My struggle with skill points...

[Bronze Dragon]

...isn't that I want more, it's that I can't figure out what to do with the ones I have. Only a handful of skills matter to me...stealth, carrying capacity, grav jump distance, etc.

- Only the first three levels of lockpicking matter; for the last one, I'm just not failing enough to make wasting a digipick to eliminate non-essential keys worth a skill point.
- Oxygen levels just haven't been an issue for me, so I don't want to waste a skill point on that.
- Same with ship combat, or armed combat - I'm just not having issues with not killing enough enemies or whatever to make anything those skills have to offer worth a skill point. Plus nothing outright tells you what qualifies as an energy weapon vs. a ballistic weapon vs. a heavy weapon, etc. You have to infer that, and I HATE having to infer shi t like that. It should tell you. Your character would know such things.
- Ship's thrusters? I mean, c'mon, Bethesda, really? I'm supposed to get stoked because I can shunt my ship just a fraction of an inch left/right, up/down? Really? Sheesh!

Don't even get me started on the science skills...BO-RING!

In point of fact, I think I could get through the entire game not having spent a single skill point and not miss it at all. I get that skill levels are supposed to make things easier. But the point is they only do so marginally at best, if that. The last ten skill points I spent, I didn't notice any difference in game play whatsoever. I wouldn't have known anything changed at all if the game didn't claim it does.

And maybe it's not just this game. They give you the illusion of progress when it really does little if anything to enhance the game experience whatsoever. By the end, at max level, you're really no better at doing things than you were at the start of the game. All the NPCs praise you but it feels unearned, because you're still just stumbling around. Skill points should make you feel cooler, more capable, more bad as s. Not...meh.

Rant over.

[RacistRonnie]

Originally posted by Bronze Dragon:

...isn't that I want more, it's that I can't figure out what to do with the ones I have. Only a handful of skills matter to me...stealth, carrying capacity, grav jump distance, etc.

- Only the first three levels of lockpicking matter; for the last one, I'm just not failing enough to make wasting a digipick to eliminate non-essential keys worth a skill point.
- Oxygen levels just haven't been an issue for me, so I don't want to waste a skill point on that.
- Same with ship combat, or armed combat - I'm just not having issues with not killing enough enemies or whatever to make anything those skills have to offer worth a skill point. Plus nothing outright tells you what qualifies as an energy weapon vs. a ballistic weapon vs. a heavy weapon, etc. You have to infer that, and I HATE having to infer shi t like that. It should tell you. Your character would know such things.
- Ship's thrusters? I mean, c'mon, Bethesda, really? I'm supposed to get stoked because I can shunt my ship just a fraction of an inch left/right, up/down? Really? Sheesh!

Don't even get me started on the science skills...BO-RING!

In point of fact, I think I could get through the entire game not having spent a single skill point and not miss it at all. I get that skill levels are supposed to make things easier. But the point is they only do so marginally at best, if that. The last ten skill points I spent, I didn't notice any difference in game play whatsoever. I wouldn't have known anything changed at all if the game didn't claim it does.

And maybe it's not just this game. They give you the illusion of progress when it really does little if anything to enhance the game experience whatsoever. By the end, at max level, you're really no better at doing things than you were at the start of the game. All the NPCs praise you but it feels unearned, because you're still just stumbling around. Skill points should make you feel cooler, more capable, more bad as s. Not...meh.

Rant over.

When in doubt, spread them out.

[wtiger27]

As far as your comment on not having any issues with ship combat and no need for the Skills for such, what level of diffculty are you playing on? Very Hard setting will change your opinion on that I bet.

Ground combat is harder also, but space ship combat on Very Hard is a lot harder. And the Ship Skills can make a huge difference in your survival. Unless you are sticking to low level planets. Go to levels 50 - 75 planets and wait for a ship fight on Very Hard.

And what Skills are the best for the player, depends on how they want to play. You have to decide that yourself.

[Bronze Dragon]

Originally posted by wtiger27:

As far as your comment on not having any issues with ship combat and no need for the Skills for such, what level of diffculty are you playing on? Very Hard setting will change your opinion on that I bet.

Ground combat is harder also, but space ship combat on Very Hard is a lot harder. And the Ship Skills can make a huge difference in your survival. Unless you are sticking to low level planets. Go to levels 50 - 75 planets and wait for a ship fight on Very Hard.

And what Skills are the best for the player, depends on how they want to play. You have to decide that yourself.

Playing on whatever mode it was set on when I first booted up the game...'normal' or whatever. Certainly not easy mode or whatever it's called.

And I don't know from planet levels, I'm just following the missions wherever they take me. I'm not paying attention to planet levels or whatever. Quite frankly didn't know there WERE planet levels.

[wtiger27]

Originally posted by Bronze Dragon:

Originally posted by wtiger27:

As far as your comment on not having any issues with ship combat and no need for the Skills for such, what level of diffculty are you playing on? Very Hard setting will change your opinion on that I bet.

Ground combat is harder also, but space ship combat on Very Hard is a lot harder. And the Ship Skills can make a huge difference in your survival. Unless you are sticking to low level planets. Go to levels 50 - 75 planets and wait for a ship fight on Very Hard.

And what Skills are the best for the player, depends on how they want to play. You have to decide that yourself.

Playing on whatever mode it was set on when I first booted up the game...'normal' or whatever. Certainly not easy mode or whatever it's called.

And I don't know from planet levels, I'm just following the missions wherever they take me. I'm not paying attention to planet levels or whatever. Quite frankly didn't know there WERE planet levels.

Well, playing on Normal is what a new player should play on. I did for about 200 or so hrs when I first started playing the game. It's smart to do that. So you can learn about the game and how you want to play it.

And yes, the game has over 120 star systems and each has a level rating. In other words, if you are level 10 and go to a level 75 planet. you can expect a much more challenging experience. In space combat and ground.

[Krash Megiddo]

Most of the planets the missions take you to are low level. Level 20 might be the highest.

Starfield is the first game I bumped up the difficulty because of the effect of skills and powers. Tiger is correct. What you're experiencing is a sign to increase the difficulty if its not fun for you anymore.

[Bronze Dragon]

Originally posted by Krash Megiddo:

Most of the planets the missions take you to are low level. Level 20 might be the highest.

Starfield is the first game I bumped up the difficulty because of the effect of skills and powers. Tiger is correct. What you're experiencing is a sign to increase the difficulty if its not fun for you anymore.

Didn't occur to me. Thanks.

(Just realized that sounded sarcastic...it wasn't! :-D)

[MadDawg2552]

My issue with skills is that you have to gain a player level to get a skill point. I might have the requirements to get my food skill up because I ate enough sammiches, but I have to go kill more spacers to get better at eating sammiches.

If they wanted to use skill points, they should give me skill points for eating sammiches.

[Jase]

Why wouldn't you want improvements? Improvement is always good, by definition.

[Johny_Drifter]

I am level 140 and still dont have Lockpicking level 4. I have quite a few skills that I have only leveled up to 3. I play exclusively on Very Hard difficulty and enjoy the combat side of the game but that also requires me to dip into the crafting side a bit so that I can improve the weapons I buy or find. You will figure out what you need and don't need based on your style of play. If you only enjoy the combat portion of the game then there are a few skills in Science you will want to pursue such as Medicine 4. Then you will want get Weapon Engineering maxed out and go for Special Projects 1 (Dont even bother with Special Projects 2-4 unless you are interested in building outposts). I found Spacesuit Engineering useful in early game but now that I am NG+10 with Venator armor, I don't even mess with other armors so it's kind of pointless. If you like space combat then you will definitely want Aneutronic Fusion maxed out to tier 4 because it gives your ships reactor additional power.

I recently started to delve into outpost building and kind of wish I didn't. I wanted to see what that side of the game provided so I built up my Outpost Management (Science), Scanning, and Special Projects all to level 4. That was indeed a waste of skill points because I find the outpost building portion of the game rather boring and time consuming. I could have used those skill points better somewhere else because at level 140, it takes a little while to get enough XP to level up.

When you start going after Powers and you progress through the NG+ side of the game, you will definitely want Fitness level 4 and Gymnastics Level 2. You will be running long distances to temples and Fitness makes this much easier. Once inside the temples, you will experience zero G and you will need to move thru zero G to grab orbs in order to unlock the gates. Gymnastics level 2 lets you move in zero G much faster and will make temples much less frustrating.

I admit there are many skills that seem pointless. For example, Research Methods seems like a waste. I have all research completed on Outposts, Spacesuits and weapons and I haven't devoted any skill points into Research Methods. Once you complete all of the possible research, then those points that you invest into Research Methods dont do anything at all.

[Krash Megiddo]

Originally posted by Johny_Drifter:

I am level 140 and still dont have Lockpicking level 4. I have quite a few skills that I have only leveled up to 3. I play exclusively on Very Hard difficulty and enjoy the combat side of the game but that also requires me to dip into the crafting side a bit so that I can improve the weapons I buy or find. You will figure out what you need and don't need based on your style of play. If you only enjoy the combat portion of the game then there are a few skills in Science you will want to pursue such as Medicine 4. Then you will want get Weapon Engineering maxed out and go for Special Projects 1 (Dont even bother with Special Projects 2-4 unless you are interested in building outposts). I found Spacesuit Engineering useful in early game but now that I am NG+10 with Venator armor, I don't even mess with other armors so it's kind of pointless. If you like space combat then you will definitely want Aneutronic Fusion maxed out to tier 4 because it gives your ships reactor additional power.

I recently started to delve into outpost building and kind of wish I didn't. I wanted to see what that side of the game provided so I built up my Outpost Management (Science), Scanning, and Special Projects all to level 4. That was indeed a waste of skill points because I find the outpost building portion of the game rather boring and time consuming. I could have used those skill points better somewhere else because at level 140, it takes a little while to get enough XP to level up.

When you start going after Powers and you progress through the NG+ side of the game, you will definitely want Fitness level 4 and Gymnastics Level 2. You will be running long distances to temples and Fitness makes this much easier. Once inside the temples, you will experience zero G and you will need to move thru zero G to grab orbs in order to unlock the gates. Gymnastics level 2 lets you move in zero G much faster and will make temples much less frustrating.

I admit there are many skills that seem pointless. For example, Research Methods seems like a waste. I have all research completed on Outposts, Spacesuits and weapons and I haven't devoted any skill points into Research Methods. Once you complete all of the possible research, then those points that you invest into Research Methods dont do anything at all.

Good analysis. I build a lot of outposts in every universe. I think Research Methods 4 reduces the mats needed for all crafting requirements, correct? That's very helpful starting off in a NG+ with those costs reduced.

[Johny_Drifter]

Originally posted by Krash Megiddo:

Good analysis. I build a lot of outposts in every universe. I think Research Methods 4 reduces the mats needed for all crafting requirements, correct? That's very helpful starting off in a NG+ with those costs reduced.

I don't really know. Since I haven't devoted any skill points into Research Methods, I don't really truly know what benefits it has or can provide. I assumed (from the skill description) that it makes research projects faster and uses less resources to complete research projects but since research is instantaneous, I don't know what the purpose is in making it faster. I suppose it may benefit crafting by using fewer resources but I have never had a problem buying the resources I need. I doesn't seem like a very important skill to have.

[GoldInfinit7]

If you are not investing in specific Science and Technology skills then you are missing out on some things. If you are investing in piloting and upgrading to the best starships you need to invest in specific technology skills. If you want to mod the best weapons and equipment you need to invest in specific science skills. If you are interested in quickly and more easily surveying planets, plant, and wild life, then you also need to invest in specific Science. If you want to build all there is possible to build in Outposts, you need to invest in Science.

Also, you can't Research specific stuff, without investing in specific Social and Science skills. If you value crafting and modding stuff then Science is important in addition to Social and Technology (in regards to starships)
 
Also, specific skills give you unique dialog options in this game. For example, Starship Engineering gives you unique responses when discussing it.

The good thing, is that there is no Level Cap, and you can keep earning Skill Points. However, at a specific level, I believe you can see which Skills are most important to you and which Skills you can make due without.

[alanc9]

At some point you definitely reach a diminishing returns point on skills, yeah. NG+ is about powers and getting your loot back.

[Knottypine]

Originally posted by Bronze Dragon:

Ship's thrusters? I mean, c'mon, Bethesda, really? I'm supposed to get stoked because I can shunt my ship just a fraction of an inch left/right, up/down? Really? Sheesh!

Don't even get me started on the science skills...BO-RING!

In point of fact, I think I could get through the entire game not having spent a single skill point and not miss it at all.

Two things to point out.

First, I too thought that having access to thrusters was not really beneficial. When I asked here in the forums why someone thought they were great, they explained to me that you can in fact rotate your ship around and fly in reverse at full speed. It's not perfect but does allow you to swing around and face a ship behind you and use your forward facing weapons. Certainly not necessary but could come in handy.

Second, while you may find the science skills boring, there are some very handy skills in there. Of course you can literally ignore every skill. If however, you want to install higher tier mods on your weapons or spacesuit, you will need some investment. Also, aneutronic fusion offers 5 extra units of power to your reactor at rank 4.

[Bronze Dragon]

Originally posted by Johny_Drifter:

I am level 140 and still dont have Lockpicking level 4. I have quite a few skills that I have only leveled up to 3. I play exclusively on Very Hard difficulty and enjoy the combat side of the game but that also requires me to dip into the crafting side a bit so that I can improve the weapons I buy or find. You will figure out what you need and don't need based on your style of play. If you only enjoy the combat portion of the game then there are a few skills in Science you will want to pursue such as Medicine 4. Then you will want get Weapon Engineering maxed out and go for Special Projects 1 (Dont even bother with Special Projects 2-4 unless you are interested in building outposts). I found Spacesuit Engineering useful in early game but now that I am NG+10 with Venator armor, I don't even mess with other armors so it's kind of pointless. If you like space combat then you will definitely want Aneutronic Fusion maxed out to tier 4 because it gives your ships reactor additional power.

I recently started to delve into outpost building and kind of wish I didn't. I wanted to see what that side of the game provided so I built up my Outpost Management (Science), Scanning, and Special Projects all to level 4. That was indeed a waste of skill points because I find the outpost building portion of the game rather boring and time consuming. I could have used those skill points better somewhere else because at level 140, it takes a little while to get enough XP to level up.

When you start going after Powers and you progress through the NG+ side of the game, you will definitely want Fitness level 4 and Gymnastics Level 2. You will be running long distances to temples and Fitness makes this much easier. Once inside the temples, you will experience zero G and you will need to move thru zero G to grab orbs in order to unlock the gates. Gymnastics level 2 lets you move in zero G much faster and will make temples much less frustrating.

I admit there are many skills that seem pointless. For example, Research Methods seems like a waste. I have all research completed on Outposts, Spacesuits and weapons and I haven't devoted any skill points into Research Methods. Once you complete all of the possible research, then those points that you invest into Research Methods dont do anything at all.

What do you mean by going after powers? I don't see anything like that in the skills lists.

Does the game offer NG+ without mods?

Sadly, I find most games become empty of anything - NPCs, monsters, interesting features, etc. - once you complete the stories.