Why in mostly stealth game we have only 4 stealth weapons and like 20 non stealth?!

[Golod]

first i need to say that i love this game. bought it like few days ago and cant stop playing.

BUT. this game advertised as a STEALTH-action game. in the discription we can even read "challenging stealth-action". and when you play this game, every level your "friend" suggest you to go in stealth. clearly dev made it obvious that gun blazing is an option but only AN OPTION, and you should play it in stealth.

so for mostly stealth game, dev made more than 20 non stealth weapons and ONLY 4 stealth weapons? and im asking. what with devs that making stealth games but afraid to give player a lot of different stealth weapons?! how hard to add in game something like crossbow, or machin gun with rubber bullets (like in metal gear 5), or different bows, or net gun (like in death stranding), or silent pumping gun (like in metro 2033), or some slingshot (like in farcry 5), or different throwing weapons, etc. plus dev could add different stealth gadgets. like thermal vision, gas grenades, grapling hook, tactickal flashlight, drones, some traps (electrical, or tranquilizing), etc

but no. in mostly stealth game we have 4 stealth weapon (silent gun. tranquilizer rifle, one throwing knife, tazer. i dont count 3 different silent gun because they are the same in mechanics different only ammo and noise) and more than 20 non-stealth weapons and gadgets.

what with devs that clearly made there game to be played mostly in stealth (or at list made the game to let you play either stealth or shooting everything, 50/50)? but in the same time making insane arsenal of lethal weapon and only like 1-2 stealth weapon and gadget?! tons of examples how to make stealth arsenal more interesting. look at metal gear for example.

im not asking to add every stealth weapon you can find in other game. im just saying: dont make a stealth (or stealth-shooting) game and add 20 non stealth weapons and only few stealth one.

PS sorry for my english. only learning.

[Vault Traveler]

i mean yeah but if you have 1-2 good stealth weapons there isnt much of a reason to use anything else, you need 1hit kills or at least a predictable outcome or else stealth gets tedious very fast. that limits the weapon options quite a lot.

you could drop a silencer on everything and call it a day but ultimatly it would make loud combat less interesting.

[sigma sam]

Funnily enough only the .45 and the 9mm are viable for true difficulty stealth because the vt-9 (i think it was called,its the 9mm subsonic one) sometimes doesnt actually kill whatever you shoot at

No silenced primary kind of sucks too but i guess it would make the game too easy- then again theres a rating for being quiet but a killer

[Golod]

Publicado originalmente por Vault Traveler:

i mean yeah but if you have 1-2 good stealth weapons there isnt much of a reason to use anything else, you need 1hit kills or at least a predictable outcome or else stealth gets tedious very fast. that limits the weapon options quite a lot.

you could drop a silencer on everything and call it a day but ultimatly it would make loud combat less interesting.

i love how Kojima making the stealth part of the game. in MGS and deathstranding you have like 10 stealth weapons. and they all fun. they not make game insanly easy (welp maybe only flying fist) but you get much more options and mechanics with his different weapons.

[CHOO CHOO]

AFAIK, you don't have to play the game with full stealth. It seems valid to take a good primary gun for when things go bad, and try to stealth along with your secondary weapon and knife and tricks until you mess up, then enjoy the wide selection of loud guns.

[Golod]

Publicado originalmente por CHOO CHOO:

AFAIK, you don't have to play the game with full stealth. It seems valid to take a good primary gun for when things go bad, and try to stealth along with your secondary weapon and knife and tricks until you mess up, then enjoy the wide selection of loud guns.

i think you didnt get my main point. small example. when you go into restaruant that advertised as mostly japan, plus italian food. but see in menu that they have only 2 roles from japan kitchen and like 20 from italia... wouldnt you ask yourself "WTF?!". why couldnt they make menu at list a little bit even between japan and itlian. why they made it almosy 90% italian?

[Cream Corn Lover]

I honestly just use the emp the flashbang and my fists plus the shadows best way to go in stealth

[Vault Traveler]

Publicado originalmente por Golod:

Publicado originalmente por Vault Traveler:

i mean yeah but if you have 1-2 good stealth weapons there isnt much of a reason to use anything else, you need 1hit kills or at least a predictable outcome or else stealth gets tedious very fast. that limits the weapon options quite a lot.

you could drop a silencer on everything and call it a day but ultimatly it would make loud combat less interesting.

i love how Kojima making the stealth part of the game. in MGS and deathstranding you have like 10 stealth weapons. and they all fun. they not make game insanly easy (welp maybe only flying fist) but you get much more options and mechanics with his different weapons.

I am not disagreeing but as an insane MGS Fanboi myself I automatically use that stuff that gives me a) the rating I aimed for or b) the cheesiest way possible.

Therefor I understand and mostly agree with you, I believe its wasted effort to even add them.

But I would be happily wrong because, why not.

[45]

Publicado originalmente por Golod:

Publicado originalmente por Vault Traveler:

i mean yeah but if you have 1-2 good stealth weapons there isnt much of a reason to use anything else, you need 1hit kills or at least a predictable outcome or else stealth gets tedious very fast. that limits the weapon options quite a lot.

you could drop a silencer on everything and call it a day but ultimatly it would make loud combat less interesting.

i love how Kojima making the stealth part of the game. in MGS and deathstranding you have like 10 stealth weapons. and they all fun. they not make game insanly easy (welp maybe only flying fist) but you get much more options and mechanics with his different weapons.

the tranq dart is broken in every mgs game its in what do you mean?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VeJLsc17q_A

also you better watch out OP

[Trygger]

I killed a lot of people in my run. (Light to medium armor, loud primary, silent secondary, and attempt to be undetected as long as possible, switching to loud once it is no longer viable such as an enemy shooting their weapon. In the later missions I switched to exclusively loud.)

I think the selection of "stealth weapons" we currently have is more than enough to get the job done and there's variety.

3 silenced pistols. (One "Ultra Silent" one that is basically a modernized Welrod and has slow fire rate and reloading. Very rare ammo. Then 2 semi-auto ones. A quieter .45 with uncommon ammo, and an unlockable 9mm with common ammo, but it's much more noisy.)

Throwing Knives. I haven't played in a while so I forgot if you can reuse them (I don't think you can if you hit an enemy?) but they're also nearly completely silent.

Tazer. I used this a few times. I forgot the stats on it exactly, but despite the game warning you about the limited range, the range is still pretty long in my experience. (It's only really a problem if you're trying to taze someone from one side of the screen to the other.) I don't remember how noisy it is (I do remember enemies would "scream" in the form of a text bubble but I don't know if that actually generates "noise" for the AI to hear) but it was a good item to bring to help deal with guards when silent pistol ammo is a problem. (Since it's considered "Gear" and not a secondary, meaning you can bring both the tazer and pistol)

I haven't used the tranquilizer rifle. But judging by me messing with it on the range it's VP9 levels of silent. I believe it only takes one dart to KO someone but I don't know how they react. (I think there is a short delay before they fall asleep, and I expect they'd become investigative as they'd probably feel the dart hit them.) Ammo seems impossible to obtain so you're stuck with the few darts you have.

There's also that EMP pistol which feels like a reference to the EMP device from Splinter Cell. Never used it. It is silent though, and I believe it has unlimited ammo, but a slow recharge rate and I think enemies would probably get suspicious when lights start mysteriously turning off. (And they don't stay off) Usually there's multiple lights so the slow recharge rate makes me struggle to find good uses for this tool.

All together I feel the "Stealth Weapons" cover all the bases. The only thing that I could argue is missing is silenced lethal primaries such as an MP5SD, an ACC Honey Badger, some sort of silenced shotgun, etc. but adding those seems like it'd unbalance the game.

(Also, with how the game balance treats silenced weapons, a gun shooting rifle rounds is going to be very noisy even when suppressed, so there wouldn't be a very big advantage.)

[Golod]

Publicado originalmente por Trygger:

I killed a lot of people in my run. (Light to medium armor, loud primary, silent secondary, and attempt to be undetected as long as possible, switching to loud once it is no longer viable such as an enemy shooting their weapon. In the later missions I switched to exclusively loud.)

I think the selection of "stealth weapons" we currently have is more than enough to get the job done and there's variety.

3 silenced pistols. (One "Ultra Silent" one that is basically a modernized Welrod and has slow fire rate and reloading. Very rare ammo. Then 2 semi-auto ones. A quieter .45 with uncommon ammo, and an unlockable 9mm with common ammo, but it's much more noisy.)

Throwing Knives. I haven't played in a while so I forgot if you can reuse them (I don't think you can if you hit an enemy?) but they're also nearly completely silent.

Tazer. I used this a few times. I forgot the stats on it exactly, but despite the game warning you about the limited range, the range is still pretty long in my experience. (It's only really a problem if you're trying to taze someone from one side of the screen to the other.) I don't remember how noisy it is (I do remember enemies would "scream" in the form of a text bubble but I don't know if that actually generates "noise" for the AI to hear) but it was a good item to bring to help deal with guards when silent pistol ammo is a problem. (Since it's considered "Gear" and not a secondary, meaning you can bring both the tazer and pistol)

I haven't used the tranquilizer rifle. But judging by me messing with it on the range it's VP9 levels of silent. I believe it only takes one dart to KO someone but I don't know how they react. (I think there is a short delay before they fall asleep, and I expect they'd become investigative as they'd probably feel the dart hit them.) Ammo seems impossible to obtain so you're stuck with the few darts you have.

There's also that EMP pistol which feels like a reference to the EMP device from Splinter Cell. Never used it. It is silent though, and I believe it has unlimited ammo, but a slow recharge rate and I think enemies would probably get suspicious when lights start mysteriously turning off. (And they don't stay off) Usually there's multiple lights so the slow recharge rate makes me struggle to find good uses for this tool.

All together I feel the "Stealth Weapons" cover all the bases. The only thing that I could argue is missing is silenced lethal primaries such as an MP5SD, an ACC Honey Badger, some sort of silenced shotgun, etc. but adding those seems like it'd unbalance the game.

(Also, with how the game balance treats silenced weapons, a gun shooting rifle rounds is going to be very noisy even when suppressed, so there wouldn't be a very big advantage.)

totally miss my point. as i said to another person. when you see restaurant that saying japan-italian one. but when you get in you see that in the menu only 5 meals from japan and like 30 from italia. tecnically they didnt lie. but i still would feel like i been lied? all i want and all i said: if game saying its STEALTH base with action ellements. than for sure i would like to see at list 50\50% of weapons for stealth and for action. not like 5 for stealth and 30 for action. if you have so many action weapons than call your game action base with some stealth elements. get it?

[sрy]

Steam workshop now has a bunch of new weapon mods, so feel free to install as many as you wish - the community has made some cool weapons like the Silencerco Maxim 9, suppressed Kriss Vector, and others; you should also definitely check out the AS VAL, PSS, and the "suppressed weapons 40% quieter" mods

[Golod]

Publicado originalmente por sрy:

Steam workshop now has a bunch of new weapon mods, so feel free to install as many as you wish - the community has made some cool weapons like the Silencerco Maxim 9, suppressed Kriss Vector, and others; you should also definitely check out the AS VAL, PSS, and the "suppressed weapons 40% quieter" mods

yep thanks to modders we have a little bit more stealth guns. but still not my point. dev making stealth base game with like 3 stealth weapons but at the same time adding 20-30 action weapon. in stealth base game 3 stealth and like 30 for action.

[sрy]

if I had a bigger budget and more development time there would have been more weapons, but as it stands I had neither when I released the game - there was too much work for one person, and my finances were drying up

[Golod]

Publicado originalmente por sрy:

if I had a bigger budget and more development time there would have been more weapons, but as it stands I had neither when I released the game - there was too much work for one person, and my finances were drying up

i didnt notice you are the developer. first of all - its a great game. you done great job. thank you for it.

but i wonder you saying it was too much work and low budget. but here my point. why than waist so much time and budget on making like 30 action weapon and gudgets? in stealth base game? you could make like 5-10 action weapon. and time and budget out of other 20 action weapons spend on making at list 5-10 more stealth weapon and gudget?

its just strange for me that this game clealry made by you to be played stealth mostly. even our "partner" repeate it from mission to mission "better go stealth". but still making 30 action weapons (which would be used by much less players than stealth weapon). and only few stealth one.

PS and once more. it doesnt mean that i think game is bad because of it. i love this game. i even bought it 4 times. twice for me (second time because i lost my steam account) and twice for my friends. but when you love game you want it to be even better.

[Stray952]

Uh. Guns just are loud. I think you're the one missing the point. And eventually you HAVE to use the weapons. What do you want, nunchucks? Ninja stars? I don't even know what else their could be. Maybe a baseball bat? But that would work exactly like the knife but not be throwable.

Lots of guns exist in the world. There are not many stealth weapons.