Rubberbanding AI is completely insane in FH5 compared to FH4

[Krosis]

I've been playing the game for a little over 10 hrs now, while having sunk probably over 500 hrs into FH4 (through the windows store). And bloody hell what did they do to the AI. I know the AI already had comical levels of grip and acceleration in FH4, but in FH5 it's just completely nuts. And this becomes more and more obvious the higher class car you use.

In FH4 I found S1 class to be the most fun and balanced class to use and could win races easily on pro difficulty, and depending on the circuit even on unbeatable. But in FH5 however, I can't even keep up on expert difficulty, as the AI cars just rocket away on the start line and proceed to corner with impossible amounts of grip. On top of that, they always seem to have like a 60 mph higher top speed which they reach in an instant.

The only class which I find to be enjoyable and somewhat balanced right now is A(800). As I can gain enough on the AI in the corners to usually win by the end of the race. But even on A class, the AI cars accelerate like rocketships and always seem to be impossibly fast for their car rating.

Now having played sim racing games through all of my life, I dare to say that I know what I'm doing when it comes to adjusting the geometry, suspension and gearing. So I know my tuning is not at fault here.

This has to be fixed somehow because S1 class and above are completely unenjoyable in this state.

Edit:
For anyone saying oh you're just bad at the game. Being top 1% (5337th out of 1.000.000+ players) in the monthly rivals after a few laps should be good enough right?

(03-12-2021) Update:
So I tried the game out for a couple of hours now after the latest update, and I do seem to notice some changes (or maybe it's placebo effect). Seems like on some races the AI seems to be a bit toned down, and quite beatable even on the unbeatable difficulty now. I noticed that the massive acceleration boost at the start of the race seems to be less severe, as I am now launching at a similar speed. However, the top 3 cars will still gain a massive lead on the rest of the pack, and I often find myself only being able to overtake the leader near the final corners of the race on short races.

I think it differs a lot from race to race, so I can't say for sure if it has been changed at all, or if I am just imagining things. But I've now been playing on unbeatable difficulty all evening, and won 80% of my races. So I'd say check it out yourselves, and post your findings here. Did you find the AI to be more fair after the latest update, or does it still seem the same to you?

[turtleCZ]

N0xEterniS の投稿を引用：

turtleCZ の投稿を引用：

KB = assisted everything, no need for high skill

Alright. That's a pro argument right there.

Just don't compare people with gamepad because you don't need to steer like them. Compare with other KB beginners.

[Krosis]

Gumbotron の投稿を引用：

about as hard as googling "forza horizon 5 ai cheat"
here's the first result btw.
https://www.reddit.com/r/ForzaHorizon/comments/qpnh6y/if_you_say_ai_doesnt_cheat_dont_talk_to_me/

you're also a bit disingenuous if you ignore the (doubtlessly) countless times the ai passes you at from the very start. it's very hard to miss, unless you don't play the game, or have no perception of speed. do we not share that basic reality?

Hahah, this clip perfectly shows the insane grip the AI cars have. Though I must also say that car has (or atleast had in FH4) broken downforce. So that probably does play a part too. And yeah, you simply can't ignore the speeds the AI is able to launch at. It's like they always have AWD with drag tires or something, but then also proceed to just corner like they are running slicks.

[Krosis]

lolschrauber の投稿を引用：

N0xEterniS の投稿を引用：

Well I suggested they make a video about this ''crazy ai''. Show us your settings, your driving, tune..

You don't need a Video. If you have half a brain, you can just play the game and See the inconsistent AI.

They will be very slow in a few specific corners and compensate for that with insane game-logic-defying acceleration im other places of the track. And usually this only happens to 1 to 3 AI cars in the Front. You See this in pretty much every race.

If you deny this, you're simply blind and delusional, no other Option. Now that doesn't necessarily mean it's impossible to beat them, but this inconsistent speed certainly creates frustrating Situations for players.

Very true. The AI will absolutely suck on some corners, which you can then exploit to overtake them and possibly beat them, even on the highest difficulty. But this does not mean that they are not cheating with their broken acceleration and speeds.

[Krosis]

N0xEterniS の投稿を引用：

lolschrauber の投稿を引用：

You don't need a Video. If you have half a brain, you can just play the game and See the inconsistent AI.

They will be very slow in a few specific corners and compensate for that with insane game-logic-defying acceleration. And usually this only happens to 1 to 3 AI cars in the Front. You See this in pretty much every race.

If you deny this, you're simply blind and delusional, no other Option.

Shut ur stupid mouth, I want a video so everyone can see how bad you are, If I can control a rwd car on keyboard, there no f excuse for you on controller ( u can consistently beat unbeatable using a RWD ). This guy *Krosis* complains about the FH4 ai as well, what? The unbeatable AI there is the equivalent of a Rank 7-8 ( you know ranked online ), imagine grandmasters, eh? He probably says those guys cheat for sure. I'm denying this because I've raced against Unbeatable, and the only issue I have with this blatant cheating ai is that they slow down too much, too often. I'm trash at this game, but Im not complaining when Im not winning, I know theres room to improve, but all u suckers, can't even make a video to show us this cheating ai?

How about we stay civilized in the chat instead of throwing a tantrum like a child in every sentence you write.

I'll make the video when I have time in the weekend. I work an 8 to 5 job like most people in this world, so I don't have time to spend 8 hours a day playing games. And yeah, it is true that keyboard does have assisted inputs, as you don't have axis inputs on a keyboard. So the game compensates for that slightly to make your inputs more stable. Not saying keyboard is easier, as keyboard obviously does lack a level of control compared to a controller or a wheel, but it's also not impressive if that's what you think.

Also I never complained about the AI in FH4, I just acknowledged that they were already broken back then. But they were still beatable, and a lot more fair compared to the AI in FH5.

[Zero McDol]

The AI has been nerfed a bit for road races. I just tested it with the Sesto Elemento FE at S2 at the Playa Azul track on Pro. It's not a massive change, mind you, but there is a noticeable difference in the AIs' difficulty, at least for Road Races.

It does still get a rolling start, so expect it to still take off like a rocket at the start.

[Krosis]

Zero McDol の投稿を引用：

The AI has been nerfed a bit for road races. I just tested it with the Sesto Elemento FE at S2 at the Playa Azul track on Pro. It's not a massive change, mind you, but there is a noticeable difference in the AIs' difficulty, at least for Road Races.

It does still get a rolling start, so expect it to still take off like a rocket at the start.

Ooh I see an update indeed. I'll check it out if there's a noticeable difference!

[🦊 Hermit]

Krosis の投稿を引用：

How about we stay civilized in the chat

Thanks for being the voice of reason. We can discuss this without throwing around insults and condescending talk. The vitriol is the main reason I haven't bothered to respond again to this topic since my first post - indeed, it's the reason I generally avoid the FH5 forum completely, not just this topic.

Even if we disagree, let's all try to keep things decent and respectful.

[Zero McDol]

Krosis の投稿を引用：

Zero McDol の投稿を引用：

The AI has been nerfed a bit for road races. I just tested it with the Sesto Elemento FE at S2 at the Playa Azul track on Pro. It's not a massive change, mind you, but there is a noticeable difference in the AIs' difficulty, at least for Road Races.

It does still get a rolling start, so expect it to still take off like a rocket at the start.

Ooh I see an update indeed. I'll check it out if there's a noticeable difference!

Cool man, be sure to post it. My Sesto FE was never able to even come close to passing the AI leader on Pro before the update, not even in a 15 lap race. It can now.

My run times in the Sesto FE (998 S2 class - tuned) - Playa Azul:
- Low 53 second to High 52 second laps.
- Fastest lap - high 51 seconds running as fast as I can.

There's no difference in my tuning - no difference in my run times now vs before the update.

edited and fixed

edit, more info about that race here:
https://steamcommunity.com/app/1551360/discussions/0/3193611900716796742/?ctp=3

[n3mes1s]

N0xEterniS の投稿を引用：

And here we go again, kb is easier.....I guess this is why top players like Nalak, esv_suimin, esv_mars, vnx_codcaos use controllers.. everyone says kb is an inferior input in this game apart from this guy

Controllers i assume you talking about wheels? because a gamepad is by no means "better" than keyboar.d The only advantaje of the gamepad over basic or old keyboards is that you can hold throtle with the trigger. Thats all.

In terms of ergonomy, accuracy, responsiveness.. lol, keyboard is a million times superior than any gamepad. But if you are not an experienced gamer you will never know this of course. New gamers have grown with ignorance as its main ally.

And whoever says that kb is inferior to gamepads.. oh my, sorry but its not even worthy to even discuss it. Not because you grow up used to gamepads it means they are better than everything else.

[N0xEterniS]

n3mes1s の投稿を引用：

N0xEterniS の投稿を引用：

And here we go again, kb is easier.....I guess this is why top players like Nalak, esv_suimin, esv_mars, vnx_codcaos use controllers.. everyone says kb is an inferior input in this game apart from this guy

Controllers i assume you talking about wheels? because a gamepad is by no means "better" than keyboar.d The only advantaje of the gamepad over basic or old keyboards is that you can hold throtle with the trigger. Thats all.

In terms of ergonomy, accuracy, responsiveness.. lol, keyboard is a million times superior than any gamepad. But if you are not an experienced gamer you will never know this of course. New gamers have grown with ignorance as its main ally.

And whoever says that kb is inferior to gamepads.. oh my, sorry but its not even worthy to even discuss it. Not because you grow up used to gamepads it means they are better than everything else.

Bro we're talking about a racing game. Now, you don't have to believe me, take a look at the leaderboards. Ye ye full of cheaters but at some point you're going to see: ''ESV_Mars'' - very fast player uses controller, he streams on twitch, go ask him why isn't he using a keyboard. ''Nalak28'', top tuner, creates wr tunes and sets wr himself, he streams regularly on twitch, go ask him why isn't he using a keyboard in A RACING GAME. ESV_Suimin or No3ingame ( i think it's the same player ) sets wold records and u can't do anything about it, uses a controller, he also streams sometimes, u could ask him ''dude, are u stupid or something?if u wanna get good, use a keyboard IN A RACING GAME. CODCAOS, brazilian or portuguese, not sure, holds the goliath WR ( legit ) at the moment, also uses a controller, you know what to do.
THEN, there's Grandma Driving, has a youtube channel, he's been on youtube since 2013 or something, only plays on keyboard, I remember at some point, he said that he knows kb is inferior. ( sorry but I don't remember when )
Remember we're talking about a racing game, not a shooter.

EDIT: I will address some commonly asked questions
Q: Why keyboard when Gamepad/Steering Wheel is usually better?
A: I just prefer and enjoy playing on keyboard despite knowing it's limitations.

[Krosis]

🦊 Hermit の投稿を引用：

Krosis の投稿を引用：

How about we stay civilized in the chat

Thanks for being the voice of reason. We can discuss this without throwing around insults and condescending talk. The vitriol is the main reason I haven't bothered to respond again to this topic since my first post - indeed, it's the reason I generally avoid the FH5 forum completely, not just this topic.

Even if we disagree, let's all try to keep things decent and respectful.

Agreed! Sometimes people tend to be a bit too passionate about their opinions... Completely unwilling to listen to any form of reason. Would be great if we could just have a civilized discussion together and listen to everyones experiences. Whether they are true or not, there is no need to throw around insults over some subject in a game.

[N0xEterniS]

Zero McDol の投稿を引用：

Krosis の投稿を引用：

Ooh I see an update indeed. I'll check it out if there's a noticeable difference!

Cool man, be sure to post it. My Sesto FE was never able to even come close to passing the AI leader on Pro before the update, not even in a 15 lap race. It can now.

My run times in the Sesto FE (998 S2 class - tuned) - Playa Azul:
- Low 53 second to High 52 second laps.
- Fastest lap - high 51 seconds running as fast as I can.

There's no difference in my tuning - no difference in my run times now vs before the update.

edited and fixed

edit, more info about that race here:
https://steamcommunity.com/app/1551360/discussions/0/3193611900716796742/?ctp=3

See, finally we're seeing some numbers, ofc you're complaining about the ai with that time. High 51 ? I can consistently get 50.1 or 50.2 and after 10 laps 49.587.
Add me gumaboss1YT for more rivals, good practice.
EDIT: 49.229 after a couple more laps, so the issue really isn't the ai, but your skill.

[kireta]

Zero McDol の投稿を引用：

Cool man, be sure to post it. My Sesto FE was never able to even come close to passing the AI leader on Pro before the update, not even in a 15 lap race. It can now.

My run times in the Sesto FE (998 S2 class - tuned) - Playa Azul:
- Low 53 second to High 52 second laps.
- Fastest lap - high 51 seconds running as fast as I can.

There's no difference in my tuning - no difference in my run times now vs before the update.

Easy way to measure AI rubberbanding is by restarting a race. Pick overpowered build and smoke AI, then restart race (so all variables are same), and throw a race by never going past 3rd AI. See how much faster AI is if you're fast. With Unbeatable AI I got 10-15 seconds difference that way.

[AUTI5T1X]

🦊 Hermit の投稿を引用：

Krosis の投稿を引用：

How about we stay civilized in the chat

Thanks for being the voice of reason. We can discuss this without throwing around insults and condescending talk. The vitriol is the main reason I haven't bothered to respond again to this topic since my first post - indeed, it's the reason I generally avoid the FH5 forum completely, not just this topic.

Even if we disagree, let's all try to keep things decent and respectful.

No point in being civil when people will gatekeep issues not existing as well as guilt trip anybody that dares speak against this game.

[turtleCZ]

N0xEterniS の投稿を引用：

Zero McDol の投稿を引用：

Cool man, be sure to post it. My Sesto FE was never able to even come close to passing the AI leader on Pro before the update, not even in a 15 lap race. It can now.

My run times in the Sesto FE (998 S2 class - tuned) - Playa Azul:
- Low 53 second to High 52 second laps.
- Fastest lap - high 51 seconds running as fast as I can.

There's no difference in my tuning - no difference in my run times now vs before the update.

edited and fixed

edit, more info about that race here:
https://steamcommunity.com/app/1551360/discussions/0/3193611900716796742/?ctp=3

See, finally we're seeing some numbers, ofc you're complaining about the ai with that time. High 51 ? I can consistently get 50.1 or 50.2 and after 10 laps 49.587.
Add me gumaboss1YT for more rivals, good practice.
EDIT: 49.229 after a couple more laps, so the issue really isn't the ai, but your skill.

Because you use KB. It's easy then.