Why is Mad Forest So Much Harder than the Library?

[Armitage Shanks]

The was in mad forest with the large red outlined bats and the werewolves...what am I missing? They have SO much health and overwhelm me almost immediately. Yet I breezed through the inlaid library never looking like I would die right up until around minute 28 where I just had to chug floor chicken from level ups.

What's the strat to kill the red outlined bats and werewolve? I'm using Poe (because as far as I can tell, he's miles better than anyone else I have unlocked). Like I said, he demolished library, but those red outlined bats combined with the werewolves, he can't even kill them.

[AerSilver ♞]

garlic is just better against numerous,low health enemies in general.
That's what the library is about

[Armitage Shanks]

Originally posted by AerSilver🗲:

garlic is just better against numerous,low health enemies in general.
That's what the library is about

Right. I figured it out in the end, evolved bible is broken.

[Satsujinki]

I think Garlic is better but you can pick other things, like, fire wand, whip and axe. Unless I forget what I've done mad forest already.

[Nonexistinghero]

Originally posted by Armitage Shanks:

Originally posted by AerSilver🗲:

garlic is just better against numerous,low health enemies in general.
That's what the library is about

Right. I figured it out in the end, evolved bible is broken.

Evolved Bible actually does fall off at some point as well. It's not going to protect you if you don't have other means of dps late game.

[Armitage Shanks]

Originally posted by Nonexistinghero:

Originally posted by Armitage Shanks:

Right. I figured it out in the end, evolved bible is broken.

Evolved Bible actually does fall off at some point as well. It's not going to protect you if you don't have other means of dps late game.

Not really concerned with that rn. It's 100% the best weapon to aim for evo in at the very least the first 6 maps. It does ridiculous DPS, and you always end up with other weapons anyway.

[Zephyr]

The reason the library is easier is, in my opinion, more the fact it's a lot more contained.
Enemies comes from only 2 directions, and they are all funnelled quite nicely for maximum killzone. While it takes a long way to walk from one end of it to the other, it's not nearly as long as walking all around the forest to get all the items. You have a lot less terrain elements that are obstructions you can't notice under the attack effects too. Mad Forest alternates between trickles of enemies and absolutely huge mobs surrounding you coming at high speed. It makes you very dependant of the tempo of the attacks to get things done, and your leveling also goes in ebbs and flows(the mass of bats and the mass of skeletons are two of the best moments to gain a lot of power, if your damage doesn't allow you to deal with the skeleton wave, you know you have no chance to survive what's coming next). Because enemies in the library are also more contained, picking up xp gems is also way easier, meaning you tend to level up faster.

To kill mini-bosses(anything that is larger and meaner than your run of the mill enemy, from outlined stuff to giant stuff, to out of place stuff), what you need is to pile a lot of direct damage into them. While garlic is good for survivability and groups of low health enemies, it's not good at mini-boss killing. For that you need more heavy hitting stuff. Axes work well, making them walk into holy water too, constant wand/dagger barrage too, whip if you're desperate. The fire wand is a bit too slow firing and managing to angle it correctly can be a bit of a problem. As you mentioned bible works well if you can keep it in the circle of doom. Trying to go for mini-boss kills if you can manage it is always a good idea, as the treasure chest dropped is worth 1 to 5 levels worth of upgrades, when you aren't fishing for an evolution.

[Armitage Shanks]

Why does everyone assume all I was using was garlic? I was using Poe because garlic is a great utility ability that improves the knockback off all other weapons, and I wasn't talking about mini-bosses, I was talking about the giant bats and regular werewolves, which are regular trash mobs, they just have 10x the hitpoints of everything else. King of like the lion heads and undead witches in the library. And I'd argue that because of the fact the library is just 1 long hallway that should make it more difficult as it's a lot harder to avoid the enemy because there's no latitude for movement.

[OwlRaider]

Originally posted by Armitage Shanks:

Why does everyone assume all I was using was garlic? I was using Poe because garlic is a great utility ability that improves the knockback off all other weapons, and I wasn't talking about mini-bosses, I was talking about the giant bats and regular werewolves, which are regular trash mobs, they just have 10x the hitpoints of everything else. King of like the lion heads and undead witches in the library. And I'd argue that because of the fact the library is just 1 long hallway that should make it more difficult as it's a lot harder to avoid the enemy because there's no latitude for movement.

Not sure what you're wondering about. Poe's starting weapon is garlic which is why everyone understood you're using it. It doesn't matter whether it's your primary damage weapon or a utility one, you're still using it... Basically since you only have access to 6 weapons you need to make them all count. Garlic is a weak weapon, and while it has utility and is sometimes a good addition to a build, oftentimes it's a wasted slot that doesn't do much for you.

Your starting weapon is important, especially for a newer player, as the early levels really dictate how your run is going to go. Garlic is not an ideal starting weapon and utility is quite frankly overrated for general purpose builds. Yes it can be a good weapon once you unlock enough things to make it good, like the Sarabande of Healing Arcana which you can absolutely tailor a build around. However early on when you don't have access to that many weapons, perhaps haven't even unlocked Arcanas yet, than garlic is 1 of those new player traps. It looks good on paper, it's easy to use but the opportunity cost is simply too high. Not saying it can't work, I absolutely completed plenty of runs with garlic and suboptimal builds but it's not easy to do so, especially as a newer player.

In any case, as you correctly said, mad forest is harder than the library, so I recommend you progress further in the library, unlocking more heroes, weapons, arcanas, etc, than return to the mad forest later on once you're better equipped. I don't know why the devs decided to make mad forest harder than the library, maybe it was to entice players to keep going rather than stay on the base map for too long. Whatever the reason, it is what it is, and once you have some experience and unlocks under your belt the mad forest becomes significantly easier.

[golira]

Originally posted by Zephyr:

The reason the library is easier is, in my opinion, more the fact it's a lot more contained.
Enemies comes from only 2 directions, and they are all funnelled quite nicely for maximum killzone. While it takes a long way to walk from one end of it to the other, it's not nearly as long as walking all around the forest to get all the items. You have a lot less terrain elements that are obstructions you can't notice under the attack effects too. Mad Forest alternates between trickles of enemies and absolutely huge mobs surrounding you coming at high speed. It makes you very dependant of the tempo of the attacks to get things done, and your leveling also goes in ebbs and flows(the mass of bats and the mass of skeletons are two of the best moments to gain a lot of power, if your damage doesn't allow you to deal with the skeleton wave, you know you have no chance to survive what's coming next). Because enemies in the library are also more contained, picking up xp gems is also way easier, meaning you tend to level up faster.

To kill mini-bosses(anything that is larger and meaner than your run of the mill enemy, from outlined stuff to giant stuff, to out of place stuff), what you need is to pile a lot of direct damage into them. While garlic is good for survivability and groups of low health enemies, it's not good at mini-boss killing. For that you need more heavy hitting stuff. Axes work well, making them walk into holy water too, constant wand/dagger barrage too, whip if you're desperate. The fire wand is a bit too slow firing and managing to angle it correctly can be a bit of a problem. As you mentioned bible works well if you can keep it in the circle of doom. Trying to go for mini-boss kills if you can manage it is always a good idea, as the treasure chest dropped is worth 1 to 5 levels worth of upgrades, when you aren't fishing for an evolution.

I find that the clock lancet pairs really well with the evolved bible to keep minibosses in the kill zone nearly permanently, also better with the one that reduces cooldown