I didn't understand one thing about geppetto (spoilers)

[Fabio92]

From what I understand, the real villain is Geppetto and not Simon, right or wrong? and I didn't really understand if Carlo and Nameless Puppet are practically the same person

can you help me understand

[Pnume]

They are both Villain. Both doing what they deem as right and like always deeply misguided.

It's not clear about the nameless puppet but it looks like to me that it uses carlo's original body.

[LuckyRaphi]

I didn't understand the ending either. Why did gepetto need our heart?

[An Irate Walrus]

What Pnume said. Both Simon and Geppetto are powerful alchemists doing horrifying things for reasons they believe to be justifiable.

Simon wants to force the "evolution" of humanity to free it from lies, and he's killed a ton of folks--and then turned their souls into fuel (ergo)--to achieve that end.

Geppetto set off the Puppet Frenzy, and essentially started the whole puppet crafting industry, because he wants his son back.

They're both monsters. One wants to change the world by burning it, and the other wants to burn the world to bring back one person.

The path to hell is paved in the righteous convictions of the deluded.

[Sirlion]

Both are villains. Simon is a more traditional villain who wants "god powers" with blatant excuses for his shortcomings sprinkled in between. Geppetto lost his son Carlo and wanted to resurrect him, hence why he created Nameless Puppet. Pinocchio was meant to just be an Ergo sponge to fortify his P-Organ with Carlo's memories and personality inside of it, so that then Geppetto could bruteforce it out of Pinocchio and put it back into Nameless (which is basically Carlo's corpse attached to puppet components).

[An Irate Walrus]

Originally posted by LuckyRaphi:

I didn't understand the ending either. Why did gepetto need our heart?

So he can use it to bring his son back.

Ergo is basically the philosopher's stone tuned to human souls, and puppets run on ergo. They develop individuality when the ergo that was used to animate them remembers who it was before it was cut loose from its mortal shell.

Guess whose ergo animates P?

[LuckyRaphi]

Originally posted by An Irate Walrus:

Originally posted by LuckyRaphi:

I didn't understand the ending either. Why did gepetto need our heart?

So he can use it to bring his son back.

Ergo is basically the philosopher's stone tuned to human souls, and puppets run on ergo. They develop individuality when the ergo that was used to animate them remembers who it was before it was cut loose from its mortal shell.

Guess whose ergo animates P?

But why couldn't he do the same thing without P, just put the heart the nameless puppet from the beginning?

[MPN64]

Originally posted by LuckyRaphi:

Originally posted by An Irate Walrus:

So he can use it to bring his son back.

Ergo is basically the philosopher's stone tuned to human souls, and puppets run on ergo. They develop individuality when the ergo that was used to animate them remembers who it was before it was cut loose from its mortal shell.

Guess whose ergo animates P?

But why couldn't he do the same thing without P, just put the heart the nameless puppet from the beginning?

Maybe needed to gain more humanity to the heart?

[An Irate Walrus]

Originally posted by MPN64:

Originally posted by LuckyRaphi:

But why couldn't he do the same thing without P, just put the heart the nameless puppet from the beginning?

Maybe needed to gain more humanity to the heart?

This is the answer, more or less. If you listen to Geppetto's monologue during the Nameless fight, he more or less spells this out. He's conflated Carlo's corpse with the person, not understanding that Carlo's soul has anchored itself to P.

[HypetheKomodo]

They're both antagonists. Simon is wanting to manipulate Ergo to make himself a 'god' just because he can. Doesn't care who it hurts or what it costs.

Geppetto is wanting his son 'reincarnated', and his Puppet is a means to that end. However, it seems he wasn't prepared for his Puppet to start taking on a will of it's own. He probably anticipated that his Puppet would simply collect enough Ergo for the P-Organ and be able to stop Simon to get the Arm of God without any hurdles.

[Fabio92]

Originally posted by Sirlion:

Both are villains. Simon is a more traditional villain who wants "god powers" with blatant excuses for his shortcomings sprinkled in between. Geppetto lost his son Carlo and wanted to resurrect him, hence why he created Nameless Puppet. Pinocchio was meant to just be an Ergo sponge to fortify his P-Organ with Carlo's memories and personality inside of it, so that then Geppetto could bruteforce it out of Pinocchio and put it back into Nameless (which is basically Carlo's corpse attached to puppet components).

so Nameless puppet would be Carlo if I understood correctly or not? From what you explained to me, it seems so. Nameless is also a puppet like Carlo

[Fabio92]

Originally posted by An Irate Walrus:

Originally posted by LuckyRaphi:

I didn't understand the ending either. Why did gepetto need our heart?

So he can use it to bring his son back.

Ergo is basically the philosopher's stone tuned to human souls, and puppets run on ergo. They develop individuality when the ergo that was used to animate them remembers who it was before it was cut loose from its mortal shell.

Guess whose ergo animates P?

I don't know who the ergo animates P is? Carlo's ergo or Nameless's or Geppetto's

[Sirlion]

Originally posted by Fabio1992:

Originally posted by Sirlion:

Both are villains. Simon is a more traditional villain who wants "god powers" with blatant excuses for his shortcomings sprinkled in between. Geppetto lost his son Carlo and wanted to resurrect him, hence why he created Nameless Puppet. Pinocchio was meant to just be an Ergo sponge to fortify his P-Organ with Carlo's memories and personality inside of it, so that then Geppetto could bruteforce it out of Pinocchio and put it back into Nameless (which is basically Carlo's corpse attached to puppet components).

so Nameless puppet would be Carlo if I understood correctly or not? From what you explained to me, it seems so. Nameless is also a puppet like Carlo

Nameless puppet is Carlo's corpse, reanimated using puppet parts and the arm of god stolen from Simon. If you give Geppetto your heart you can see this thorugh your own eyes. You end up playing as Carlo yourself if you dont go straight into NG+, he is identical to Pinocchio (of course, Pinocchio's features were modelled after Carlo) and his weight is different due to the fact that his outer shell is made of flesh instead of steel. (this was a really nice touch)

[Fabio92]

Originally posted by Sirlion:

Originally posted by Fabio1992:

so Nameless puppet would be Carlo if I understood correctly or not? From what you explained to me, it seems so. Nameless is also a puppet like Carlo

Nameless puppet is Carlo's corpse, reanimated using puppet parts and the arm of god stolen from Simon. If you give Geppetto your heart you can see this thorugh your own eyes. You end up playing as Carlo yourself if you dont go straight into NG+, he is identical to Pinocchio (of course, Pinocchio's features were modelled after Carlo) and his weight is different due to the fact that his outer shell is made of flesh instead of steel. (this was a really nice touch)

I gave my heart to Geppetto and therefore Carlo saw it. this is why I asked if Nameless puppet and Carlo are the same thing because they both came from the same box. something is strange because if you give your heart to geppetto you avoid the fight against Nameless puppet. for that reason I thought that both Nameless puppet and Carlo are related

[An Irate Walrus]

Originally posted by Fabio1992:

Originally posted by An Irate Walrus:

So he can use it to bring his son back.

Ergo is basically the philosopher's stone tuned to human souls, and puppets run on ergo. They develop individuality when the ergo that was used to animate them remembers who it was before it was cut loose from its mortal shell.

Guess whose ergo animates P?

I don't know who the ergo animates P is? Carlo's ergo or Nameless's or Geppetto's

P's ergo is that of Carlo. If you read the record of Romeo, you know that he recognized P as Carlo, and had been using the puppets to reach out to him for help in fighting both the petrification disease and the alchemists; because Carlo's ego hadn't fully awakened in P at the time we fight the King of Puppets, P doesn't recognize his oldest, best friend--this is why the giant "king" model frowns when P slaps his hand away.

[Krazy Wallet]

Originally posted by LuckyRaphi:

Originally posted by An Irate Walrus:

So he can use it to bring his son back.

Ergo is basically the philosopher's stone tuned to human souls, and puppets run on ergo. They develop individuality when the ergo that was used to animate them remembers who it was before it was cut loose from its mortal shell.

Guess whose ergo animates P?

But why couldn't he do the same thing without P, just put the heart the nameless puppet from the beginning?

I don't think the Nameless Puppet is the real Carlo or his body. The soul when you kill him references multiple cores which created a hate-filled monster. The nameless puppet was a failed attempt at creating you. Once it became an unfit host, it was locked away and controlled by puppet strings. In phase 2, you cut the top of the head off, freeing the puppet from his strings, and see the rage leak through turning everything red. I don't know where the real Carlo is. I think it's safe to assume his father has it stored away in some cryo-freeze state haha.

His boss soul description:
The nameless puppet was the first puppet made by the old man that was mounted with a P-Organ.
Its Ergo efficiency was not just unremarkable, it was destructive; thus the nameless puppet was not chosen for the boy's body and sealed away

Amulet from boss soul description:
It is unknown whether the Nameless puppet had an ego. This is because multiple cores holding concentrated Ergo were used to boost its firepower. If this puppet could feel only one emotion, it would be hatred