Fremenless In Arrakis

[Twelvefield]

This is something I've been considering for some time, but I don't have enough experience with the game to answer this for myself:

Is it possible to play a viable, winning game with zero contact with the Fremen? i.e., you never use a Fremen planetary and alliance space and you never choose any Fremen cards. The other players play normally.

[noctilucus]

Some people have managed to do so. The hardest part is that this means you barely get any water and therefore you cut yourself off from most spice fields, as well as heighliner.
So apparently possible but definitely a serious challenge!

[Twelvefield]

The Fremen are the main human custodians of the Arrakeen ecosystem. A fundamental theme in the book arises from misunderstanding the Fremen role. If the Harkonnens had a greater set of data on the Fremen, they probably would have acted differently. For example, the Harkonnens and the Ixians get along: the Fremen could have been a similar resource.

The Spacing Guild has the most accurate estimate of Fremen strength, but the Fremen bribe them to keep their numbers secret. If there had been some sort of "wikileaks" and those estimates became public, my thought is that the Great Houses could have combined to wipe out or completely subjugate the Fremen before the Atreides arrive. Then, you'd get a Fremen-free Arrakis, which is close to what I was considering. More correctly, you could project such force that the Fremen become irrelevant, if you had enough force.

That goes way far against the ethics proposed by Frank Herbert, and likely would annihilate the planet, but it's just a thought experiment. Thanks for humouring me!

[Trolleur_Durden]

Originally posted by Twelvefield:

This is something I've been considering for some time, but I don't have enough experience with the game to answer this for myself:

Is it possible to play a viable, winning game with zero contact with the Fremen? i.e., you never use a Fremen planetary and alliance space and you never choose any Fremen cards. The other players play normally.

This challenge sounds quite hard, to say the least. It means that you play with 3 less spaces (2 Fremen spaces and Sietch Tabr) and have much less access to 6 other spaces (2 deserts spaces and Research station, which need water),

Your best bet would probably be Helena, because she can't be denied the remaining spaces. From there, it's basically all about taking strong cards in the Imperium row and going as much as possible on Carthag and hoping for some decisive intrigue cards.

[Harry Flashman]

There's a fun challenge that requires this... looks tough at first but (as noted above) Helena can handle it.

[Twelvefield]

I DID IT!!! I am so pleased with myself! On Hard, I won with Baron Harkonnen and I never touched any Fremen spaces or cards. Very lucky, with the AI players stabbing each other, and that there weren't a lot of battles drawn that had victory points. Very early on, I was able to get a seat on the Council and hire Gurney and Jessica, and I more or less bought or allied to get my VPs. No desert power at all. Gurney was a tough nut because of his affinity for the Fremen spaces, but throw money at the problem and it ceases to be a problem.

Now against humans, who knows. That would be harder, especially when the other players suss out what I am trying to do. But it is possible!

[Dire Wolf CS]

Originally posted by Twelvefield:

I DID IT!!! I am so pleased with myself! On Hard, I won with Baron Harkonnen and I never touched any Fremen spaces or cards. Very lucky, with the AI players stabbing each other, and that there weren't a lot of battles drawn that had victory points. Very early on, I was able to get a seat on the Council and hire Gurney and Jessica, and I more or less bought or allied to get my VPs. No desert power at all. Gurney was a tough nut because of his affinity for the Fremen spaces, but throw money at the problem and it ceases to be a problem.

Now against humans, who knows. That would be harder, especially when the other players suss out what I am trying to do. But it is possible!

CONGRATS!!