Warrior routine Optimsation question

[Tyler]

What exactly does the effect do?

[deb_vortex]

Weapon units (the ones with the crossed swords as type) attack faster. It does NOT work for your main character unfortunately.

[egeslean05]

Originally posted by deb_vortex:

Weapon units (the ones with the crossed swords as type) attack faster. It does NOT work for your main character unfortunately.

Well..that makes it basically pointless

[BrenTenkage]

not really, sure your main guy won't speed up, but other guys will and in combat that extra speed can add up

[egeslean05]

Originally posted by BrenTenkage:

not really, sure your main guy won't speed up, but other guys will and in combat that extra speed can add up

Maybe, if most of the ones it would apply to weren't so ridiculously weak and thus useless.

[BrenTenkage]

Originally posted by egeslean05:

Originally posted by BrenTenkage:

not really, sure your main guy won't speed up, but other guys will and in combat that extra speed can add up

Maybe, if most of the ones it would apply to weren't so ridiculously weak and thus useless.

yeah just wait till you reach the desert not to mention get the guys from the destroyer

[deb_vortex]

There are a LOT of strong weapon type units. Don't call it useless.

[egeslean05]

Originally posted by deb_vortex:

There are a LOT of strong weapon type units. Don't call it useless.

Uhh, try reading what I said again, cuz your comprehension isn't very good.

[BrenTenkage]

did you also take the time to level up the units with seeds? Cause that might be your problem

[egeslean05]

Originally posted by BrenTenkage:

did you also take the time to level up the units with seeds? Cause that might be your problem

The only summon that I have that isn't maxed is Phantom Whale. Either I've had absolutely terrible luck with that one or I've had good luck with the other rare enemies showing up and dropping research.

[deb_vortex]

Originally posted by egeslean05:

Uhh, try reading what I said again, cuz your comprehension isn't very good.

I read it again and my message stands. You said most of the units are ridiculously weak and thus useless.

First of all, when you start out the game you have to go through each area and use the units from there. Warrior is still the "easiest first class" to choose, making optimization pretty usefull on your first run(s).

On top of that, some of the strongest units are weapon type: Prayer Assassin or Cowardly Knight.

And finally: One point you that nobody has mentioned yet is that optimization increases the speed of weapon units, not just of weapon attacks. Prayer Assassin also is earth and cowardly night is wind, increasing the speed of the advanced spells as well.

[egeslean05]

Originally posted by deb_vortex:

Originally posted by egeslean05:

Uhh, try reading what I said again, cuz your comprehension isn't very good.

I read it again and my message stands. You said most of the units are ridiculously weak and thus useless.

First of all, when you start out the game you have to go through each area and use the units from there. Warrior is still the "easiest first class" to choose, making optimization pretty usefull on your first run(s).

On top of that, some of the strongest units are weapon type: Prayer Assassin or Cowardly Knight.

And finally: One point you that nobody has mentioned yet is that optimization increases the speed of weapon units, not just of weapon attacks. Prayer Assassin also is earth and cowardly night is wind, increasing the speed of the advanced spells as well.

Nice to see you backtracking to try and save face. Your response was 'don't call it useless' meaning don't call optimization useless, which I didn't, I called most of them are weak. You were wrong, Simple as that.

And yeah, there might be some strong ones, a few at most, but MOST of them are RIDICULOUSLY weak by the time you get to those strong ones, making them useless. This applies at just about every part of your progress in the game, you get to a higher area, get better summons that completely outclass what you had before, and in doing so, you might get one weapon type summon. Your own 'argument' about why you are right still supports what I said.

Since it doesn't affect YOU (the character in game, I've not seen a reason to change the default 'name' cuz it doesn't matter) and you get one, or maybe two (though one of them will most likely be outclassed quickly), weapon type summons at a time that are any good, it's something that is at best helping to speed up a fraction of your team.

Optimization isn't very good, and it's not worth putting any training into it because the bonus doesn't scale well and it doesn't affect most of what you have (and the vast majority of summons are not weapon type summons). It's a bad skill.

[deb_vortex]

Originally posted by egeslean05:

Nice to see you backtracking to try and save face. Your response was 'don't call it useless' meaning don't call optimization useless, which I didn't, I called most of them are weak. You were wrong, Simple as that.

Fine, here we go. You said:

Well..that makes it basically pointless

And after an explenation, my afore mentioned quote:

Maybe, if most of the ones it would apply to weren't so ridiculously weak and thus useless.

If you want to take it "word by word", you have not called it useless. You called it "pointless" and later in this comment "It's a bad skill".

Which it isn't.

There are a LOT of places in this game where your skills are at the same speed as the skills of your enemy and to overpower them, you have to be quicker. Only ways to do so are optimization or the "brutal right arm"-summon.

It also adds up while farming: Sharp spike is the quickest skill in the game. Only the normal skill of the late game unit "Mythril Bird" called peck is quicker. With optimization, sharp spike is quicker!

Since it doesn't affect YOU (the character in game, I've not seen a reason to change the default 'name' cuz it doesn't matter) and you get one, or maybe two (though one of them will most likely be outclassed quickly), weapon type summons at a time that are any good, it's something that is at best helping to speed up a fraction of your team.

Optimization isn't very good, and it's not worth putting any training into it because the bonus doesn't scale well and it doesn't affect most of what you have (and the vast majority of summons are not weapon type summons). It's a bad skill.

Once you reach a certain point in your stats progression, you'll be able to use weaker units again as they do enough dmg (again) and it's worth due to other benefits they provide. I for example almost always use brutal right arm in my active party. Optimization is one of the reasons for that: he is fire as well and can use magmar bomb. 10% in optimization is reached quickly and reduces the 3s to 2.7s.

I would guess you are not far in the game, yet. Continue and look back at this discussion in a few weeks. If you still not satisfied and think otherwise: thats fine and dandy, too. You also could jump onto discord and ask other players who are further in the game. You will most likely get a similar answer to what I wrote now.

EDIT: it also boosts DR multiplier and sin multiplier. The later one not by much but especially early, every bit counts. Also, when you just need 1 habit to max all the class routines it does not hurt. It's just 15 habit to cap them all out.

[deb_vortex]

Originally posted by egeslean05:

Originally posted by BrenTenkage:

did you also take the time to level up the units with seeds? Cause that might be your problem

The only summon that I have that isn't maxed is Phantom Whale. Either I've had absolutely terrible luck with that one or I've had good luck with the other rare enemies showing up and dropping research.

Pssst: you can farm all units but bosses easily vs the demon king, has he copies your team.

[Ayka]

Optimsation is one of the best routines. Farming is vital point of the game, and with sharp spike, weapon summon and sloth dungeon switching it makes a giant difference. Especially important in the mid-late game.