Late game passives

[DarkElder]

I have a question, particularly for those who have tested frequently. Looking at the passives, I feel like the strongest/rarest ones are just not practical. For example, let's say I want to go for an offensive pall and just pick the top end of passives, like the one that increases damage by 50% but reduces defence by 30%. The opposite exists too, or the one that increases attack and halves health. I am talking about rank 5 passives. If you go full on damage, your pals basically become paper, so in any challenges where a maxed-out pal would be good, they are bad because if a tower boss or raid boss uses one of their abilities, they get one-shotted, or worse, their attack might be cancelled. Against any other boss roaming the world or regular tower bosses, you can easily beat them without any of that, with a single pall and gold plates (rank 3 passives), without having to farm much. I simply killed all the bounty guys once and head enough to get those gold passives, and I believe Concentration comes from the Arena. However, it can easily be achieved by simply winning the first couple of ranks.

So, in summary, it's overkill for everything in the world, and the negative stats hurt so much that they're not useful. Things like Diamant Body, which is one rank below, are much better, as is Serenity, and so on. Damage isn't everything, but it makes Rank 5 Passives obsolete, even though they should be the best ones. Taking some rank 3 or 4 passives without such big negative effect or none at all are way better than any of those. What do you guys think ?

[Shintai]

World tree harvest passives are not really to be used. They only serve as a way to do harvesting without the water. Also they are not tier 5.

EDIT: The only place they really shrine seems to be on Panthalus. God of destruction, Twin edged holy blade and then Legend and Demon God/Serenity. And thats because nobody targets him.

[Extremely Rare Sigma Gurdy Champ]

I assume the one that lowers max health is meant to be used with lifesteal, as the increased defense it has makes each point of health more valuable, which then pairs well with Diamond Body to prevent interrupting attacks and further improves the value of each health point.

I've only used all the damage passives on a Panthalus since as far as I can tell it seems pretty safe in a raid fight.

[drakeloreroar]

They're situational.

Many players like the idea of building a full glass cannon and in many cases the hardmode tower bosses are going to 1-shot or 2-shot your pals regardless if you don't withdraw them before they get hit, so if you want you can make a more micro-manage heavy build that also does so much damage it can clear the fight much faster: High-risk, High-reward.

Also a Pal like Panthalus who doesn't actually engage in direct combat while deployed at the base benefit 100% from these pure DPS passives as it's no-risk all-reward for him.

On the flip side a Passive like "Sanctified Meat Shield" is the perfect choice for a combat mount that isn't designed to fire a single attack during a fight, it works really well for Pals like Frostallion who is already fast enough to dodge everything just with Dimensional Leap alone, and who's partner skill has a focus on augmenting player damage.

I personally use Seedbed on all of my refrigerator and medical station pals, as both of those roles do not require any actual workspeed to fulfil and the less often they eat the more uptime they get.

and of course Dimensional Leap is basically a hard requirement on all transporter pals and mounts.

[DarkElder]

Originally posted by Shintai:

World tree harvest passives are not really to be used. They only serve as a way to do harvesting without the water. Also they are not tier 5.

EDIT: The only place they really shrine seems to be on Panthalus. God of destruction, Twin edged holy blade and then Legend and Demon God/Serenity. And thats because nobody targets him.

I suppose it's tier 4, then. I think Panthalus is a special case, but aside from that, there isn't much use for those passives. I'm tempted to just go for Legend, Demon God, and so on, along with Serenity, and whatever other passive you can think of from the same category with no downsides and much higher stats overall, or for raids Diamond Body, Serenity, Immortality, and a damage passive of your choice besides those with high debuffs.

[DarkElder]

Originally posted by drakeloreroar:

They're situational.

Many players like the idea of building a full glass cannon and in many cases the hardmode tower bosses are going to 1-shot or 2-shot your pals regardless if you don't withdraw them before they get hit, so if you want you can make a more micro-manage heavy build that also does so much damage it can clear the fight much faster: High-risk, High-reward.

Also a Pal like Panthalus who doesn't actually engage in direct combat while deployed at the base benefit 100% from these pure DPS passives as it's no-risk all-reward for him.

On the flip side a Passive like "Sanctified Meat Shield" is the perfect choice for a combat mount that isn't designed to fire a single attack during a fight, it works really well for Pals like Frostallion who is already fast enough to dodge everything just with Dimensional Leap alone, and who's partner skill has a focus on augmenting player damage.

I personally use Seedbed on all of my refrigerator and medical station pals, as both of those roles do not require any actual workspeed to fulfil and the less often they eat the more uptime they get.

and of course Dimensional Leap is basically a hard requirement on all transporter pals and mounts.

Yes and no. I also like glass cannon builds, but this doesn't feel worth it. If I go all out on damage, the boss will probably cancel them through some CC before they can do any damage. A lot of strong abilities require charging and can be cancelled, so getting the damage out on a fully maximazed damage pal is also not easy unless you ride the pal and therefore control its actions. I also meant passives that are meant for fighting, not the base. Sorry for the confusion.

[drakeloreroar]

Originally posted by DarkElder:

I suppose it's tier 4, then. I think Panthalus is a special case, but aside from that, there isn't much use for those passives. I'm tempted to just go for Legend, Demon God, and so on, along with Serenity, and whatever other passive you can think of from the same category with no downsides and much higher stats overall, or for raids Diamond Body, Serenity, Immortality, and a damage passive of your choice besides those with high debuffs.

Immortality / Diamond Body / Legend / Serenity are usually my go-to passives, Replace Legend with Lunker when appropriate.

For more DPS focused pals that don't flinch as often I will go with Demon God over Diamond Body, and an Elemental Passive over Legend, but Immortality and Serenity are basically hard required for any combat build.

[DarkElder]

Originally posted by DarkElder:

Originally posted by drakeloreroar:

They're situational.

Many players like the idea of building a full glass cannon and in many cases the hardmode tower bosses are going to 1-shot or 2-shot your pals regardless if you don't withdraw them before they get hit, so if you want you can make a more micro-manage heavy build that also does so much damage it can clear the fight much faster: High-risk, High-reward.

Also a Pal like Panthalus who doesn't actually engage in direct combat while deployed at the base benefit 100% from these pure DPS passives as it's no-risk all-reward for him.

On the flip side a Passive like "Sanctified Meat Shield" is the perfect choice for a combat mount that isn't designed to fire a single attack during a fight, it works really well for Pals like Frostallion who is already fast enough to dodge everything just with Dimensional Leap alone, and who's partner skill has a focus on augmenting player damage.

I personally use Seedbed on all of my refrigerator and medical station pals, as both of those roles do not require any actual workspeed to fulfil and the less often they eat the more uptime they get.

and of course Dimensional Leap is basically a hard requirement on all transporter pals and mounts.

Yes and no. I also like glass cannon builds, but this doesn't feel worth it. If I go all out on damage, the boss will probably cancel them through some CC before they can do any damage. A lot of strong abilities require charging and can be cancelled, so getting the damage out on a fully maximazed damage pal is also not easy unless you ride the pal and therefore control its actions. My point is, i feel those abilities should be better for what they are. late game is oriented around raids, hard mode towerbosses and arena. so glass canon feels not worth at all. I also meant passives that are meant for fighting, not the base. Sorry for the confusion.

[DarkElder]

Originally posted by drakeloreroar:

Originally posted by DarkElder:

I suppose it's tier 4, then. I think Panthalus is a special case, but aside from that, there isn't much use for those passives. I'm tempted to just go for Legend, Demon God, and so on, along with Serenity, and whatever other passive you can think of from the same category with no downsides and much higher stats overall, or for raids Diamond Body, Serenity, Immortality, and a damage passive of your choice besides those with high debuffs.

Immortality / Diamond Body / Legend / Serenity are usually my go-to passives, Replace Legend with Lunker when appropriate.

For more DPS focused pals that don't flinch as often I will go with Demon God over Diamond Body, and an Elemental Passive over Legend, but Immortality and Serenity are basically hard required for any combat build.

Yes, that sounds good. It's pretty much what I found out in the limited testing I did.

[DarkElder]

Thank you guys for your input.

[Teratus]

I often offset the Holy Blade -30% defense with Diamond body anyway since I still get the benefits of the stun immunity from it so it's not "wasted"

Still, pretty much every Pal should be running Immortality by end game.. it's just one of the best traits period.
Straight up attack buff + lifesteal.. can't beat it.

Generally I go for Immortal, Holy Blade, Diamond Body and Legend as often as I can.