Any other bosses as garbage as Barren Swamp's boss? (spoilers)

[Whirblewind]

Let's get it out of the way to save you time and me headache: this isn't a discussion on difficulty or relative balance. I'm a vet of these games, I can SLmin the From games, charm Sekiro, 2ring1run DS2, etc. Let's stay on the topic of subjective fun.

Green Monster is a garbage boss in all the ways I expect a Soulslike boss to get things wrong. Aggressive lateral tracking with no regard to the boss model or its legs turning, excruciatingly delayed telegraphs (a sin Elden tragically abuses in nearly every fight but LoP has managed to largely avoid until now), boss collision box obliterating player vision and locking the player into a corner, two-phase overlong fight which is a problem shared with Romeo.

Other than Romeo being too long, this game has been so refreshing. Its boss and environment geometry have been so thoughtful, much of the time in corrective ways the recent From games have continued to get wrong. I've had criticisms of course, but my praise has been overwhelming. This boss and area were crushing to my enthusiasm.

This boss, and frankly the dour, boring, thoughtless environment it sits at the end of, was dispiriting. I'm not sure if another huge dud like this would get me to stop playing given the first half of the game being so good so this post is likely mostly just an excuse to vent, but it's certainly possible.

Please give me hope the rest of the second half of this game isn't this lazy. I don't want to believe the budget ran out and corners had to be cut. Tell me this was the bottle episode.

[Senki]

Well I completely agree with you

As for what bosses are next there are at least 2 more garbage ones but it can be very subjective. Either way Green Monster is definitely the worst one in the game so you won't get anything worse.

[Whirblewind]

Well, hearing this was the worst of the lot is somewhat reassuring. Even DMC3 has its Arkham.

[Soul]

I'm about to finish my second playthrough (having a rough time with the final boss atm), and I can unfortunately say that the bosses in the second half of the game take a dip for the worst (imo at least).

Not counting NPC human style bosses, everything you just described becomes a lot worse moving forward. Very delayed telegraphs become commonplace and two-phase fights exist in every major boss coming up.

You will encounter the second worst boss fight in the game, Door Guardian, not very difficult but the hitboxes are absolute dogwater.

2 of the bosses you still have to fight are at least very cool in both design and mechanics wise, but they still suffer from long ass delayed telegraphs and tanky second phases.

It also doesn't help that (at least in NG+) everything past the halfway mark pretty much 2-shots you regardless of your Health investment, making mistakes in fights very ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ annoying, which adding to the long boss fights and very random attack delays is making this game a chore to finish again.

[Smufius]

I wonder if you can name a single souls game which doesn't have bad bosses

[Whirblewind]

Ursprungligen skrivet av Soul:

[电动天使]

I honestly have no issues with any boss in the game. I've beaten them with the slowest and fastest weapons and all I can say is: change your playstyle. You're probably doing something terribly wrong if you feel this strongly about the swamp boss and especially Romeo.

All attacks have their counter and pretty obvious tells as well. With fast weapons you can keep sneaking attacks in between his own attacks then perfect guarding and punishing. With slow weapons you kinda have to know where the openings are.

Regarding camera issues, I wouldn't be able to say much. I play on mouse and keyboard so I don't have any.

[Black Captain]

I liked the Green Monster

[boy i'll whip ya head]

Idk man, sounds like a skill issue.

[Whirblewind]

Ursprungligen skrivet av ♥♥♥♥:

You're probably doing something terribly wrong

This is you handwaving criticisms about what is or isn't fun by ignoring the first paragraph of this topic to imply skill was part of the conversation, but I'm pretty confident the reputation this boss has speaks to the contrary as better rebuttal than I could put forth.. which you would selectively read anyway just like you selectively read the OP.

[Bankai9212]

Outside of the second phase and decay not too bad. IMO quality in fights drops until the third to final boss and the final boss. Honestly everything past the swamp is a massive drop in quality.

[Bankai9212]

Ursprungligen skrivet av Senki:

Well I completely agree with you

As for what bosses are next there are at least 2 more garbage ones but it can be very subjective. Either way Green Monster is definitely the worst one in the game so you won't get anything worse.

Most would agree the black rabbit gang is easily the worst fight's in the game.

[Soul]

Ursprungligen skrivet av Bankai9212:

Ursprungligen skrivet av Senki:

Well I completely agree with you

As for what bosses are next there are at least 2 more garbage ones but it can be very subjective. Either way Green Monster is definitely the worst one in the game so you won't get anything worse.

Most would agree the black rabbit gang is easily the worst fight's in the game.

I personally agree with Senki that the green monster is the worst fight in the game (phase 2 only). Small-ish arena with a boss that can cover the entire thing in the matter of a second, and due to the bosses wide attacks it's hard to stay in the middle, making it easy to get stuck in the walls and getting ♥♥♥♥♥♥ by the camera. Also the hitboxes on that running attack are kinda sussy.

The gank squad I didnt really have much problems with, the first fight is manageable due to only fighting 2 at a time, and the big guy you can pretty much run away and ignore until the other is gone.
The second fight becomes less of a chore once you figure out that you can freely backstab any of them (except the big guy) when they are buffing, taking 1/3 of a health bar in 1 attack, and since all of them buff quite often, as long as you keep moving it's not that much of a problem.

[Soul]

Ursprungligen skrivet av ♥♥♥♥:

All attacks have their counter and pretty obvious tells as well. With fast weapons you can keep sneaking attacks in between his own attacks then perfect guarding and punishing. With slow weapons you kinda have to know where the openings are.

Isn't that every single well designed boss in existence in these kinds of games?

Just because bosses have tells and counters doesn't mean they aren't difficult.
Malenia in Elden Ring has all those things, still hard to fight.
Slave Knight Gael in DS3 has all those things, still hard to fight.

If every person could keep track of every single tell and counter in a boss fight 100% of the time, these games wouldn't be as enjoyable as they are.

[Bankai9212]

Ursprungligen skrivet av Soul:

Ursprungligen skrivet av Bankai9212:

Most would agree the black rabbit gang is easily the worst fight's in the game.

I personally agree with Senki that the green monster is the worst fight in the game (phase 2 only). Small-ish arena with a boss that can cover the entire thing in the matter of a second, and due to the bosses wide attacks it's hard to stay in the middle, making it easy to get stuck in the walls and getting ♥♥♥♥♥♥ by the camera. Also the hitboxes on that running attack are kinda sussy.

The gank squad I didnt really have much problems with, the first fight is manageable due to only fighting 2 at a time, and the big guy you can pretty much run away and ignore until the other is gone.
The second fight becomes less of a chore once you figure out that you can freely backstab any of them (except the big guy) when they are buffing, taking 1/3 of a health bar in 1 attack, and since all of them buff quite often, as long as you keep moving it's not that much of a problem.

Phase 2 is just a reuse of the 2nd boss in the game with minor changes.

[Soul]

Ursprungligen skrivet av Bankai9212:

Ursprungligen skrivet av Soul:

I personally agree with Senki that the green monster is the worst fight in the game (phase 2 only). Small-ish arena with a boss that can cover the entire thing in the matter of a second, and due to the bosses wide attacks it's hard to stay in the middle, making it easy to get stuck in the walls and getting ♥♥♥♥♥♥ by the camera. Also the hitboxes on that running attack are kinda sussy.

The gank squad I didnt really have much problems with, the first fight is manageable due to only fighting 2 at a time, and the big guy you can pretty much run away and ignore until the other is gone.
The second fight becomes less of a chore once you figure out that you can freely backstab any of them (except the big guy) when they are buffing, taking 1/3 of a health bar in 1 attack, and since all of them buff quite often, as long as you keep moving it's not that much of a problem.

Phase 2 is just a reuse of the 2nd boss in the game with minor changes.

It is, but those added changes along with the bad arena and new moves make the fight a chore.