Question About the New Weapon Power-Up Item

[wafflekitty]

Firstly, why is the chance to see it in level-up options so low? I feel like it should have a better chance than it currently does. I've done entire runs as some of these new DLC characters and not had it offered even once. They literally need this item to evolve their starting weapons.

Secondly, if you choose multiple Contra weapons during a run, can the Weapon Power-Up item be offered in level-up choices multiple times too? So that you can evolve all of them? Or is it only realistically feasible to use multiple Contra weapons in a single run if you are playing on one of the Contra maps, where Weapon Power-Up appears laying on the ground in multiple spots?

[wafflekitty]

If you get Prototypes A, B, and C in the same run, with both Heart of Fire and the arcana that makes their projectiles bounce off enemies and the edge of the screen, they can do some pretty reliable damage. Still not tops tier, but good enough to be usable and quite fun.

Time Warp slots nicely into blender builds. It has the same range as Soul Eater and Unholy Vespers. I might even argue it’s better than Unholy Vespers now and can take that slot in the build.

Atmo-Torpedo is hilariously good at keeping enemies off of you. Yes, its damage stinks, but I’ve lasted ten minutes past the time limit on a map just using it to keep the Red Deaths from reaching me. I finally got bored and manually walked into them to end the run. Funny stuff.

[Moonbane]

Yes, you can really feel CU laser is weaker now. Feels bad to use it now, especially since tiragisu is such a poor accessory, and that you actually can lose it.

Evolved firearm really needs all the projectile speedbonuses possible to fire faster than you can move. But it really becomes a sweeper when buffed, have had it deliver screenwide waves of fiery death. Though I am admittedly uncertain if its amount or area that gets it this wide.

Some times Prism lass have delivered enormous damage. Im not sure what makes it stand out that much.

[Moonbane]

The weapon box kits is more of a hindrance than adding anything worthwhile to the game. Most of the OPGuns weapons is so bad that I can not understand why its needed to have this limitation on them. Like if you try to coordinate with stage pickups. Especially since you only seem to be able to find one at a time through levelups.

It would be MUCH easier to deal with if the boxes did not require free accessory slots to drop.

Usually not worth the bother to use more than 1 OPGun weapon per run outside Neo Galuga.

[wafflekitty]

I honestly think y'all are looking too hard at optimizing the game, rather than just having fun. Most of the Contra weapons are fun to use, even if they aren't particularly strong. Not everything in the game has to be broken to be worth having in the game. It's not a competitive PvP game, balancing isn't paramount.

[Moonbane]

Originally posted by wafflekitty:

I honestly think y'all are looking too hard at optimizing the game, rather than just having fun. Most of the Contra weapons are fun to use, even if they aren't particularly strong. Not everything in the game has to be broken to be worth having in the game. It's not a competitive PvP game, balancing isn't paramount.

Its not easy to reliably setup to use multiple contra weapons in one run in other maps.

[Zephyr]

Post update, the appearance rate of power up is very good now, so that was a very welcome change, thanks for acting on community feedback so fast.

On the other hand, I'm a bit sad the laser's evolution got nerfed so bad, it was great while it lasted, now... Well, it's not worth the effort of taking the Tiramisu to be honest.

It did had a benefit of trying to make me seek an alternative in Adventure Mode. Which I did. Turns out I owe an apology to the Short Gun, because while it's naturally bad, when combined with the unassuming Hearts of Fire arcana, it becomes quite monstruous. Not as much as the missiles which becomes awesome with that, but Hearts of Fire in Adventure is a lot more efficient as a starter for Long and Short guns characters than my go to, Blood Arcana.

Short Gun guy is now one of the best starters with that particular combo until you unlock Bahamut who is a monster.

XP gains in adventure are still a problem, though.

On the topic of "optimisation", one needs to understand that without the brain teaser of trying to optimise and maximise, a game has no depth. That's the bluntness of things. There is no hook, no draw, no goal, no nothing. I need my brain stimulated in one way or an other, and I'm sure I'm not the only one.

That's why having a finely crafted and balanced system with lot of options able to do the job equally well in various fashions is important. Having interactions between the different elements and synergies is important. If some elements at any point underperform then, it's always a problem, because there is no reason to use them. A lot of games have that problem of creating one solution which is superior in ergonomy and and efficiency to all the others.

For me the best fun is when you can go at a problem with a large variety of approaches and still succeed equally well, each time doing the task in a different fashion. I like variety, so when I have one unique solution which is the best, I feel sad because I know I'm going to use it every time, and never touch the rest because it's just going to make me not have as much fun due to having sub-standard results.

[JPM岩]

Originally posted by Zephyr:

Post update, the appearance rate of power up is very good now, so that was a very welcome change, thanks for acting on community feedback so fast.

On the other hand, I'm a bit sad the laser's evolution got nerfed so bad, it was great while it lasted, now... Well, it's not worth the effort of taking the Tiramisu to be honest.

It did had a benefit of trying to make me seek an alternative in Adventure Mode. Which I did. Turns out I owe an apology to the Short Gun, because while it's naturally bad, when combined with the unassuming Hearts of Fire arcana, it becomes quite monstruous. Not as much as the missiles which becomes awesome with that, but Hearts of Fire in Adventure is a lot more efficient as a starter for Long and Short guns characters than my go to, Blood Arcana.

Short Gun guy is now one of the best starters with that particular combo until you unlock Bahamut who is a monster.

XP gains in adventure are still a problem, though.

On the topic of "optimisation", one needs to understand that without the brain teaser of trying to optimise and maximise, a game has no depth. That's the bluntness of things. There is no hook, no draw, no goal, no nothing. I need my brain stimulated in one way or an other, and I'm sure I'm not the only one.

That's why having a finely crafted and balanced system with lot of options able to do the job equally well in various fashions is important. Having interactions between the different elements and synergies is important. If some elements at any point underperform then, it's always a problem, because there is no reason to use them. A lot of games have that problem of creating one solution which is superior in ergonomy and and efficiency to all the others.

For me the best fun is when you can go at a problem with a large variety of approaches and still succeed equally well, each time doing the task in a different fashion. I like variety, so when I have one unique solution which is the best, I feel sad because I know I'm going to use it every time, and never touch the rest because it's just going to make me not have as much fun due to having sub-standard results.

Good thing you can approach things with a lot of options, with the DLC too! You just need to actually play rather than complain on the forums. Hope this helps.

[Moonbane]

Taking a shine to Stanley. His passive gaining armor from might plays extremely well with Divine Bloodline. Had 24 armor at a point without having the armor accessory.

[wafflekitty]

Originally posted by Zephyr:

Post update, the appearance rate of power up is very good now, so that was a very welcome change, thanks for acting on community feedback so fast.

On the other hand, I'm a bit sad the laser's evolution got nerfed so bad, it was great while it lasted, now... Well, it's not worth the effort of taking the Tiramisu to be honest.

It did had a benefit of trying to make me seek an alternative in Adventure Mode. Which I did. Turns out I owe an apology to the Short Gun, because while it's naturally bad, when combined with the unassuming Hearts of Fire arcana, it becomes quite monstruous. Not as much as the missiles which becomes awesome with that, but Hearts of Fire in Adventure is a lot more efficient as a starter for Long and Short guns characters than my go to, Blood Arcana.

Short Gun guy is now one of the best starters with that particular combo until you unlock Bahamut who is a monster.

XP gains in adventure are still a problem, though.

On the topic of "optimisation", one needs to understand that without the brain teaser of trying to optimise and maximise, a game has no depth. That's the bluntness of things. There is no hook, no draw, no goal, no nothing. I need my brain stimulated in one way or an other, and I'm sure I'm not the only one.

That's why having a finely crafted and balanced system with lot of options able to do the job equally well in various fashions is important. Having interactions between the different elements and synergies is important. If some elements at any point underperform then, it's always a problem, because there is no reason to use them. A lot of games have that problem of creating one solution which is superior in ergonomy and and efficiency to all the others.

For me the best fun is when you can go at a problem with a large variety of approaches and still succeed equally well, each time doing the task in a different fashion. I like variety, so when I have one unique solution which is the best, I feel sad because I know I'm going to use it every time, and never touch the rest because it's just going to make me not have as much fun due to having sub-standard results.

But you can clear runs without the very best builds. That’s the thing. You don’t have to pick the strongest stuff in the game to still win. Experiment a little. See if unusual combinations can still get the job done. There’s also cathartic enjoyment to be had in just mowing down enemies. Part of the entire point of roguelikes is having to make do with what the RNG gives you. That’s why I don’t use any seals and just let every single thing be in my pool every run. Sometimes I’ll wind up stuck with a weaker weapon or be unable to evolve one weapon because RNG was uncooperative. Can I still finish? Let’s find out. If everything in the game was good, that would make the RNG less meaningful and exciting.

[SAKURA]

Originally posted by wafflekitty:

I honestly think y'all are looking too hard at optimizing the game, rather than just having fun. Most of the Contra weapons are fun to use, even if they aren't particularly strong. Not everything in the game has to be broken to be worth having in the game. It's not a competitive PvP game, balancing isn't paramount.

Am not asking for the weapon to be broken but just make them at least decent weapons that doesn't feel weak.

[Hyper Realistic Blood]

Originally posted by SAKURA:

Originally posted by wafflekitty:

I honestly think y'all are looking too hard at optimizing the game, rather than just having fun. Most of the Contra weapons are fun to use, even if they aren't particularly strong. Not everything in the game has to be broken to be worth having in the game. It's not a competitive PvP game, balancing isn't paramount.

Am not asking for the weapon to be broken but just make them at least decent weapons that doesn't feel weak.

They don't feel weak when I can spin in a circle and clear the screen at the 25 minute mark

It's the same """problem""" the knife has always had. Because it asks for minimal player interaction, people write it off as weak. Sorry it's not Glorious Moon, sorry it requires a little backup from other weapons instead of being amazing in a vacuum, but it's still fun to use and you can still use arcana to turn half of them into bouncy weapons you don't need to aim anymore.

Like, I'll agree to disagree but I'm always going to think players tend to sell weapons short when they require some sort of effort on the player's part. The weapons aren't bad, they're just different.