Support HDMI CEC

[hup]

Can the deck get support for HDMI CEC
So then turn it on my TV, will switch HDMI input

[[EW] Mitsie]

Škoda 14Tr님이 먼저 게시:

https://www.anandtech.com/show/8558/displayport-alternate-mode-for-usb-typec-announced

HDMI is created from a DP signal via a converter. DP++ (the passive HDMI pass-thru) is not supported on the DP Alt mode.

That article is from 2014

[Prezidentas]

EW Mitsie님이 먼저 게시:

Škoda 14Tr님이 먼저 게시:

https://www.anandtech.com/show/8558/displayport-alternate-mode-for-usb-typec-announced

HDMI is created from a DP signal via a converter. DP++ (the passive HDMI pass-thru) is not supported on the DP Alt mode.

That article is from 2014

Yes, and the v2 came out for the USB4 standard, which deck definitely doesn't have.

[[EW] Mitsie]

Škoda 14Tr님이 먼저 게시:

EW Mitsie님이 먼저 게시:

That article is from 2014

Yes, and the v2 came out for the USB4 standard, which deck definitely doesn't have.

Alt Mode is a functional extension of USB-C which enables the USB connection to carry non-USB signals. It's the device that drives the DP-alt mode, not the cable or the USB version. And the latest DP-alt mode supports HDMI2.0-alt mode out of the box. Research it.

HDMI 2.0 was released in 2013.

[Prezidentas]

EW Mitsie님이 먼저 게시:

Škoda 14Tr님이 먼저 게시:

Yes, and the v2 came out for the USB4 standard, which deck definitely doesn't have.

Alt Mode is a functional extension of USB-C which enables the USB connection to carry non-USB signals. It's the device that drives the DP-alt mode, not the cable or the USB version. And the latest DP-alt mode supports HDMI2.0-alt mode out of the box. Research it.

HDMI 2.0 was released in 2013.

I give you a link, which has the info about HDMI 2.0 support (which gets converted from DisplayPort). You haven't even read the article, you dismissed it as being "from 2014", as if it's massively different from the v1.4 aboard the deck. It even has slides from VESA itself that shows an active converter being used within the HDMI dock/cable. Then you tell me to "research it".

You have absolutely nothing yet to back it up. Give me a link which says that DP Alt mode supports HDMI alt mode.

[[EW] Mitsie]

Škoda 14Tr님이 먼저 게시:

EW Mitsie님이 먼저 게시:

Alt Mode is a functional extension of USB-C which enables the USB connection to carry non-USB signals. It's the device that drives the DP-alt mode, not the cable or the USB version. And the latest DP-alt mode supports HDMI2.0-alt mode out of the box. Research it.

HDMI 2.0 was released in 2013.

I give you a link, which has the info about HDMI 2.0 support (which gets converted from DisplayPort). You haven't even read the article, you dismissed it as being "from 2014", as if it's massively different from the v1.4 aboard the deck. It even has slides from VESA itself that shows an active converter being used within the HDMI dock/cable. Then you tell me to "research it".

You have absolutely nothing yet to back it up. Give me a link which says that DP Alt mode supports HDMI alt mode.

You clearly didn't read the article, because if you did, you would see the display port lane can be used to transmit other types of data such as thunderbolt, HDMI and HDCP. And there is one port on the USB-C cable for device identification. It doesn't convert the data. The channel is used to transmit different types of data along the same wires. Be it display port or HDMI signal.

The HDMI protocol has had "direct connect to source" since HDMI 1.2. So no need for an adapter or converter.

[Prezidentas]

You are right in that regard, even if you got it backwards. The USB-C alternative modes re-purpose USB lanes for other protocols, like Thunderbolt, DP or HDMI. That's how alternative modes work.
But what this has to do with HDMI support? If the Deck doesn't support HDMI Alt mode, those lanes will never see an HDMI signal. Same with thunderbolt.

[[EW] Mitsie]

Škoda 14Tr님이 먼저 게시:

You are right in that regard, even if you got it backwards. The USB-C alternative modes re-purpose USB lanes for other protocols, like Thunderbolt, DP or HDMI. That's how alternative modes work.
But what this has to do with HDMI support? If the Deck doesn't support HDMI Alt mode, those lanes will never see an HDMI signal. Same with thunderbolt.

The device identification channel is used for both devices to identify themselves and then Send the correct data along the USB-C Cable.

HDMI has had "direct connect to source" since HDMI 1.2.

What do you mean if they never see a HDMI signal? I have two docks. The official dock with a Display Port and HDMI output. And a JSAUX dock with only HDMI out.

You have already said DP-alt supports HDMI 2.0 and admitted that different signals are sent via the display port lanes such as HDMI after device identification handshake.

[Prezidentas]

EW Mitsie님이 먼저 게시:

Škoda 14Tr님이 먼저 게시:

You are right in that regard, even if you got it backwards. The USB-C alternative modes re-purpose USB lanes for other protocols, like Thunderbolt, DP or HDMI. That's how alternative modes work.
But what this has to do with HDMI support? If the Deck doesn't support HDMI Alt mode, those lanes will never see an HDMI signal. Same with thunderbolt.

What do you mean if they never see a HDMI signal? I have two docks. The official dock with a Display Port and HDMI output. And a JSAUX dock with only HDMI out.

The dock doesn't use HDMI, it takes DP and converts it internally. Even my 3rd party dongle in the manual talks about mandatory DP Alt mode support, and it only has HDMI out.

It's probably due to cost - HDMI standard requires royalties, and DP is free...

[[EW] Mitsie]

Škoda 14Tr님이 먼저 게시:

EW Mitsie님이 먼저 게시:

What do you mean if they never see a HDMI signal? I have two docks. The official dock with a Display Port and HDMI output. And a JSAUX dock with only HDMI out.

The dock doesn't use HDMI, it takes DP and converts it internally. Even my 3rd party dongle in the manual talks about mandatory DP Alt mode support, and it only has HDMI out.

It's probably due to cost - HDMI standard requires royalties, and DP is free...

Read the article again. It tells you about HDMI "Direct Connect to Source" that has been around since HDMI 1.2. which allows you to connect USB-C direct to HDMI without any convertor or adapter.

You send these articles and you don't even read them yourself.

[Prezidentas]

The problem is that Direct Connect source has only one result on Google. So it's hard to figure anything out.

It doesn't matter anyways since I found out that apparently DP supports some kind of CEC from version 1.3. Now if it's compatible with HDMI CEC is another question that requires additional research.

However, no matter what tricks are used, the deck doesn't have HDMI Alt mode. It does everything thru the DP Alt mode.

[[EW] Mitsie]

Yes but this is where the problem in your analysis lies. If you have done work with electronics, you will know that cables are just like pipes.

And the signals sent between the two ends are just binary electical signals.

You keep saying It's sent by Display Port. But display port is only a connector and transport configuration. What is actually sent down the cable is video data and audio data in binary electrical signals.

The cable is only a pipe sending data from one end to the other.

[[EW] Mitsie]

Škoda 14Tr님이 먼저 게시:

The problem is that Direct Connect source has only one result on Google. So it's hard to figure anything out.

From a article from 2015:

The “Direct Connect Source Spec” part of the HDMI standard has allowed the development of direct Display Port to HDMI 1.2 cables. In the past, these had to be made with adaptors. Using an adaptor meant more HDMI parts (and licence costs) and was, apparently, resisted by HDMI, but the terms of the standard allow it, so they have been unable to stop the move. We heard that the spec will also allow direct USB Type C to HDMI cables in the future.

[Prezidentas]

EW Mitsie님이 먼저 게시:

Yes but this is where the problem in your analysis lies. If you have done work with electronics, you will know that cables are just like pipes.

And the signals sent between the two ends are just binary electical signals.

You keep saying It's sent by Display Port. But display port is only a connector and transport configuration. What is actually sent down the cable is video data and audio data in binary electrical signals.

The cable is only a pipe sending data from one end to the other.

DisplayPort not just a "connector", it's an entire protocol.

[Drakon]

+1

[[EW] Mitsie]

Škoda 14Tr님이 먼저 게시:

EW Mitsie님이 먼저 게시:

Yes but this is where the problem in your analysis lies. If you have done work with electronics, you will know that cables are just like pipes.

And the signals sent between the two ends are just binary electical signals.

You keep saying It's sent by Display Port. But display port is only a connector and transport configuration. What is actually sent down the cable is video data and audio data in binary electrical signals.

The cable is only a pipe sending data from one end to the other.

DisplayPort not just a "connector", it's an entire protocol.

Do you not understand electronics?

If I have two computers and I create a cable with HDMI on one end and Displayport on the other.

I get one machine to send "Hello World" in binary code to the other machine, then on the other machine I get it to interpret the text through the graphics cards by reading the binary code.

I have written a protocol! A way of sending and receiving data between machines. DisplayPort is the connector on the wire.

What your getting confused with is the Software to interpret data through a Display Port connector is also called the Displayport Protocol. Basically a copy paste of code used by manufacturers to instantly provide support for display port devices.. But you can use the display port connector to send any type of data through it's headers. Aslong as you write the protocol yourself for both devices..

Hence why there are HDMI to Display port cables you can buy. Because it just sends HDMI binary data over the wire..

Believe me I have been through this with my work. We had to build a coin-operated juke box. The coin box would send Binary data through wires based on what coin was inserted. It didn't have a set connector, so I had to make my own internal USB connector, then write the code (Protocol) to interpret the binary into signals that could be used to add credit to the jukebox software and also send the correct binary data back to the coin box to give change..

If you had done something similar in electronics, you would realise what im saying is true..