I hate steam reviews and the "gaming" community

[Kapy]

God knows games either suck or they are great. There is unfortunately rarely something in between for many people. And while there is LOTS of things that callisto protocol deserves to be critized for, I can't help but think sometimes:

Damn, we horror fans really ♥♥♥♥♥♥ up one of the very few AAA titles in this genre by comparing it to dead space and giving the game on release no chance to adjust.
I'm not saying, that games shouldn't be polished on release.
I'm not saying, that this game deserves to be a 10/10 or anything like that.

But I am saying - we "gamers" are at fault that we only get games as a service. We are at fault that tons of games release as early access titles without any chance to getting fully released. We are at fault, because we vote with our wallet and every single youtuber on this planet loves to jump on a good old controversy train for sensationalism which encourages their fans to review bomb a title and scare of any potential buyers.

Callisto Protocol has a great soundtrack, amazing graphics, a janky but very cinematic combatsystem and not one in a dozen indie horror titles.

[Kapy]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Lardo:

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Kapy:

Have you read what I've written, Lardo?
I'm not denying that the game had tons of technical issues. In fact, in the third sentence of my post I admit that this game had a lot of things that it could be criticized for.

But at the same time, the gaming community chokes on remakes, bad releases, false advertisement, overhype, never finished early access titles.

I just wished, people would have been more lenient and patient with these developers.
That someone would have said, hey it's a new IP, great graphics, a chillingly beautiful theme song(Kings Elliot - Lost again), unreal engine 4, non-indie horror and it's janky on lots of hardware, but they will fix it. Just return it with steam refund, go back at it in two weeks.

And I bet that situation would have been the best outcome for all parties. Developers and players.

But instead we got reviewbombs and rage videos on youtube. That generates clicks.
I hope you can understand my frustration.

I have read it. It's an all-over-the-place rant with no clear point, the only thing I understood from it is you're blaming the "community" and Steam reviews for it. I thought it's a totally misguided BS, so that's what I said. I agree with some of your points, like the one that people don't support quality SP gaming releases enough, but this has nothing to do with "community" and reviews. Steam has more than enough tools to provide the best experience, like filtering highest rated reviews, not counting people who got the game for free, showing how long a person played it, etc., etc. I just don't get what's there to hate.

It would be so nice if Steam had a point system, so people could judge it on a scale of 1 to 5 or 1 to 10.. I think that has been requested for years. Or at the very least a middleground between thumbs up and down. A third button. I've seen plenty of reviews where people say they regret giving this a thumbs up or down because there is that one thing etc. Sad to see that you didn't understand much else from my posts, but I've repeated myself here plenty of times and I'm sure it has nothing to do with just understanding at this point.

[Kapy]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Greed Is Addiction:

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Kapy:

I just wished, people would have been more lenient and patient with these developers.

For $60 which many slave away to get, you don't get lenient and patient. For $60, that $#it better be ace. $19.99 would have earned lenient and patient.

For what they offered back in Dec. 2022 riddled with Denuvo malware, all of the stuttering caused by the extra unnecessary DRM and obviously not ready, it should have cost $25.

The greed addiction creates a form of blindness. Devs and some of the larger companies don't seem bright enough to see it, and consumers are always going to turn into an angry mob as evidenced here and every other game bogged down by Denuvo, the stuttering it creates, and the greed addiction program which inspired its inclusion.

This game got exactly what it deserved. Basically an overpriced, clunky, slow crawling, boring hallway boxing cashgrab which only makes you wish you had a new Dead Space game the majority of the time you're playing it. I spent $5.32 on a post-Denuvo steam key so it still feels like a win - but I was still wishing it was a new DS game.

It's great that you and everyone else keeps mentioning Dead Space.
Where is dead space right now though? It got a remake and the series itself is dead. Exploited by EA beyond measure.
And that's where we are standing. Very few triple A horror titles left, try to think of a few.
That's the whole point of my post, I'd rather people be lenient on a new horror game title, that can potentially improve along the way or in its sequel, than barely have any horror titles at all.

But well, no help arguing here on steam.

[Greed Is Addiction]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Kapy:

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Greed Is Addiction:

For $60 which many slave away to get, you don't get lenient and patient. For $60, that $#it better be ace. $19.99 would have earned lenient and patient.

For what they offered back in Dec. 2022 riddled with Denuvo malware, all of the stuttering caused by the extra unnecessary DRM and obviously not ready, it should have cost $25.

The greed addiction creates a form of blindness. Devs and some of the larger companies don't seem bright enough to see it, and consumers are always going to turn into an angry mob as evidenced here and every other game bogged down by Denuvo, the stuttering it creates, and the greed addiction program which inspired its inclusion.

This game got exactly what it deserved. Basically an overpriced, clunky, slow crawling, boring hallway boxing cashgrab which only makes you wish you had a new Dead Space game the majority of the time you're playing it. I spent $5.32 on a post-Denuvo steam key so it still feels like a win - but I was still wishing it was a new DS game.

It's great that you and everyone else keeps mentioning Dead Space.
Where is dead space right now though? It got a remake and the series itself is dead. Exploited by EA beyond measure.
And that's where we are standing. Very few triple A horror titles left, try to think of a few.
That's the whole point of my post, I'd rather people be lenient on a new horror game title, that can potentially improve along the way or in its sequel, than barely have any horror titles at all.

But well, no help arguing here on steam.

You make a valid point. $60 is still too much to ask for any leniency with embedded malware DRM which they only announced 4 days before release. If there was a poor move checklist to releasing a PC game, Krafton followed it like a champ here.

The Evil Within 1 and 2 come to mind.

I'm not the only one hoping the recent DS remake inspires a fourth game in the series at some point.

[Kapy]

Evil Within is indeed great and we need more games like these.
Hate to break it to you, your comment made me look into the current state of dead space.
Apparently there was some talk about Dead Space 4 after the successful DS1 Remake, but Jason Schreier confirmed that the Franchise is officially on hold.
Source:
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2024-04-10/-dead-space-franchise-is-officially-on-hold-at-electronic-arts
The article is behind a paywall unfortunately though.
A reddit thread discussing it however, stated, that the remake failed to hit the desired sales mark.
https://www.reddit.com/r/PS5/comments/1c10dum/bloombergjason_schreier_dead_space_franchise_is/

So, yeah... Non-indie Horror becomes too niche for those multimillion companies and indie horror is I guess the more viable way to go, considering the success of phasmophobia / lethal company / content warning etc.
Kinda like realtime strategy games, I guess?
But that's just how it *feels* to me.

[Lardo]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Kapy:

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Lardo:

I have read it. It's an all-over-the-place rant with no clear point, the only thing I understood from it is you're blaming the "community" and Steam reviews for it. I thought it's a totally misguided BS, so that's what I said. I agree with some of your points, like the one that people don't support quality SP gaming releases enough, but this has nothing to do with "community" and reviews. Steam has more than enough tools to provide the best experience, like filtering highest rated reviews, not counting people who got the game for free, showing how long a person played it, etc., etc. I just don't get what's there to hate.

It would be so nice if Steam had a point system, so people could judge it on a scale of 1 to 5 or 1 to 10.. I think that has been requested for years. Or at the very least a middleground between thumbs up and down. A third button. I've seen plenty of reviews where people say they regret giving this a thumbs up or down because there is that one thing etc. Sad to see that you didn't understand much else from my posts, but I've repeated myself here plenty of times and I'm sure it has nothing to do with just understanding at this point.

First of all, this is the first time I see you suggesting something like the third button, so I'm not the one who has comprehension problems. Second of all, you started with "I hate Steam reviews" not "Steam reviews have problems, here's what I propose". Third of all, over the years we saw the trend of 10 point scale reviews pretty much go away, since everyone realized it doesn't solve anything, so I'm totally with Steam on this one.

[Kapy]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Lardo:

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Kapy:

It would be so nice if Steam had a point system, so people could judge it on a scale of 1 to 5 or 1 to 10.. I think that has been requested for years. Or at the very least a middleground between thumbs up and down. A third button. I've seen plenty of reviews where people say they regret giving this a thumbs up or down because there is that one thing etc. Sad to see that you didn't understand much else from my posts, but I've repeated myself here plenty of times and I'm sure it has nothing to do with just understanding at this point.

First of all, this is the first time I see you suggesting something like the third button, so I'm not the one who has comprehension problems. Second of all, you started with "I hate Steam reviews" not "Steam reviews have problems, here's what I propose". Third of all, over the years we saw the trend of 10 point scale reviews pretty much go away, since everyone realized it doesn't solve anything, so I'm totally with Steam on this one.

Sorry, but my first two sentences literally say:
"God knows games either suck or they are great. There is unfortunately rarely something in between for many people. "
Me suggesting in a later comment that a third button would be a good thing isn't really rocket science Lardo ^^' . Also, please try to not make it so personal. I know I've started really passionately with my post, but at this point - after so many days, it's kinda useless now isn't it?
About your second point: It's not really that I can do anything about it even if I had the most amazing proposal. None of us can. People vote with their wallet and I bet we can all agree that the gaming industry has some problems. Not every company, but a lot of companies. And how we as a community deal with a games success or failure is a part of it. And I consider it the way callisto protocol was treated was toxic whereas you, as someone who didn't enjoy the game I guess, considers it fair. That's the reality of it.
No need to argue further.

And regarding your last point: while I can see that here and there it goes away, I would still feel like it wouldn't hurt if we still had a 10 point system for steam. I don't think we ever even had that, but I might be wrong on that one.

[☣ βioClone λx-45 ☣]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Kapy:

God knows games either suck or they are great. There is unfortunately rarely something in between for many people. And while there is LOTS of things that callisto protocol deserves to be critized for, I can't help but think sometimes:

Damn, we horror fans really ♥♥♥♥♥♥ up one of the very few AAA titles in this genre by comparing it to dead space and giving the game on release no chance to adjust.
I'm not saying, that games shouldn't be polished on release.
I'm not saying, that this game deserves to be a 10/10 or anything like that.

But I am saying - we "gamers" are at fault that we only get games as a service. We are at fault that tons of games release as early access titles without any chance to getting fully released. We are at fault, because we vote with our wallet and every single youtuber on this planet loves to jump on a good old controversy train for sensationalism which encourages their fans to review bomb a title and scare of any potential buyers.

Callisto Protocol has a great soundtrack, amazing graphics, a janky but very cinematic combatsystem and not one in a dozen indie horror titles.

I hate that developers invest more money on graphics than on design boards and meetings, what actually is quite cheap...

Calisto protocol to me looks for the moment like a game that instead upgrade Dead Space mechanics, decided to replace some key elements of it recipe with others WORSE...

In Dead space Melee has a place, however is very limited in scope... Well in Callisto the shooting mechanics got reduced to that same dimension, while the melee mechanics pretend to replace all the good things shooting gave us on Dead Space... and fails miserably by giving us a very simplistic gameplay experience that offers little if not zero variety at the end of the day...

I could beat (and did) Dead Space with the plasma cutter and was fine, I got sick of the combat mechanic already before getting the batton....

[I Should Be Sleeping]

I knew when I saw the first game play trailer it would be nothing special on it's best day. It's made the head dude behind dead space so of course people will see the inspiration and compare it.

Even if you ignore all that it's just an average game with an above average price tag that does nothing special at all.

[H0LL0W1D0L]

I have been playing it recently and enjoying it quite a bit. I am playing on a 3070, High settings in 1440p and nary an issue on my end. Except, oddly, the startup menu "lags" some, for some reason. It is the jankiest part of the game by far in my experience.

But to the topic at hand -- I agree with you. A lot of people have trouble thinking for themselves and that has only been compounded over time with the rise of social media and "YouTube stars". I personally only ever use YouTube for collectible guides and cooking recipes.

There are still conscious gamers out there, we just tend to not care what others think or let it bother us. I am 38 years old, I have been gaming since I was 6. I am at a stage in my life where I simply do not, for the most part, care about the zeitgeist and all the hate narratives surrounding gaming, movies, shows, politics, etc. If I see something that looks intriguing to me, I will buy it (usually on sale), experience it for myself, and draw my own conclusions.

[66GraF66]

The horror genre better be dead than releasing something like this. Absolutely broken at release, awful scenario without satisfying conclusion and in the DLC it’s just some crazy dream. Weapons absolutely terrible and lazy, duplicating each other, two shotgun types, pistol and smg, which works similar. Absolutely awful and long stealth level with poor design which better just rush through than suffer crawling. Same boss used over and over with the same mechanics.
But yeah, this game looks good and base of the combat is decent.
So the game totally deserved mixed reviews and bad sales. And when someone asks me if they should buy that game I would advise them to buy Dead Space, buy indie horror or play some older games, as I would do.

[Lardo]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Kapy:

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Lardo:

First of all, this is the first time I see you suggesting something like the third button, so I'm not the one who has comprehension problems. Second of all, you started with "I hate Steam reviews" not "Steam reviews have problems, here's what I propose". Third of all, over the years we saw the trend of 10 point scale reviews pretty much go away, since everyone realized it doesn't solve anything, so I'm totally with Steam on this one.

Sorry, but my first two sentences literally say:
"God knows games either suck or they are great. There is unfortunately rarely something in between for many people. "
Me suggesting in a later comment that a third button would be a good thing isn't really rocket science Lardo ^^' . Also, please try to not make it so personal. I know I've started really passionately with my post, but at this point - after so many days, it's kinda useless now isn't it?
About your second point: It's not really that I can do anything about it even if I had the most amazing proposal. None of us can. People vote with their wallet and I bet we can all agree that the gaming industry has some problems. Not every company, but a lot of companies. And how we as a community deal with a games success or failure is a part of it. And I consider it the way callisto protocol was treated was toxic whereas you, as someone who didn't enjoy the game I guess, considers it fair. That's the reality of it.
No need to argue further.

And regarding your last point: while I can see that here and there it goes away, I would still feel like it wouldn't hurt if we still had a 10 point system for steam. I don't think we ever even had that, but I might be wrong on that one.

You're right, it's a pretty pointless argument, but not for the reason you think: in your mind Steam reviews are the reason we're not getting TCP2, but look a Dead Space remake. It was in decent technical condition and was widely praised, but none of this mattered for EA that was expecting more sales. "People loved the game, huh? Not enough people though, so kill it". Sales are and will always be the main reason, major publishers couldn't care less about reviews, only passionate indie devs can be motivated by warm community reception and try and build a long term fan base.

[Greed Is Addiction]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Lardo:

look a Dead Space remake. It was in decent technical condition and was widely praised, but none of this mattered for EA that was expecting more sales.

The original DS still runs good and looks good at max detail and in stereoscopic 3D via nvidia 3D vision. Maybe one day when the remake is $9.99 or less I'll see what I'm missing. The new necromorph skins just didn't look great to me so a $50 price tag was even more ridiculous.

[Lardo]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Greed Is Addiction:

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Lardo:

look a Dead Space remake. It was in decent technical condition and was widely praised, but none of this mattered for EA that was expecting more sales.

The original DS still runs good and looks good at max detail and in stereoscopic 3D via nvidia 3D vision. Maybe one day when the remake is $9.99 or less I'll see what I'm missing. The new necromorph skins just didn't look great to me so a $50 price tag was even more ridiculous.

Thanks for letting me know.

[ペンギン]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Kapy:

I hate steam reviews and the "gaming" community

"Gamers" these days should first and foremost learn what "product reviews" actually really are. And above all, free themselves from what Valve tells them how "product reviews" should be.

This also includes not using terms like "review bomb", as the definition as well as the statement behind "review bombs" (artificial word by Valve) is a pure censorship tool.

That would be the first step.

[TcT Goth98]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Greed Is Addiction:

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Kapy:

It's great that you and everyone else keeps mentioning Dead Space.
Where is dead space right now though? It got a remake and the series itself is dead. Exploited by EA beyond measure.
And that's where we are standing. Very few triple A horror titles left, try to think of a few.
That's the whole point of my post, I'd rather people be lenient on a new horror game title, that can potentially improve along the way or in its sequel, than barely have any horror titles at all.

But well, no help arguing here on steam.

You make a valid point. $60 is still too much to ask for any leniency with embedded malware DRM which they only announced 4 days before release. If there was a poor move checklist to releasing a PC game, Krafton followed it like a champ here.

The Evil Within 1 and 2 come to mind.

I'm not the only one hoping the recent DS remake inspires a fourth game in the series at some point.

It won't. EA already stated the Dead Space 1 remake did not get the amount of money they wanted to justify keeping the IP alive. They themselves said they are done with it.