Way too hard

[LuzyLuzifer]

Before you say something, I know. I know it is soulslike but I was really looking forward to that game because of the story, the grafic etc etc etc. Although it's impossible to play if you're like me aka you can't play soul. I'm glad that they launched a demo version bc now I know that I won't even buy it. Anyways it is sad and disappointing. I wish they would think on people who don't play soul too and make options to make the whole play easier for us. Also you can't keep close attention to the story and the grafics if you're constantly annoyed bc you just died for the 1 million time. It wouldn't be that hard to make the option that you can play it hardcore like it is now and also play it smooth and easier. But like always the companies don't give a dime. It's really a shame.
For everyone else who is good in soul games, have fun with it and please enjoy it bc I can't.

[Aria Athena]

Originally posted by InstableMonster:

Originally posted by Aria Athena:

I would be surprised if those two set of people even intersected.

they can be the same person, Zyrconia a couple comments ago said that because there is no difficulty slider he will have to cheat by using the specters to beat the puppet king

Originally posted by Zyrconia:

Now I need to cheat and use sommons so I can move on with the game and progress...

Are summons in this game AI or player controlled?

[An Irate Walrus]

Originally posted by Zyrconia:

Originally posted by InstableMonster:

yes adding the options will do that THEY WANT TO PROVIDE A SINGLE EXPERIENCE adding difficulty options PROVIDES MULTIPLE EXPERIENCES, anything other than 1 option is not their vision

yes you are asking them to redo it has everything has to be rebalanced, it seems you dont get how development works

no legislation says you have to be able to complete a video game, get your head out of your rear

there is no problem with difficulty options if thats what the developers want to provide, stop twisting everyone words because you cant cope with artistic vision

fragile vision? what are you on about, what you suggest go against it, there is no getting good, thats not a skill level related thing, but hey keep on showing you do not get at all what people are saying

the only thing you have showed thus far is that you are out for yourself, not accessibility, case and point when you say other souls game are fine with 1 difficulty because YOU can complete them but this one isnt because YOU cant complete it, while there are people who cant complete other souls game. You arent here for any rights, accessibility or none of that stuff, you have only proven time and time again that you are here whining because you don't want to get better at this game but feel entitled to reach the end.

No, I said I'm fine with the difficulty levels in those games, but regardless, I want difficulty options in all games, so people have options.

I did the very opposite of looking out for only myself. I said that I do not require difficulty options in souls, because I am so skilled that I start on ng+2/3, but I would like to see the options in all games because:
A. I know how it feels to simply not be able to progress, thinking of other people
B. I am using unofficial diificulthy options in souls already and they are great. Everybody should have access to this fantastic feature. How do you think I'm doing my sl1 start ng+W runs? By praying to soulbros? No. Innoficial difficulty options.
C. Since all games should and almost all games do have these options, it is super useful in my case, where I can't beat the boss and can't justify spending more time on him. Gush, it sure would be nice if I could drop his hp a bit, still have a very similar experience and challenge, only let's say 10% easier and still get a sense of satisfaction that after 70+ tries I managed to take him down, while still engaging with ALL his mechanics. How much satisfaction? 10% less. But no, we can't have that can we. Now I need to cheat and use sommons so I can move on with the game and progress...

You...can't start any mainline Souls game on NG +2/+3. The only possible exception is the covenant of Champions in Dark 2.

For someone who's been lambasting P for being "too hard," using "I am so skilled that I start these games on difficulty levels that literally aren't offered until the game has been finished one or more times" is a weird position to take.

[InstableMonster]

Originally posted by Aria Athena:

Originally posted by InstableMonster:

they can be the same person, Zyrconia a couple comments ago said that because there is no difficulty slider he will have to cheat by using the specters to beat the puppet king

Are summons in this game AI or player controlled?

AI, there is no online, its literally a tool the game gives you to make it easier, yet people who want an easier experience refuse to use it, which is mind boggling to say the least

[Zyrconia]

Originally posted by InstableMonster:

Originally posted by Zyrconia:

No, I said I'm fine with the difficulty levels in those games, but regardless, I want difficulty options in all games, so people have options.

I did the very opposite of looking out for only myself. I said that I do not require difficulty options in souls, because I am so skilled that I start on ng+2/3, but I would like to see the options in all games because:
A. I know how it feels to simply not be able to progress, thinking of other people
B. I am using unofficial diificulthy options in souls already and they are great. Everybody should have access to this fantastic feature. How do you think I'm doing my sl1 start ng+W runs? By praying to soulbros? No. Innoficial difficulty options.
C. Since all games should and almost all games do have these options, it is super useful in my case, where I can't beat the boss and can't justify spending more time on him. Gush, it sure would be nice if I could drop his hp a bit, still have a very similar experience and challenge, only let's say 10% easier and still get a sense of satisfaction that after 70+ tries I managed to take him down, while still engaging with ALL his mechanics. How much satisfaction? 10% less. But no, we can't have that can we. Now I need to cheat and use sommons so I can move on with the game and progress...

«I need to cheat and use mechanic the game puts at my disposal to progress» is one of the most ridiculous takes I have ever seen

I know how it feels to think of other people, which you arent. You have been advocating not thinking of how the developers feel toward their product and changing them to what you want. Stop trying to say you think of other people for accessibility, all the game you are fine with, other people arent fine with, are much bigger games and you're not out there advocating for them to have more difficulty option, you're here, on this game forum, because it's the one YOU are having issues with

So you cheat in other games but complain about having to do so in this one, cool story. You can still cheat a difficulty in if you want in this.

You're only proving that if people dont want the experience the game is given them they can cheat to make it easier, which is a solution to the problem but somehow thats not okay?

I do not cheat in other games. I sometimes make souls harder. Something that should work out of the box, without external tools. It is called hard mode. Look it up. Almost all games have it.

But that is beyond the point.

Using summons is not cheating, it is "cheating" but only whet I do it. Souls means different things to different people, ignoring all that talk about having the same experience. Nonsense. For many it is not even about the combat, but the exploration.

In fact, let's double back: for me souls has always been about one on one honor duels between me and a hard boss. Just me and my weapon. just the boss,a formidable moveset, no adds, no ganks, no ghimicks.

I never summon (only on alts to see the story, not on my first playthrough; example in ds2 you need to summon npcs and make sure they survive to finish their quests) and fight the boss straight on.

Using summons is not cheating and many replies ago I said I support other people if they wish to summon, but it is not the ideal difficulty mitigating mechanic.

But for me and my progress, it is "cheating" when I do it. I do not consider that I have beaten a boss I summoned on. That's not why I buy these games, not the experience I had before and don't want to start now. I feel no accomplishment when summoning.

Nor when I cheese a boss, something I also avoid like the plague. Story time: many years ago, when the wold was young, from the fire, a new game appeared. It was called Demon' Souls. For me it was love at first sight. And I was terrible at it. I couldn't beat a single boss beyond the Phalanx. I had to cheese them all. Even with the best of cheeses they all took me many tries and eventually I got stuck when the cheese ran out.

I do not consider that I beat any of those bosses that I cheesed. Cheesing is not one on one honor dueling. No honor in it.

Needless to say, years later, I imported the game from China (it was a niche game back then, nobody sold it, it was just starting to catch on as a cult clasic) and beat it legit on a new character. And yes, I checked my old character and had equipped heaviest armor and shield and was fat rolling.

Where was I? Ah yes, I'm a dirty "cheater" who can't beat this boss without summons. What can one do?

[Zyrconia]

Originally posted by Aria Athena:

Originally posted by BBQ:

"DEVs please add difficulty slider"
Devs add summons to lower difficulty in boss fights
"NOOOO using summons is cheating!"

Can't make that ♥♥♥♥ up

I would be surprised if those two set of people even intersected.

Was is so hard to get? It is all very rational.

Simple numerical tweaks in diificulthy options do a fair job in maintaining the feel and experience of the encounter. Very desirable solution.

Summons completely change the encounter. The boss' attention is now divided, you need to master fewer of his moves to beat him. At its worst, the sommon system allows you to just hit the boss safely until your stamina runs out. Rare occurance, but I've seen it. You could never do that without summons. In ER the mimic can almost solo some bosses. Using summons to greatly alter the flow of the fight is highly undesirable. It simply becomes a different fight.

[InstableMonster]

Originally posted by Zyrconia:

Originally posted by InstableMonster:

«I need to cheat and use mechanic the game puts at my disposal to progress» is one of the most ridiculous takes I have ever seen

I know how it feels to think of other people, which you arent. You have been advocating not thinking of how the developers feel toward their product and changing them to what you want. Stop trying to say you think of other people for accessibility, all the game you are fine with, other people arent fine with, are much bigger games and you're not out there advocating for them to have more difficulty option, you're here, on this game forum, because it's the one YOU are having issues with

So you cheat in other games but complain about having to do so in this one, cool story. You can still cheat a difficulty in if you want in this.

You're only proving that if people dont want the experience the game is given them they can cheat to make it easier, which is a solution to the problem but somehow thats not okay?

I do not cheat in other games. I sometimes make souls harder. Something that should work out of the box, without external tools. It is called hard mode. Look it up. Almost all games have it.

But that is beyond the point.

Using summons is not cheating, it is "cheating" but only whet I do it. Souls means different things to different people, ignoring all that talk about having the same experience. Nonsense. For many it is not even about the combat, but the exploration.

In fact, let's double back: for me souls has always been about one on one honor duels between me and a hard boss. Just me and my weapon. just the boss,a formidable moveset, no adds, no ganks, no ghimicks.

I never summon (only on alts to see the story, not on my first playthrough; example in ds2 you need to summon npcs and make sure they survive to finish their quests) and fight the boss straight on.

Using summons is not cheating and many replies ago I said I support other people if they wish to summon, but it is not the ideal difficulty mitigating mechanic.

But for me and my progress, it is "cheating" when I do it. I do not consider that I have beaten a boss I summoned on. That's not why I buy these games, not the experience I had before and don't want to start now. I feel no accomplishment when summoning.

Nor when I cheese a boss, something I also avoid like the plague. Story time: many years ago, when the wold was young, from the fire, a new game appeared. It was called Demon' Souls. For me it was love at first sight. And I was terrible at it. I couldn't beat a single boss beyond the Phalanx. I had to cheese them all. Even with the best of cheeses they all took me many tries and eventually I got stuck when the cheese ran out.

I do not consider that I beat any of those bosses that I cheesed. Cheesing is not one on one honor dueling. No honor in it.

Needless to say, years later, I imported the game from China (it was a niche game back then, nobody sold it, it was just starting to catch on as a cult clasic) and beat it legit on a new character. And yes, I checked my old character and had equipped heaviest armor and shield and was fat rolling.

Where was I? Ah yes, I'm a dirty "cheater" who can't beat this boss without summons. What can one do?

using specters is not cheating, its a mechanic the game gives you to be easier, which you want but yet refuse to use, theres even a whole merchant in the game just to enhance those specter if you struggle further

theres no honor in saying «I want this boss hp to be diminished so I cant beat it without a game mechanic»

for someone saying soulsbro feeling of superiority is ♥♥♥♥, you're expressing the same thing, which is funny as hell

you wanting the game to be easier yet playing with self imposed limitations to make it harder is illogical and going against itself

enough said, you're a walking contradiction, no need to discuss this further with you as you have further proven its all about your entitlement to beat the game without having to cheat but by having the developers implement the cheat just so you can somehow feel that makes it «legal» and preserves «honor»

rofl to say the least

its not about to make the game easier, its about you wanting to make the game how you want it to be, which the answer to is become a developer and make your own game instead of telling others how they should implement difficulty options in their game

[Metal Maniac]

Some Bosses are Overpowered.
Simon Manus has two Phases. The First is no Problem but the second has so massive Attacks ,it´s impossible to survive.

[Zyrconia]

You people are trying to have your cake and eat it too.

"Nooo, we can't have an easier mode. It would ruin the experience!"

"wdym you won't summon and completely and irrevocably ruin your experience for eternity (you can only kill a boss for the first time once) just so you can progress! Anything goes as long as you win!"

You people are giving me a migraine with your mental gimnastics.

And let's face it, InstableMonster should be called ImAMonsterBecauseAllMyArgumentsArePoorAndIStrawmanWithPoorReadingComprehension.

[BBQ]

Originally posted by Zyrconia:

Originally posted by Aria Athena:

I would be surprised if those two set of people even intersected.

Was is so hard to get? It is all very rational.

Simple numerical tweaks in diificulthy options do a fair job in maintaining the feel and experience of the encounter. Very desirable solution.

Summons completely change the encounter. The boss' attention is now divided, you need to master fewer of his moves to beat him. At its worst, the sommon system allows you to just hit the boss safely until your stamina runs out. Rare occurance, but I've seen it. You could never do that without summons. In ER the mimic can almost solo some bosses. Using summons to greatly alter the flow of the fight is highly undesirable. It simply becomes a different fight.

Might be rational in your eyes. Not rational at all for me.
In ER when your Mimic is able to solo a boss, you should be able too as it mirrors your build.
You can't? I hate to say it, but sounds you are just too lazy to learn the boss and/or skill issue.

In this game having the boss's attention divided can sometimes make it even harder.
Not using the spectre will definitely be slower against King of Puppets. But having compared both fights with and without summon I somehow found it easier without it. You won't have to fear sudden aggro changes which can throw you off in that fight.

Changing damage and HP values will also alter the fight experience completely. A boss dealing (a lot) less damage will change your strategy as you might be willing to just facetank a hit and the hitstun instead of correctly space yourself and avoid the hit completely, because it would take less time recovering from hitstun than to reengage with the boss.
So why would you advocate for something like that if you want an unaltered experience?

[Aria Athena]

Originally posted by Zyrconia:

Originally posted by Aria Athena:

I would be surprised if those two set of people even intersected.

Was is so hard to get? It is all very rational.

Simple numerical tweaks in diificulthy options do a fair job in maintaining the feel and experience of the encounter. Very desirable solution.

Summons completely change the encounter. The boss' attention is now divided, you need to master fewer of his moves to beat him. At its worst, the sommon system allows you to just hit the boss safely until your stamina runs out. Rare occurance, but I've seen it. You could never do that without summons. In ER the mimic can almost solo some bosses. Using summons to greatly alter the flow of the fight is highly undesirable. It simply becomes a different fight.

I am all for difficulty settings, yet I do not see the problem with summons. In ER, depending on your build, mimic can solo most bosses, but it's also not the only summon, there are dozens.

Summons do not completely change an encounter, they only do so somewhat. It's the same boss, you are just not always the target. They will get you out of a softlock and let you continue with the game. You tried as much as you were willing to and couldn't do it, so you turn to them for help. I also find them highly undesirable, but at the same time I would never pick an easier difficulty.

[An Irate Walrus]

Originally posted by Zyrconia:

You people are trying to have your cake and eat it too.

"Nooo, we can't have an easier mode. It would ruin the experience!"

"wdym you won't summon and completely and irrevocably ruin your experience for eternity (you can only kill a boss for the first time once) just so you can progress! Anything goes as long as you win!"

You people are giving me a migraine with your mental gimnastics.

And let's face it, InstableMonster should be called ImAMonsterBecauseAllMyArgumentsArePoorAndIStrawmanWithPoorReadingComprehension.

Summons are an intended mechanic. Using an intended mechanic is not "cheating," given that the game does not place restrictions on its use.

You are placing artificial restrictions on yourself for a "pure" experience whilst simultaneously demanding difficulty settings to adjust the intended experience so that your self-imposed restrictions can be pursued successfully.

This approach can be summed up as "the game as-designed is too hard, and should be adjusted so I can beat it 'honorably,' but those who use the developer-provided mechanics are 'ruining' their experience by ducking my self-imposed settings for 'honor duels.'"

You want to approach the game honorably, but want the rules changed to fit your definition of honor, because meeting the challenge as-issued is turning out to be too much for you.

That you cannot see the disconnect between these things suggests you need to seek a refund from your university for your Rhet/Comp classes, because your professor utterly failed to teach you a damn thing.

If it was me, do me a favor and don't tell me; I don't need another reason to doubt myself.

[InstableMonster]

Originally posted by Zyrconia:

You people are trying to have your cake and eat it too.

"Nooo, we can't have an easier mode. It would ruin the experience!"

"wdym you won't summon and completely and irrevocably ruin your experience for eternity (you can only kill a boss for the first time once) just so you can progress! Anything goes as long as you win!"

You people are giving me a migraine with your mental gimnastics.

And let's face it, InstableMonster should be called ImAMonsterBecauseAllMyArgumentsArePoorAndIStrawmanWithPoorReadingComprehension.

you cant accuse people of wanting to have the cake and eat it too when its what you yourself have been doing all this time

you're the one using mental gymnastic by calling a game mechanic a cheat and saying you want an easier difficulty in the game yet refuse to use the easier difficulty in the game, you literally are saying I want this to be my way and go around and accuse people of wanting it their way

thats the real mental gymnastic

[Zyrconia]

Originally posted by BBQ:

Might be rational in your eyes. Not rational at all for me.
In ER when your Mimic is able to solo a boss, you should be able too as it mirrors your build.
You can't? I hate to say it, but sounds you are just too lazy to learn the boss and/or skill issue.


In this game having the boss's attention divided can sometimes make it even harder.
Not using the spectre will definitely be slower against King of Puppets. But having compared both fights with and without summon I somehow found it easier without it. You won't have to fear sudden aggro changes which can throw you off in that fight.

Changing damage and HP values will also alter the fight experience completely. A boss dealing (a lot) less damage will change your strategy as you might be willing to just facetank a hit and the hitstun instead of correctly space yourself and avoid the hit completely, because it would take less time recovering from hitstun than to reengage with the boss.
So why would you advocate for something like that if you want an unaltered experience?

For the first paragraph I really don't think you are getting my point.

I'm a huge advocate of preserving the experience. I think that adding difficulty slider is the best, most pure, most preserving method, while enabling more people to play. You don't agree. That is fine.

But you know what really changes the experience? When the mimic soloes a boss. So what if I can solo him. I can. And I know for a fact that I can because like I said, I don't summon on my legit first playthrough. The real experience is me soloing the boss. The second yet completely different experience is me being able to solo the boss, but I don't, and instead summon mimic and just watch. A third and completely different experience is where both I and mimic could each solo the boss, but instead we go all in and rofltomp the boss together. Doesn't work on all bosses, but works.

Compared to this, having a small numerical change, a very conservative easy mode is barely perceptable as a change in experience.

You can't really argue that me choosing easy mode and cutting the bosses hp by even a large number, from 15K to 12.5K hp, has comparable negative effect on the experience as sommoning a mimic who can tank really well and also dish out damage or summon 3 wolves who can stun lock some bosses and have decent damage, but you really can't see what is going on or summon skeletons that infintelly revive as long as the boss does not use cleaves or aoe and act as a great distraction.

I agree that changing numbers by a lot will change the experience by a lot. I never argued for that directly. Huge changes in numbers down would be "story mode".

I only argued a simple flat number like 10% because I know for a fact that a simple flat number would do more that a fair job of providing the options and everybody around here is like "how can you expect them to cater for all audiences. That would be an infinite amount of ball lancing. Buga Buga"

Sure, the devs can take time and do perfect options, balanced as they think best, but a flat scale affecting hp or damage would have similar affects

[Loser]

Yeah. Too hard for me too, I really struggle with having to press 2 different buttons on the controller. Game should have option to turn off enemies so I can watch the story like God of War Ragnarok. I really ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ hate this game. They don't let me 2 shot everything (THIS IS A JOKE, FANTASTIC GAME.)

[InstableMonster]

Originally posted by Zyrconia:

Originally posted by BBQ:

Might be rational in your eyes. Not rational at all for me.
In ER when your Mimic is able to solo a boss, you should be able too as it mirrors your build.
You can't? I hate to say it, but sounds you are just too lazy to learn the boss and/or skill issue.


In this game having the boss's attention divided can sometimes make it even harder.
Not using the spectre will definitely be slower against King of Puppets. But having compared both fights with and without summon I somehow found it easier without it. You won't have to fear sudden aggro changes which can throw you off in that fight.

Changing damage and HP values will also alter the fight experience completely. A boss dealing (a lot) less damage will change your strategy as you might be willing to just facetank a hit and the hitstun instead of correctly space yourself and avoid the hit completely, because it would take less time recovering from hitstun than to reengage with the boss.
So why would you advocate for something like that if you want an unaltered experience?

For the first paragraph I really don't think you are getting my point.

I'm a huge advocate of preserving the experience. I think that adding difficulty slider is the best, most pure, most preserving method, while enabling more people to play. You don't agree. That is fine.

But you know what really changes the experience? When the mimic soloes a boss. So what if I can solo him. I can. And I know for a fact that I can because like I said, I don't summon on my legit first playthrough. The real experience is me soloing the boss. The second yet completely different experience is me being able to solo the boss, but I don't, and instead summon mimic and just watch. A third and completely different experience is where both I and mimic could each solo the boss, but instead we go all in and rofltomp the boss together. Doesn't work on all bosses, but works.

Compared to this, having a small numerical change, a very conservative easy mode is barely perceptable as a change in experience.

You can't really argue that me choosing easy mode and cutting the bosses hp by even a large number, from 15K to 12.5K hp, has comparable negative effect on the experience as sommoning a mimic who can tank really well and also dish out damage or summon 3 wolves who can stun lock some bosses and have decent damage, but you really can't see what is going on or summon skeletons that infintelly revive as long as the boss does not use cleaves or aoe and act as a great distraction.

I agree that changing numbers by a lot will change the experience by a lot. I never argued for that directly. Huge changes in numbers down would be "story mode".

I only argued a simple flat number like 10% because I know for a fact that a simple flat number would do more that a fair job of providing the options and everybody around here is like "how can you expect them to cater for all audiences. That would be an infinite amount of ball lancing. Buga Buga"

Sure, the devs can take time and do perfect options, balanced as they think best, but a flat scale affecting hp or damage would have similar affects

you dont want to preserve the experience, you want it to be changed to be easier because the way you can change it to be easier currently doesnt suit you

here I summed up your hypocrisy in a sentence, no need to repeat the same 4 paragraphs every answer

a simple number isnt a solution, people who cant beat the first boss wont be able to beat the last one if both are reduced by 10%, as stated before, you clearly do not get game balance and the work needed behind tweaking difficulty settings