Will the Dragon make the Wizard King/Champion boring?

[Dwarfurious]

Or will the dragon just end up being so similar as to be a model change? In the screenshot it looked like it was just as strong as a low level hero so in combat it might not be that much different; and im wondering if it will even use gear.

Right now though the two current choices feel extremely similar in actual play; i seem to recall in older games that Wizards would have bonuses for being in their Towers, able to cast spells over their domain. I kind of wish that could be brought back since there is so little reason to ever have your hero stay in their base; yet i'd kind of like to have a Wizard King who sits in his throne aiding his forces with magic while the Champions are on the frontlines with their guys. If the dragon turns out to be a very unique and interesting option it might make the other two seem bland by comparison so having more distinct mechanics between the two would be nice.

[DuskQuill]

I imagine the dragon will be a craze for a hot minute. Might have a week or two of people just playing dragons and making videos about it. But it's gonna be on how the dragon plays mechanically and what it focuses on. Though you can easily just make the current two choices into the same sort of playstyle, they do have a different focus.

Champions have an easier time with politics, money making, unit XP gain, and stability while the Wizard King is a passive mana and casting point generator and has the ability to allow you to cast 2 spells in one turn. This incentives you to initially have your Champions focus more on melee and good units, while Wizard King is all about that spell flinging. Late game this kinda becomes irrelevant, but it does influence the early game a little bit.

Not sure what stuff the Dragon Lord will bring to the table (outside of being a dragon), but I think I can only see a problem with it. It is gonna have a hard time dealing with Giant Slayer units as it would count as a large creature. Though, if it can fly then it might ignore a lot of terrain hazards. However, considering it is a dragon, it may not be able to equip items. And also, you choose a Dragon that is attuned to a specific affinity, so that would beg to question if you'll get penalties when getting hit by spells/enchantments of an opposing affinity. Couldn't possibly fathom what mechanics they'll focus on, though maybe something to do with Lieges or even evolution mechanics for units would be interesting to see.

Sort of my two cents about the whole thing. Not sure what to expect, but my thoughts are my thoughts and figured I'd share since it's relevant. Can't wait to see what the Dragon Lords bring to the table.

[badger vortex]

No one knows, at this point we just don't have much info

[GrandMajora]

Originally posted by Dwarfurious:

Or will the dragon just end up being so similar as to be a model change? In the screenshot it looked like it was just as strong as a low level hero so in combat it might not be that much different; and im wondering if it will even use gear.

In one of the screenshots, we can see they are using something called an 'Order Dragon' which suggests that they'll be able to use different types of damage than just the iconic fire breath. I expect an Order Dragon causes SPIRIT damage, obviously.

They can also get pretty massive in scale compared to the champion and Wizard King models, as one of the screenshots depicts them as being comparable to Tier 4 and 5 monsters in terms of size.

As for the differences with the other rulers, Champions get bonuses to their gold income, experience gain, and relations with free cities. Where as Wizard Kings get bonuses to their mana income, spell casting abilities, and can cast spells multiple times per turn.

We have no details on what Dragons will specialize in at the moment. Everything right now is just pure speculation.

[suejak]

You want a hero who just sits at base the whole game? O_o

I doubt that is a popular idea.

The two current options empower quite different strategies, so I assume dragon will be balanced similarly.

[aqvamare]

No, 100% sure, champion and wizard king can enslave at the end of the day dragons, and become dragon riders.

I mean, dragons are only one more big lumpy source of tools, like all othere races already, for a Wizard king in training (aka champion), or a real wizard king.

[jasons073]

Back in the day, there was an MMO called "Horizons: Empires of Istaria." Its claim to fame was that, in additional to the typical fantasy race classes, the player could also play as a dragon. When the game launched, nearly 85% of the players I saw in game had elected to play dragon.

I suspect the reaction to the new Dragon class in AOW4 is likely to be similar, despite the vast difference in genre :P

[Des]

rat people will always be used because rats are cool looking.

the mole people too because that smug look on one of the models can carry the whole race.

[GrandMajora]

Originally posted by suejak:

You want a hero who just sits at base the whole game? O_o

Hey, sitting around the cave and enjoying the kickbacks while your minions do all the work is an iconic tradition among dragon overlords!

[El Rey de Pinguinos]

Originally posted by jasons073:

Back in the day, there was an MMO called "Horizons: Empires of Istaria." Its claim to fame was that, in additional to the typical fantasy race classes, the player could also play as a dragon. When the game launched, nearly 85% of the players I saw in game had elected to play dragon.

I suspect the reaction to the new Dragon class in AOW4 is likely to be similar, despite the vast difference in genre :P

That is certainly my reaction. The only reason I'll ever create anything else will be to give my dragons specific foes to lord over.

[DuskQuill]

I'm also kinda curious if Dragon Lords are gonna have any potential special mechanics involving Dragon Infestations.

[GrandMajora]

Originally posted by El Rey de Pinguinos:

That is certainly my reaction. The only reason I'll ever create anything else will be to give my dragons specific foes to lord over.

I don't think it will be a problem of dragons making Champions and Wizard Kings boring, so much as by the time the new DLC gets here, people will have already played enough with them to be eager to try something new. Given a little more time, people will probably get bored of only playing dragons and go back to Champions and Wizard Kings again.

I know that I, for one, am already thinking of a human faction that's come under the dominion of a Lizardman wizard king. ;-)

[Overlord Byron]

i seem to recall in older games that Wizards would have bonuses for being in their Towers, able to cast spells over their domain. I kind of wish that could be brought back since there is so little reason to ever have your hero stay in their base;

The problem with AoW2 is that there was no reason to ever bring your leader out of their tower. Being in their tower was their only acceptable state. There was no point in them even being a unit.

AoW2 is a good game, but that mechanic was dropped for a reason.

[blackhand_lost]

At first everyone will be playing them obvoiusly, but after the initial hype goes down I think they'll fall back behind the other 2 choices in popularity.

If they're more powerful they can still be popular among the minmaxing crowd but imo more people will find humanoids just easier to customize and associate with some idea of personality and character they have in mind

I don't have statistic data but I suspect that in general more people go for less exotic choices

I remember devs from Larian complained that they gave all those options to create someone special and wild in character creator and most people just went with normal characters

Originally posted by Overlord Byron:

The problem with AoW2 is that there was no reason to ever bring your leader out of their tower. Being in their tower was their only acceptable state. There was no point in them even being a unit.
AoW2 is a good game, but that mechanic was dropped for a reason.

I kinda liked it. They were so powerful with their crazy magic but when you got to them close and personal there was no crazy armor or a ton of HP, they were almost like..common mortals. A bit like the King in chess.
But I agree there's no point in returning to the old times

[El Rey de Pinguinos]

Originally posted by GrandMajora:

I don't think it will be a problem of dragons making Champions and Wizard Kings boring, so much as by the time the new DLC gets here, people will have already played enough with them to be eager to try something new. Given a little more time, people will probably get bored of only playing dragons and go back to Champions and Wizard Kings again.

I know that I, for one, am already thinking of a human faction that's come under the dominion of a Lizardman wizard king. ;-)

I agree, and am mostly exaggerating due to excitement. It will definitely be super fun to set up heroic, feudal Champions and greedy Wizard Kings to foil as a dragon, though.

I'm also super excited to see the lizardmen back for the first time since the original AoW. Although with the new toadmen, it's probably too much to hope they'll be riding frogs again.

[GrandMajora]

Originally posted by El Rey de Pinguinos:

I'm also super excited to see the lizardmen back for the first time since the original AoW.

I feel the same. They were my favorite race in the first game, and it was very disappointing to see they got axed in the 2nd game, and didn't return in the 3rd one either.

And no, I don't consider Draconians to be a suitable replacement. Lizardmen had a water theme, while Draconians had a fire theme; which ended up being redundant with the Tigrans also having a fire theme.