Viability of Aircraft, Especially CAS, in 10v10

[GoMz]

Is there a way to play exclusively planes and especially CAS in 10v10 as it was possible and viable (I insist on the viable side) to do it on Wargame?

Because I have the impression that it is much less effective on Wargame, SEAD planes are not great in comparison and the stacks of enemy units being rarer, effective bombing is more difficult.

What do you think?

[Kustomautos]

honestly if you completely avoid aircraft other than AA jets you would benefit from it in 10v10. the majority of your aircraft will be shot down during its first strike mission unless your playing on a map edge and can fly off map to evac

[GoMz]

Yes that's what I fear too, I have the impression that it's difficult even if with the Berlin deck there is a way to keep alive long enough.

With the Mirage IV with 40% ECM and especially the F117 NH are not bad for that.

But on condition that there are not too many fighters in front. My opinion would be to make the planes much more expensive but by making them more efficient because as it is they look like disposable, which is not realistic at all...

[Kung Leonard den Barbariske]

Only air is a bit situational. Concentrated air can be very effective if AA is weakened in some part of the front. In other cases mostly opportunistic attacks against enemy spearheads or SEAD mission can collect some nice points. Overwhelming, preferably with SEAD coverage, against high value targets can also work against light-medium AA - although usually at a cost.

On the other hand, playing only infantry or only tanks in a 10v10 is also situational.

Airplanes seems quite disposable in cold war tactics in the views of pilots. https://www.pprune.org/aviation-history-nostalgia/447673-surviving-fulda-gap.html

Although in terms of points they might be too cheap compared to tanks, in terms of real world economy, they also lack the tactical mobility that could make them more efficient with the game limitations. I see no problem with them being cheaper for this reason.

Planes are quite deadly, so to improve them would require nerfing SAMs. I think that is not so realistic.

[Centurion74rus]

Short answer - after one latest patches - no, you cant:

8TH INFANTRY DIVISION (MECH.)

A-10A [AT] : cards decreased 2 to 1
A-10A [HE] : cards decreased 2 to 1

11TH ARM. CAVALRY REGT.

A-10A [AT] : cards decreased 2 to 1
A-10A [HE] : cards decreased 2 to 1

39-YA GV. MOTOSTRELK. DIV.

Su-25 [CLU] : cards decreased 2 to 1
Su-25 [NPLM] : cards decreased 2 to 1
Su-25 [AT] : cards decreased 2 to 1

79-YA GV. TANK. DIV.

Su-25 [CLU] : cards decreased 2 to 1
Su-25 [HE] : cards decreased 2 to 1
Su-25 [NPLM] : cards decreased 2 to 1
Su-25 [AT] : cards decreased 2 to 1

Longer answer:

"Eugen give me back my CAS plane legions!'

I love CAS planes and make few "CAS plane" experimental decks with those divisions. In best flights they spent AA rockets to shoot down enemy recon heli, drop bombs/AT rockets to infantry/tanks and shoot all rounds from cannon to tanks and APCs.

And can say:

1) Full CAS cant be effective, after 1-2 devastating plane attacks enemy usually make air def stronger as possible - fullfil hes own part of front/objective with MANPADS and normal AA, so to destroy it you need some arty (and of course show to your team enemy AA positions). Most dangerous AA - Chaparal, Rolands, Stinger, BUK, KRUG, Tunguska
- they easy can make "no fly zone".

2) In air - your team can have air superiority or not - usually you can see it in match opening (BLUEFOR usually have 2-4 F15, REDFOR - optional, from no plane to 10+ MIG 29 at start if BLUEFOR have a lot of airmobile divisions). So you cant be sure in your team air sup - you must make your own AA covered zone - better close to central objectives- to protect your own planes from enemy AA planes. Of course they shoot to 7+ km but anyway they usually go to your AA controlled zone - so they can be damaged or shoot down. If enemy lost AA plane in exchange with CAS plane it a good - usually you have more CAS planes than enemy have AA planes.

3) "Quntity is a quality" - most important thing - you can make all correct but anyway your plane can be shoot down or damaged (usually i always have 3-4 on repair), so you need a lot of them to provide air support.

4) You need your own recon squads (better LRS) in highrise buildings to spot AA and RPO ground teams in forested areas to control it against MANPAD teams.

5) You must have good heli tab to provide some air support in places where your planes cant fly (normal AA must go closer to shoot to helis).

6) You need FOB to team + supply helis to your heli wing.

7) Always have recon on left and right sides of map to see enemy helicopters run - CAS planes works very good against helicopters.

OF course you can play "only planes", but usually it became a defeat so you need a combined forces of AA, supply, arty, recon and helis as support to your planes.

[GoMz]

Thanks for your informative answers guys. especially Centurion

Today I think I had my best CAS game since I started playing the game (about 1 week)

https://steamcommunity.com/id/GoMzk/screenshot/2408950893809054387/

With the Berlin CMD Deck, carried by the F117 and the Mirages IV
At the end the game was locked I switched to support/infantry.

But apart from this deck what do you recommend? Airborn?

[Kustomautos]

Originally posted by Centurion74rus:

Short answer - after one latest patches - no, you cant:

8TH INFANTRY DIVISION (MECH.)

A-10A [AT] : cards decreased 2 to 1
A-10A [HE] : cards decreased 2 to 1

11TH ARM. CAVALRY REGT.

A-10A [AT] : cards decreased 2 to 1
A-10A [HE] : cards decreased 2 to 1

39-YA GV. MOTOSTRELK. DIV.

Su-25 [CLU] : cards decreased 2 to 1
Su-25 [NPLM] : cards decreased 2 to 1
Su-25 [AT] : cards decreased 2 to 1

79-YA GV. TANK. DIV.

Su-25 [CLU] : cards decreased 2 to 1
Su-25 [HE] : cards decreased 2 to 1
Su-25 [NPLM] : cards decreased 2 to 1
Su-25 [AT] : cards decreased 2 to 1

Longer answer:

"Eugen give me back my CAS plane legions!'

I love CAS planes and make few "CAS plane" experimental decks with those divisions. In best flights they spent AA rockets to shoot down enemy recon heli, drop bombs/AT rockets to infantry/tanks and shoot all rounds from cannon to tanks and APCs.

And can say:

1) Full CAS cant be effective, after 1-2 devastating plane attacks enemy usually make air def stronger as possible - fullfil hes own part of front/objective with MANPADS and normal AA, so to destroy it you need some arty (and of course show to your team enemy AA positions). Most dangerous AA - Chaparal, Rolands, Stinger, BUK, KRUG, Tunguska
- they easy can make "no fly zone".

2) In air - your team can have air superiority or not - usually you can see it in match opening (BLUEFOR usually have 2-4 F15, REDFOR - optional, from no plane to 10+ MIG 29 at start if BLUEFOR have a lot of airmobile divisions). So you cant be sure in your team air sup - you must make your own AA covered zone - better close to central objectives- to protect your own planes from enemy AA planes. Of course they shoot to 7+ km but anyway they usually go to your AA controlled zone - so they can be damaged or shoot down. If enemy lost AA plane in exchange with CAS plane it a good - usually you have more CAS planes than enemy have AA planes.

3) "Quntity is a quality" - most important thing - you can make all correct but anyway your plane can be shoot down or damaged (usually i always have 3-4 on repair), so you need a lot of them to provide air support.

4) You need your own recon squads (better LRS) in highrise buildings to spot AA and RPO ground teams in forested areas to control it against MANPAD teams.

5) You must have good heli tab to provide some air support in places where your planes cant fly (normal AA must go closer to shoot to helis).

6) You need FOB to team + supply helis to your heli wing.

7) Always have recon on left and right sides of map to see enemy helicopters run - CAS planes works very good against helicopters.

OF course you can play "only planes", but usually it became a defeat so you need a combined forces of AA, supply, arty, recon and helis as support to your planes.

bruh u complaining about the CAS Spam nerf im more mad that they pushed the price of most tanks beyond what you get in 1 tick at least planes are still affordable (- strike eagle)