Very weak artillery

[TerraNola]

Is it just my opinion, or is the artillery in the game disgustingly weak and useless?
I usually use it for setting smoke. But in the last match against the computer, I decided to try the counter-battery fight.
I played for the airborne division of the VD.
Bought 3 Nona. 3 Cornflower. 3 155 mm guns. I set them to counter-battery combat mode to see what would happen when using artillery by a computer.
As a result, each of them fired, probably, 20 shells, but could not destroy the enemy mortar, hitting it almost directly.

I don't understand why this is done.
This is neither balanced nor realistic. It's just stupid.
Artillery must have its place on the battlefield. Now, when they open fire on my troops with its help, I’m even too lazy to move them, because. I know that they are not in danger.

[Drug Tino]

Yes it is.

Artillery was much stronger a few months back. In fact it was so strong that many wanted it to change as it was very dominant and annoying (but more realistic of course)

I believe the main issue here was actually the way morale/suppresion works in this game not artillery itself.
Because if your units get hit by arty, they get stunlocked. With the high rate of fire they would then continously stun and slowly kill even your strongest units.

IMO this would not have been a problem if suppresion would cause/enable a fall back like in SD2 so units can retreat from the kill zone. But in WARNO suppresion ("low cohesion") makes your units slower and even locks them in place. So it had to be weakend for balancing purposes.

Hence we have acustically and visually impressive artillery. With less impressive effect on target.

I still wonder if this game would work better with Steel Divisions suppresion/pinned down/fall back mechanics.

[TerraNola]

I think, need to remove the auto attack and counter-battery button, restoring its damage and not touching the suppression.
Then it will not be so easy for a human to use artillery, he will need to spend attention and apm. But it will be rewarded.

[AlexanderKrieg]

"he will need to spend attention and apm. But it will be rewarded."
We already tried lethal arty. The game devolved into artillery duels and no one liked that.

[Install Wizard]

Yeah it is but i remember when it was strong and it was really crazy. Eugen systems always has a way of over patching or over doing fixes to the opposite side. they can never find a middle ground.

[TerraNola]

I like the idea of ​​a realistic approach to wargames.
This is a more or less reliable simulation of military operations. Let it be as it really is, whether anyone likes it or not.
There are many games about orcs and elves where there can't be strong artillery.

Idea of ​​useless units in the game is very bad for strategies.
This needs to be either balanced or removed from the game.

[Aegmar]

Last few games i played artillery seemed pretty strong, semed to be in the right place. Mortars are maybe a bit weak..., but MLRS and large caliber barrel artillery do shred stuff pretty quickly.

[BlackFoxSamaki]

Originally posted by TerraNola:

I like the idea of ​​a realistic approach to wargames.
This is a more or less reliable simulation of military operations. Let it be as it really is, whether anyone likes it or not.
There are many games about orcs and elves where there can't be strong artillery.

Idea of ​​useless units in the game is very bad for strategies.
This needs to be either balanced or removed from the game.

Have you played Eugen games? Each patch some units are made insanely OP and the rest are nerfed into pointlessness because Eugen has no clue how balancing works. HE MLRS units still wreck house, by the way.

Anyway, it's better that artillery is kept in check because like mentioned earlier in the thread we had a patch with OP arty and it was god-awful and not fun. If you want to play artillery simulator, I recommend Steel Division 2.

[molnibalage]

Originally posted by TerraNola:

I think, need to remove the auto attack and counter-battery button, restoring its damage and not touching the suppression.
Then it will not be so easy for a human to use artillery, he will need to spend attention and apm. But it will be rewarded.

Stupidest idea ever. The counter-battery option makes the game a real RTS and not a ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ reflex game.

[TerraNola]

Originally posted by molnibalage:

Originally posted by TerraNola:

I think, need to remove the auto attack and counter-battery button, restoring its damage and not touching the suppression.
Then it will not be so easy for a human to use artillery, he will need to spend attention and apm. But it will be rewarded.

Stupidest idea ever. The counter-battery option makes the game a real RTS and not a ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ reflex game.

Starcraft is a real RTS, and one of the best of its kind.
And there is absolutely nothing in it that works automatically.

Originally posted by BlackFoxSamaki:

Originally posted by TerraNola:

I like the idea of ​​a realistic approach to wargames.
This is a more or less reliable simulation of military operations. Let it be as it really is, whether anyone likes it or not.
There are many games about orcs and elves where there can't be strong artillery.

Idea of ​​useless units in the game is very bad for strategies.
This needs to be either balanced or removed from the game.

Have you played Eugen games? Each patch some units are made insanely OP and the rest are nerfed into pointlessness because Eugen has no clue how balancing works. HE MLRS units still wreck house, by the way.

Anyway, it's better that artillery is kept in check because like mentioned earlier in the thread we had a patch with OP arty and it was god-awful and not fun. If you want to play artillery simulator, I recommend Steel Division 2.

Yes, I enjoyed playing Red Dragon. But then the meta was stable. Not on release.

[abyssalKILLJOE]

Originally posted by TerraNola:

I think, need to remove the auto attack and counter-battery button, restoring its damage and not touching the suppression.
Then it will not be so easy for a human to use artillery, he will need to spend attention and apm. But it will be rewarded.

Even with the smart orders for artillery, it is still way better to manually fire-pos for your arty over using smart orders especially in PVP. Smart orders have a noticeable delay, it does not work if the enemy is moving around alot and sometimes it can waste alot of ammo on unnecessary targets. I don't see the point in removing the smart orders against computer opponent, you have the option to just not use the smart orders.

[Vovin]

Originally posted by Aegmar:

Last few games i played artillery seemed pretty strong, semed to be in the right place. Mortars are maybe a bit weak..., but MLRS and large caliber barrel artillery do shred stuff pretty quickly.

The biggest problem right now is that NATO has way too many MLRS cards and the Malka is weak. The Malka is supposed to be the one tool to directly counter NATO MLRS from across the map but they nerfed it long ago, so now you basically have to use a Smerch and hope for the best.

[rednotdead]

Artillery ("the god of war") was fine as it was a while back. It's pretty underwhelming now and the nerfs were too severe.

[Aegmar]

Originally posted by rednotdead:

Artillery ("the god of war") was fine as it was a while back. It's pretty underwhelming now and the nerfs were too severe.

Why ? It seems to destroy buildings with a few rounds, decimate Infantry in Forests, kill them in the open and some MLRS even kill slightly damaged top tier tanks with a direct hit, seen it in replays.

Or are you having mortars in mind ? Those seem significantly weaker, but then they should be i guess.

Can't really concur that Artillery is weak now, it feels pretty strong tbh. I actually found most matches i played recently have been dominated by artillery usage.

If Artillery was even stronger you basically would no longer need any other units, except recon.

[salt]

Originally posted by TerraNola:

I think, need to remove the auto attack and counter-battery button, restoring its damage and not touching the suppression.
Then it will not be so easy for a human to use artillery, he will need to spend attention and apm. But it will be rewarded.

lmao if anything the counter-battery button needs to be buffed with aimtime reduction

[Duc Wojak de Soy]

got the 203mm russian Malka shell splash 3m nest to and Ressuply Hemtt and did only 50% of his HP