave sin, but because their masters have tormented them for so long that they're jealous of the mortals' ability to exist in peace.
We've got soldiers pressganged into service and given immortality at the cost of losing a piece of themselves every time they die - over and over into infinity until all that's left of them is a hollowed out husk devoid of everything that made them who they are, and they don't even get to know what they've lost because it's forgotten. They just know that something used to be there, something important, and now it's gone.
We've got hordes of Greenskins who've given up their bodies to be infested with mycellia, having mushrooms growing out of their flesh like some sort of Last of Us zombie - and they're desperately chasing an erratic-orbiting moon that they worship. Their main motive for fighting isn't for territory or joy or resources - it's because the moon happened to be passing by and they must catch every last possible glimpse of it before it leaves, even if that means charging headlong through your army.
We've got xenophobic elves retreating into the sea to avoid the chaos gods, only to find that their souls are still being slowly sapped from their bodies. Now they raid their neighbours, not with ships and crossbows but by bringing the ethereal ocean with them. They turn the entire battlefield into the ocean floor so they can swim while their prey lumbers around on land like crawfish scuttling to evade a shark.
And hell even just from a gameplay perspective we've got ridiculously huge giants that can destroy terrain features and literally kick the objective points like a football, repositioning it somewhere more favourable.
Oh, also Undead Romans. Those guys are pretty cool too.

Basically my point is: there's plenty to like about the game, lore-wise and gameplay-wise. If you ever gave it a shot, maybe you'd see that. If nothing else there are entirely new types of factions, new archetypes and crazy abilities that nothing in Warhammer Fantasy can really compare to, making each army feel way more "fluffy."

And all of this I say as a Warhammer Fantasy fan.
You don't need to get into some goofy console war "with us or against us" BS. They can both exist and they can both be pretty good.

[DDkiki]

Originally posted by Silvertongued Devil:

You sound like somebody who knows nothing about it beyond the atrocious launch and "lol Sigmarines." AoS is fine, it's just its own setting with its own lore now. It's not Warhammer Fantasy - it never has been - and it's gotten plenty of interesting and unique content since then.

Like, I get it: End Times was horrible and the early days of AoS were similarly comically bad. The game has changed quite a bit since then.

We've got contagious insanity leading deformed cannibal pseudo-vampires living in a fantasy of being chivalric knights in shining armour, worshipping the sun because it's their god, despite their flesh smoking (and incinerat
We've got wraiths that jealously destroy the living not because the living have committed some grave sin, but because their masters have tormented them for so long that they're jealous of the mortals' ability to exist in peace.
We've got soldiers pressganged into service and given immortality at the cost of losing a piece of themselves every time they die - over and over into infinity until all that's left of them is a hollowed out husk devoid of everything that made them who they are, and they don't even get to know what they've lost because it's forgotten. They just know that something used to be there, something important, and now it's gone.
We've got hordes of Greenskins who've given up their bodies to be infested with mycellia, having mushrooms growing out of their flesh like some sort of Last of Us zombie - and they're desperately chasing an erratic-orbiting moon that they worship. Their main motive for fighting isn't for territory or joy or resources - it's because the moon happened to be passing by and they must catch every last possible glimpse of it before it leaves, even if that means charging headlong through your army.
We've got xenophobic elves retreating into the sea to avoid the chaos gods, only to find that their souls are still being slowly sapped from their bodies. Now they raid their neighbours, not with ships and crossbows but by bringing the ethereal ocean with them. They turn the entire battlefield into the ocean floor so they can swim while their prey lumbers around on land like crawfish scuttling to evade a shark.
And hell even just from a gameplay perspective we've got ridiculously huge giants that can destroy terrain features and literally kick the objective points like a football, repositioning it somewhere more favourable.
Oh, also Undead Romans. Those guys are pretty cool too.

Basically my point is: there's plenty to like about the game, lore-wise and gameplay-wise. If you ever gave it a shot, maybe you'd see that. If nothing else there are entirely new types of factions, new archetypes and crazy abilities that nothing in Warhammer Fantasy can really compare to, making each army feel way more "fluffy."

And all of this I say as a Warhammer Fantasy fan.
You don't need to get into some goofy console war "with us or against us" BS. They can both exist and they can both be pretty good.

I think most undead armies are real MVPs of AoS, from their lore to design they are fantastic, even lore of old characters like Mannfred is surprisingly interesting. AoS also expanded chaos monogod themed armies much better than FB(and 40k, that were homogenizing them as much as possible before) and as a fan of more monogod style im all for it, Tzeentch and Slaanesh armies are awesome. Im not a fan of what they've done with the elves tho, sorry. And this new GS lore is not to my taste either.

But my problem is that world itself turned from...cohesive world to this multiverse marval-like thing and im just not enjoying and can't feel it. I love fantasy with actual world and all races being on same planet with different continents, actual countries with borders, it gives immersion and believability in the setting, making it feel as something that can exist, more grounded. When empire soldiers face off against chaos with "Faith, Steel and Firepower" its impressive, when its god-like immortal gigachads...its not,(kinda a reason im very anti SM in 40k, they are not fun to me, and why i was pro-fantasy over it all the time)at leas for me.

The only race that kinda written well in this multiverse are skaven with their way to "traverse" and exist in these realms, it was very creative and fit them very well.