[QUERY] Why is the Completion Rate So Low (29.5%)? : Beneath Oresa

[<™[-=> Cookiez <=-]™>]

Only 29.5% of all accounts have managed to complete the game at Architect's Curse 1. Why is it so low?

[radasusa]

well a new person can find any/all of the mechanic difficult, but the reason i feel agica should be first is there no real/big downside to not playing into the counter (yes you don't get the useful no dmg+possible big hit) but your cards still give def and still do dmg regardless. While not using the virus mechanic properly can lead to big downsides for the player, that will affect there ability to def or do any dmg at all

[<™[-=> Cookiez <=-]™>]

Originally posted by radasusa:

well a new person can find any/all of the mechanic difficult, but the reason i feel agica should be first is there no real/big downside to not playing into the counter (yes you don't get the useful no dmg+possible big hit) but your cards still give def and still do dmg regardless. While not using the virus mechanic properly can lead to big downsides for the player, that will affect there ability to def or do any dmg at all

Exactly my point.

A perfect mirror.

[Game Familiar]

My suggestion has always been remove all unlocks including the curse selection and let players pick whetever challenge they want.

I may be missing something but viruses are pretty straightforward they clutter your deck that pretty much covers them

[TheGrandQuest]

Originally posted by Game Familiar:

My suggestion has always been remove all unlocks including the curse selection and let players pick whetever challenge they want.

I may be missing something but viruses are pretty straightforward they clutter your deck that pretty much covers them

unlocks are pretty standard in card rougelikes and i think its fine here they just need to balance the player-enemy power

unless the devs plan to add a multiplayer element most of the time the power should lean towards the player until halfway through the curse/ascension/etc... levels.
in this game it leans towards the player until floor 2 of curse 0.

a good card roguelikes difficulty should come more towards knowledge then skill/luck.
knowing how an enemy should be handled to minimize loss and what synergies are best for your particular run. the only time luck should be brought into question is at the highest difficulty and even then should only be unfortunate edge cases in seed generation.

a lot of the cards are hot garbage and sometimes you have to pick between 3 bad options because you HAVE to take cards which means you have to skip upgrades to remove them.
not having proper control over a deck is usually reserved for a extreme detrimental effect as a trade off for a strong effect... not a core game mechanic.

and not letting you save and quit a fight is just mean to newbies trying to learn a new enemy

[Game Familiar]

Originally posted by TheGrandQuest:

Originally posted by Game Familiar:

My suggestion has always been remove all unlocks including the curse selection and let players pick whetever challenge they want.

I may be missing something but viruses are pretty straightforward they clutter your deck that pretty much covers them

unlocks are pretty standard in card rougelikes and i think its fine here they just need to balance the player-enemy power

unless the devs plan to add a multiplayer element most of the time the power should lean towards the player until halfway through the curse/ascension/etc... levels.
in this game it leans towards the player until floor 2 of curse 0.

a good card roguelikes difficulty should come more towards knowledge then skill/luck.
knowing how an enemy should be handled to minimize loss and what synergies are best for your particular run. the only time luck should be brought into question is at the highest difficulty and even then should only be unfortunate edge cases in seed generation.

a lot of the cards are hot garbage and sometimes you have to pick between 3 bad options because you HAVE to take cards which means you have to skip upgrades to remove them.
not having proper control over a deck is usually reserved for a extreme detrimental effect as a trade off for a strong effect... not a core game mechanic.

and not letting you save and quit a fight is just mean to newbies trying to learn a new enemy

There is 0 luck involved in outcomes in the game, your last point does make a lot harder for newer players to experiment

[TheGrandQuest]

Originally posted by Game Familiar:

There is 0 luck involved in outcomes in the game, your last point does make a lot harder for newer players to experiment

as someone who as won a run 100% off of lucking into all the tenet relics and the whole nature of a roguelike there definitely always is luck involved.

but I was refering to the things a card roguelike should steer away from as a whole.
knowledge checking the player is always more fun then skill/luck checking someone in a card roguelikes cause it is easier to overcome a knowledge barrier then a skill/luck issue

[radasusa]

there for sure a bit more luck in this then the average card roguelike, with the not being able to choose anycard for plenty of the upgrades etc.

[radasusa]

Certain relic/antiqorum can be pretty op with certain combo while some feel useless regardless of deck build but i feel that not much different from anyother deckbuilder

[Game Familiar]

Originally posted by TheGrandQuest:

Originally posted by Game Familiar:

There is 0 luck involved in outcomes in the game, your last point does make a lot harder for newer players to experiment

as someone who as won a run 100% off of lucking into all the tenet relics and the whole nature of a roguelike there definitely always is luck involved.

but I was refering to the things a card roguelike should steer away from as a whole.
knowledge checking the player is always more fun then skill/luck checking someone in a card roguelikes cause it is easier to overcome a knowledge barrier then a skill/luck issue

My point was if you know what you are doing there is 0 luck in the outcome of the game (win or loss) the amounts of paths to victories can be more or less depending on luck but it all comes down to how good your decisions are within the run you are playing, however the game seems to have issues giving newer players space to experiment and receive feedback of what works other than dying.

[Game Familiar]

Originally posted by radasusa:

there for sure a bit more luck in this then the average card roguelike, with the not being able to choose anycard for plenty of the upgrades etc.

Not really you are more constrained in your choices, but it compensates with the cheer amount of stuff it gives you in terms of upgrades and removals you always get. That is not to everybody's taste and it can be the case that not fullfilling those expectations creates too much of a barrier for newer players

[radasusa]

this true it does play different from the other deckbuilder games out there

[radasusa]

i personally don't think the game is too hard if you know what you doing, it maybe even a little easy if you playing on low curse with an certain character combo. but there are things for sure that would be nice personally if they were different.

Like how having more lore or having random non combat events would personally be nice.
having more pathing in a run so you can possibly fight 3/4 elites or 0 on a said floor etc.

does the game need these maybe but it would be nice.

[Game Familiar]

The original version had 4 regular fights, 1 forced elite and 2 optional per floor, the problem was runs took way too long even at curse 0 and there is no way right now to have a variable amount. There were suggestions for a fast draft mode where you draft and just fight elites/bosses but they were not possible to implement at the time.

There was a small lore update planned with something similar to what you are describing although the release date was undetermined, hopefully the game does better, there was a significant batch of new players after it was included in the humble bundle, and the main designer was inquiring about trying to smooth the learning curve, they read this threads but they are 3 person team and are working on another project as well so if anyone is interested in providing more direct feedback, they are more responsive in Discord, they always welcome it, and that way is more interactive and they can also inform a bit about the constraints they have, sometimes it comes down to we can't do that with tools we have available at the moment.

Not saying anybody should stop posting your suggestions or questions here, however if you want a more rapid response and/or are interested in talking strategy or game design the Discord is better suited for that purpose.

[<™[-=> Cookiez <=-]™>]

Originally posted by Game Familiar:

The original version had 4 regular fights, 1 forced elite and 2 optional per floor, the problem was runs took way too long even at curse 0 and there is no way right now to have a variable amount. There were suggestions for a fast draft mode where you draft and just fight elites/bosses but they were not possible to implement at the time.

There was a small lore update planned with something similar to what you are describing although the release date was undetermined, hopefully the game does better, there was a significant batch of new players after it was included in the humble bundle, and the main designer was inquiring about trying to smooth the learning curve, they read this threads but they are 3 person team and are working on another project as well so if anyone is interested in providing more direct feedback, they are more responsive in Discord, they always welcome it, and that way is more interactive and they can also inform a bit about the constraints they have, sometimes it comes down to we can't do that with tools we have available at the moment.

Not saying anybody should stop posting your suggestions or questions here, however if you want a more rapid response and/or are interested in talking strategy or game design the Discord is better suited for that purpose.

Discord is hard to do.

[TheGrandQuest]

Originally posted by <™-=> Cookiez <=-™>:

Originally posted by Game Familiar:

The original version had 4 regular fights, 1 forced elite and 2 optional per floor, the problem was runs took way too long even at curse 0 and there is no way right now to have a variable amount. There were suggestions for a fast draft mode where you draft and just fight elites/bosses but they were not possible to implement at the time.

There was a small lore update planned with something similar to what you are describing although the release date was undetermined, hopefully the game does better, there was a significant batch of new players after it was included in the humble bundle, and the main designer was inquiring about trying to smooth the learning curve, they read this threads but they are 3 person team and are working on another project as well so if anyone is interested in providing more direct feedback, they are more responsive in Discord, they always welcome it, and that way is more interactive and they can also inform a bit about the constraints they have, sometimes it comes down to we can't do that with tools we have available at the moment.

Not saying anybody should stop posting your suggestions or questions here, however if you want a more rapid response and/or are interested in talking strategy or game design the Discord is better suited for that purpose.

Discord is hard to do.

there is also a limit to how many discords you can join... which is even worse if you at some point paid or were gifted nitro as you could be 50 servers over the limit