Make running something external in game prefix easier

[gonococcus]

Add ability to run something into the specific steam (or non) game prefix. It would be very useful for different mods/patches/language packs installation. For now it is something really tricky: you need to add something as a non-steam game, than manually find the game files into the library etc.
I see solution as just a button in game settings: you press it, choose exe file and exec it into the same prefix with the same proton version.

[deaddoof]

May I ask why you cannot do it yourself?

Vast majority of Linux users setup bash variables. For instance, WINEPREFIX is a defined path so you can tell wine or proton where to find the files. You can setup variables for wine version etc.

https://wiki.winehq.org/FAQ#Wineprefixes

Asking for a solution without completely understand the usecase will make it difficult for everyone involved.

Even if you see the solution, it forces Valve to maintain various names etc.

[gonococcus]

Originally posted by deaddoof:

May I ask why you cannot do it yourself?

Of course I can do it myself. But it's not something what casual user will able to do. I ask about some easy and straightforward solution which is very easy to implement actually. Linux users can do whatever they want, I talk about "usual users".

Originally posted by deaddoof:

Even if you see the solution, it forces Valve to maintain various names etc.

Maintain what? Button which will open file selector and then run exe file into the same prefix?) Very complex feature, I see.

[deaddoof]

Originally posted by an9949an:

Of course I can do it myself. But it's not something what casual user will able to do. I ask about some easy and straightforward solution which is very easy to implement actually. Linux users can do whatever they want, I talk about "usual users".

Opfff. The feature is much less straight forward. Exe stuff exposes quite a bit OS implementations. We are entering an age where the usual user do not know what is a hierarchical filesystem. You gotta spend a lot more works to show this configuration is easy for users.

Maintain what? Button which will open file selector and then run exe file into the same prefix?) Very complex feature, I see.

Yea. you will be surprise at the pain. In Linux land, flame wars are pretty common over this small stuff. In fact, many wise maintainers pretty much push back on these feature for this reason.

You gotta write user story stuff and specify the bare minimum need for this stuff to work.

[gonococcus]

Originally posted by deaddoof:

Opfff. The feature is much less straight forward. Exe stuff exposes quite a bit OS implementations.

Opening the file selector and choosing the file to run it's something clear for most of user which want to do something like this (mods installing for example). At least much easier than reading wine docs, write bash scripts etc. Only experienced linux users will do this. But experienced linux users can work without GUI at all, why steam os have it? Lets just show console on black screen and it's enough.

Originally posted by deaddoof:

You gotta write user story stuff and specify the bare minimum need for this stuff to work.

I am developer as well and I see this story as something very easy to implement. Just select and run file, where is the problem at all? Also it's not an opensource "Linux land", it's Valve. So let them decide.

[deaddoof]

Originally posted by an9949an:

Originally posted by deaddoof:

Opfff. The feature is much less straight forward. Exe stuff exposes quite a bit OS implementations.

Opening the file selector and choosing the file to run it's something clear for most of user which want to do something like this (mods installing for example). At least much easier than reading wine docs, write bash scripts etc. Only experienced linux users will do this. But experienced linux users can work without GUI at all, why steam os have it? Lets just show console on black screen and it's enough.

Originally posted by deaddoof:

You gotta write user story stuff and specify the bare minimum need for this stuff to work.

I am developer as well and I see this story as something very easy to implement. Just select and run file, where is the problem at all? Also it's not an opensource "Linux land", it's Valve. So let them decide.

Dude, UX stuff matters. Do not make the user learn too much. I understand your point but UX man.

[gonococcus]

Originally posted by deaddoof:

Dude, UX stuff matters. Do not make the user learn too much. I understand your point but UX man.

I really confused and don't understand what you are talking about...

There are some thing users often want to do: install something into the same scope with game into the clear way they usually do it on windows (just choose file and run).

My proposal: add button like "exec file" into the game properties (not global, I mean properties on the specific game page) which will open file selector, let user to just choose the file and then run it into the game prefix (user even don't need to know what is wine and prefix at all).

Your proposal: read wine docs, write bash script, easy peasy.

Then you tell that I "make the user learn too much". Maybe I miss something? Explain then please.

[deaddoof]

Originally posted by an9949an:

Originally posted by deaddoof:

Dude, UX stuff matters. Do not make the user learn too much. I understand your point but UX man.

I really confused and don't understand what you are talking about...

There are some thing users often want to do: install something into the same scope with game into the clear way they usually do it on windows (just choose file and run).

My proposal: add button like "exec file" into the game properties (not global, I mean properties on the specific game page) which will open file selector, let user to just choose the file and then run it into the game prefix (user even don't need to know what is wine and prefix at all).

Your proposal: read wine docs, write bash script, easy peasy.

Then you tell that I "make the user learn too much". Maybe I miss something? Explain then please.

Steam deck is meant to be a plug in and play console. Even simple stuff like "exec" seems a little cryptic for the average user. Mobile users do not even know about the filesystem structure anymore as they abuse the share button. I believe Valve will care more if you can demonstrate a user friend UX case.

[gonococcus]

Originally posted by deaddoof:

Steam deck is meant to be a plug in and play console. Even simple stuff like "exec" seems a little cryptic for the average user. Mobile users do not even know about the filesystem structure anymore as they abuse the share button. I believe Valve will care more if you can demonstrate a user friend UX case.

Who force average user to click this button? Very average user don't install mods at all. But if the user downloaded a mod for the game, then he should already know that it is a file, and he needs to find it in the downloads folder and somehow launch it, no? It works like this everywhere. And what could be easier to run file than just press button "run file" and run file?

[deaddoof]

Originally posted by an9949an:

Originally posted by deaddoof:

Steam deck is meant to be a plug in and play console. Even simple stuff like "exec" seems a little cryptic for the average user. Mobile users do not even know about the filesystem structure anymore as they abuse the share button. I believe Valve will care more if you can demonstrate a user friend UX case.

Who force average user to click this button? Very average user don't install mods at all. But if the user downloaded a mod for the game, then he should already know that it is a file, and he needs to find it in the downloads folder and somehow launch it, no? It works like this everywhere. And what could be easier to run file than just press button "run file" and run file?

I think you do not realize how much Valve cares. Let's look at non-steam games.

In Steam client, they added the ability to index non-steam games with a few simple clicks.

1. Click non-steam games
2. Search .desktop file
3. Add the game to the library

Why do I want to highlight this UX? Although its kinda limited in selection, Valve tries to be inviting. All gamers want to play with mods or other cool features, but not gamers can use it. Let's look at another non-game application for the deck. We will inspect nested desktop into game mode.

#!/bin/sh

# Remove the performance overlay, it meddles with some tasks
unset LD_PRELOAD

## Shadow kwin_wayland_wrapper so that we can pass args to kwin wrapper 
## whilst being launched by plasma-session
mkdir $XDG_RUNTIME_DIR/nested_plasma -p
cat <<EOF > $XDG_RUNTIME_DIR/nested_plasma/kwin_wayland_wrapper
#!/bin/sh
/usr/bin/kwin_wayland_wrapper --width 1280 --height 800 --no-lockscreen \$@
EOF
chmod a+x $XDG_RUNTIME_DIR/nested_plasma/kwin_wayland_wrapper
export PATH=$XDG_RUNTIME_DIR/nested_plasma:$PATH

dbus-run-session startplasma-wayland

rm $XDG_RUNTIME_DIR/nested_plasma/kwin_wayland_wrapper

You can setup this script as a non steam game as run it in gamemode. This nested desktop allows users to switch between game and desktop without resorting to login in to the desktop.

Well, Valve more likely thought this feature is too much work and error prone to work. Instead, Steam OS 3.5 added a .desktop file in

/usr/share/applications/steam/steamos-nested-desktop

Instead of saving a file and touching many random settings, Valve save us a lot of hassle and sent a config file. Even better, the desktop file suggest a new feature which is editable icons settings for the steam deck.

UX matters. We can see non trivial UX for the Amazon's 1 click button.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-QqIyICyXbU

Valve is known to test. This stuff is kinda boring to test over and over again when Valve is a game company.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Yomqk0C6kE

[gonococcus]

This is good, but I still don't understand how this relates to installing mods... Mods installing require to run some executable a-priori. And I don't see more user friendly UX flow than just allow doing this in some easy way for peoples who need this. Ok, maybe also add some warning about "your own risk blablabla" to prevent user to do something accidentally.
What else can be done for this purpose? And which testing is required? Test that file runs and this is it. Everything else is on user.

[deaddoof]

Originally posted by an9949an:

This is good, but I still don't understand how this relates to installing mods... Mods installing require to run some executable a-priori. And I don't see more user friendly UX flow than just allow doing this in some easy way for peoples who need this. Ok, maybe also add some warning about "your own risk blablabla" to prevent user to do something accidentally.
What else can be done for this purpose?

Yea. Remember, we are convincing Valve to implement a new feature. Valve is pretty receptive overall. Welcome to the hard work of figuring out how to provide a goal to make things better.

That Amazon example has a simple goal of one click. What is your UX goal? I understand you have a technical goal. What is your UX goal?