A & B reversed.

[DankWestern]

I am having a hard time dealing with A and B buttons being reversed from logical placement of other schemes.

Typically, the button where "A" is would be "B" so muscle memory tells me to press it to cancel things, and vice versa with "B" being where "A" normally is to accept.

I have tried remapping them, enabling the Nintendo scheme thing, but the ingame prompts don't follow suit, meaning, it may tell me to press "A" to cancel things as God intended, but when I press "A" where it usually is on the controller, it cancels.

Anyone know if there is any way to align the control schemes to the ingame prompts for games that don't have customizable controls, or am I just forced to deal with it?

Thanks in advance for reading this stupid discussion. :)

[Boblin the Goblin]

Originally posted by DankWestern:

I am having a hard time dealing with A and B buttons being reversed from logical placement of other schemes.

Typically, the button where "A" is would be "B" so muscle memory tells me to press it to cancel things, and vice versa with "B" being where "A" normally is to accept.

I have tried remapping them, enabling the Nintendo scheme thing, but the ingame prompts don't follow suit, meaning, it may tell me to press "A" to cancel things as God intended, but when I press "A" where it usually is on the controller, it cancels.

Anyone know if there is any way to align the control schemes to the ingame prompts for games that don't have customizable controls, or am I just forced to deal with it?

Thanks in advance for reading this stupid discussion. :)

It depends on the game. Some you can align it properly but editing the controls scheme outside and inside the game, others you can't.

[Brohands McSmooth]

I just had a discussion about this. To answer your question first, yes, just change what the button presses do in-game or with the game specific layout. I don't know if you can do this for the gaming mode GUI as a whole, but if you did the button labels would be wrong.

But the Deck is not the outlier, Nintendo is the outlier. PS/XBOX/DECK have A/X in the same spot and B/O in the same spot. Even the Sega Dreamcast and Saturn are this way. Relative to almost everything else, Nintendo is the different one.

[BlueRobin]

Yup, unfortunately, Nintendo is the outlier here. Makes it really awkward when you're more used to one setup and switch to another.

[Boblin the Goblin]

To be fair, the Nintendo layout feels more natural because your thumb rests more to the side of the controller and not the bottom.

[DankWestern]

Originally posted by KittenGrindr:

It depends on the game. Some you can align it properly but editing the controls scheme outside and inside the game, others you can't.

Originally posted by DankWestern:

Anyone know if there is any way to align the control schemes to the ingame prompts for games that don't have customizable controls, or am I just forced to deal with it?

Yep, that was the basis of my discussion; is there any solution, or are games without mappable controls just going to be awkward for ever?

Originally posted by Brohands McSmooth:

I just had a discussion about this. To answer your question first, yes, just change what the button presses do in-game or with the game specific layout. I don't know if you can do this for the gaming mode GUI as a whole, but if you did the button labels would be wrong.

But the Deck is not the outlier, Nintendo is the outlier. PS/XBOX/DECK have A/X in the same spot and B/O in the same spot. Even the Sega Dreamcast and Saturn are this way. Relative to almost everything else, Nintendo is the different one.

Hm, this is valid. I am using a Nintendo Switch Pro Controller. I grew up with SNES, A meant accept, and B meant cancel. Naturally, I moved onto Playstation where the button layout was fundamentally the same for most games. X was cancel, and O was accept, in the same places that the B and A buttons were, so I just got used to that scheme.

Bottom button < in a vertical cross of 4 buttons > was accept, and right button was cancel.

I then went to PS2, then Xbox360, then Xbone and PS4, and I never had any frustrations navigating games with accept/cancel because they all followed that muscle memory layout...

It's just weird to see "Press A" and have it in a different muscle memory location, it's like seeing and hearing one thing, but having to smell and taste it to make it work.

Probably a weird 'me problem' but thanks everyone so far.

[retrogunner]

Granted, Nintendont OG controller was D-pad AB, then SNES added a couple more buttons. Sega and others after NES did their thing. Everyone was trying to maintain their standard for their platform. Okay.

BUT, change and progress occurs. And, mappings could be something else for different regions -- kind of why Sony uses Symbols and not letters - not language specific.

However, when other console makers dominate the market and set the standard by consensus, well, that's life. Adapt or die. Heck, PS & Xbox controller buttons do the same thing though labeled differently. Nintendont has always tried non-traditional controller schemes - N64 or Wii anyone? Bueller? Bueller?

Don't get me wrong, I play emulators on everything: Phone, Tablet, PC, GPX Wiz, Ordoid Go/Advance/Super, Wii (Homebrewed with RetroArch). Steam Deck. I understand your muscle memory issue.

If you're not playing Emu's and this is just muscle memory when you pick up a stick, well, you'll be trying to bend nearly every game to your muscle memory. With Emu's, I've found it's easier to map them to the Industry standard ABXY vs BAYX.

Alternatively, maybe you should consider playing with an 8-bitdo controller like I do. Many models have stick configurations like xbox or playstation controllers AND have button hotswaps/button-modes. Plus, SteamOS is getting Switch Controller profiles so you could use a Switch Pro controller.

Oh, and when dealing with muscle memory, it's super helpful when the controller is significantly different. For example Xbox vs PS. If you're going to get a different controller, make sure it feels & handles different. Your muscle memory will start to "know" which grip is associate with ABYX vs BAYX.

It's not always ideal to play with a secondary controller with the Deck, but you might not have an option for your muscle memory.

(BTW, I'm thankful for PC gaming. I've an NES through PS2 & XBox360 -- I'm way finished with Console "tax".)

[Brohands McSmooth]

Originally posted by DankWestern:

Originally posted by Brohands McSmooth:

I just had a discussion about this. To answer your question first, yes, just change what the button presses do in-game or with the game specific layout. I don't know if you can do this for the gaming mode GUI as a whole, but if you did the button labels would be wrong.

But the Deck is not the outlier, Nintendo is the outlier. PS/XBOX/DECK have A/X in the same spot and B/O in the same spot. Even the Sega Dreamcast and Saturn are this way. Relative to almost everything else, Nintendo is the different one.

Hm, this is valid. I am using a Nintendo Switch Pro Controller. I grew up with SNES, A meant accept, and B meant cancel. Naturally, I moved onto Playstation where the button layout was fundamentally the same for most games. X was cancel, and O was accept, in the same places that the B and A buttons were, so I just got used to that scheme.

Bottom button < in a vertical cross of 4 buttons > was accept, and right button was cancel.

I then went to PS2, then Xbox360, then Xbone and PS4, and I never had any frustrations navigating games with accept/cancel because they all followed that muscle memory layout...

It's just weird to see "Press A" and have it in a different muscle memory location, it's like seeing and hearing one thing, but having to smell and taste it to make it work.

Probably a weird 'me problem' but thanks everyone so far.

It's your device, so even if it as a "weird" "you problem" it's worth fixing for you. However I think you may be slightly misremembering. A was and still is accept and B was and still is cancel for every system I've ever used back the NES. I think I recall some PS1 games where O was accept and X was cancel but I think since the PS2 they swapped.

So it's still bottom button for accept and right button for cancel -- except for Nintendo.
Xbox/Deck:

     Y
X        B
     A

PS:

     ^
[]        O
     X

Modern Nintendo:

     X
Y         A
     B

Retro Nintendo:

B        A

[Mizufluffy]

Originally posted by Brohands McSmooth:

But the Deck is not the outlier, Nintendo is the outlier. PS/XBOX/DECK have A/X in the same spot and B/O in the same spot. Even the Sega Dreamcast and Saturn are this way. Relative to almost everything else, Nintendo is the different one.

As someone who has never hold a Nintendo Switch, and although I've seen some images of the device I've never paid close attention, I was surprised after googling it and closely inspecting the image of it: It has A and B, X and Y reversed. I've only ever used Logitech F310 (which I was using before I got a Steam Controller), Steam Controller and now Steam Deck so I doubt it would be easy for me to switch to a device, in this case Switch, that has buttons in places I'm not used to.

It'd be one thing to learn slightly different placement of the sticks, dpad or other inputs than trying to completely relearn the placement of ABXY buttons. For similar reasons I believe it would be hard for me to learn to use something like a PlayStation controller (such as DualShock 4) because the symbols are different (X, O, square and triangle), although it might still be easier than Switch because it'd be more like learning a new device entirely than relearning what I'm already familiar with. Trying to reverse A and B, X and Y would be like learning that up is down, down is up, right is left and left is right.

But for OP's problem, I got so confused what was said that I'm not even sure if they want the A button on the Steam Deck to accept or cancel things.
However, if you can't set it do what you want in the game's settings (changing which button is accept or cancel) then you should be able to do it through Steam Input. Let's for a moment assume that A is for accept and B is for cancel on a Steam Deck. If you are more familiar with the Switch layout where B on Switch is where A is on Steam Deck and A on Switch is where B is on Steam Deck then assuming that you want the button on A's location on Switch (B's location on SD) to accept and similar for B on Switch (A on Deck) to cancel then keep the game's settings as normal (so the game assumes A on the Deck is accept, B for cancel) and only change A to B and B to A in Steam Input.

This makes A on the Deck output B and B on the Deck output A. This way the game thinks A button on the Deck is B (for cancel) and B button on the Deck is A (accept). Switching them like this would make "accept" where A is on Switch and "cancel" where B is on Switch, and the in-game prompts should be A for accept and B for cancel. Then, as long as you don't look at the letters on Steam Deck, your muscle memory should be doing just fine. You can do the same for X and Y since they are also reversed on Switch.

If this is not what you meant then please clarify because I was kind of confused which button on the Steam Deck should have which in-game prompt and action.

[DankWestern]

Originally posted by Brohands McSmooth:

It's your device, so even if it as a "weird" "you problem" it's worth fixing for you. However I think you may be slightly misremembering.

I played mostly RPGs, and I recall them all having B/X being cancel and A/O being accept, but perhaps you're correct.

[DankWestern]

Originally posted by Mizufluffy:

This makes A on the Deck output B and B on the Deck output A. This way the game thinks A button on the Deck is B (for cancel) and B button on the Deck is A (accept). Switching them like this would make "accept" where A is on Switch and "cancel" where B is on Switch, and the in-game prompts should be A for accept and B for cancel. Then, as long as you don't look at the letters on Steam Deck, your muscle memory should be doing just fine. You can do the same for X and Y since they are also reversed on Switch.

If this is not what you meant then please clarify because I was kind of confused which button on the Steam Deck should have which in-game prompt and action.

Yes, I know this is an unclear and confusing mess of a discussion, and I apologize, let me see if I can use a more visual reference using a layout posted earlier.

     X
Y         §§
     §

So, in 95% of all games I've played, § is cancel, and §§ is accept. It's two pieces, one is muscle memory for going right for § every time I want to cancel out of something, and pressing §§'s position to accept something.

The steam deck allows you to remap everything, which is great, but inside games, the onscreen prompt won't recognize the change, and still tell me to go for §§ which would be correct where muscle memory is concerned, however, it is difficult to see §§ on screen, and tell my brain to ignore muscle memory and replace it with visual memory and hit § anyways.

It's a combination of muscle memory fighting with visual ques I suppose.

[ugafan]

Originally posted by DankWestern:

Anyone know if there is any way to align the control schemes to the ingame prompts for games that don't have customizable controls, or am I just forced to deal with it?

With Steam Input you can put the button placement anywhere you want. But the prompts are controlled by the game. If you can remap buttons in game, you can change the prompts. If not, then no you can't change the prompts.

[DankWestern]

Originally posted by ugafan:

Originally posted by DankWestern:

Anyone know if there is any way to align the control schemes to the ingame prompts for games that don't have customizable controls, or am I just forced to deal with it?

With Steam Input you can put the button placement anywhere you want. But the prompts are controlled by the game. If you can remap buttons in game, you can change the prompts. If not, then no you can't change the prompts.

Then it's as I thought, SOL. I wonder if this will ever become something that can be changed, or if it's too niche of an issue.

[ugafan]

It's something that the developer of each game would have to implement. It's not something that that Valve has any control over.

[DankWestern]

Originally posted by ugafan:

It's something that the developer of each game would have to implement. It's not something that that Valve has any control over.

Sure, just figured I'd see if there was anyone else with this problem, or by some random chance a solution.

[Brohands McSmooth]

Every emulator I've tried so far (EmuDeck and Yuzu) has had the button layout device accurate to the emulated system i.e. Nintendo layout for Nintendo games. Then only the physical button labels are "incorrect" until you get into menus or Deck stuff