(WIP) How to get enough damage for pyramid floor -100

[SpicyOtter]

First off, don't focus on this until after you have at least 80 shards, and you have most of the main upgrades in the ancient shop. To get ancient leaves, note that 1% of +additional ancient leaf property craft is applied.


The end goal of the pyramid is getting to level 100 to unlock the new area. Unlocking this floor is relatively simple, but beating it is another story. Unlike the tower, the pyramid has exponential growth; each floor is twice as hard as the previous. You need 1e41 slap damage to beat the boss on pyramid level 100, but that isn’t meaningful unless you equip an full a10 damage/damage%/slap ancient set*. So instead, here are some minimum goals to get started.

• 1000 shards and the following ancient shop upgrades before anything else:
  
  • 10/10 witch essence
    
  • 5/5 item drop count
    
  • 5/5 Material Duplicator
    
  • ??/20 witch reviver (get as much as is cheap)
    
  • ??/20 witch curses (get as much as is cheap)
• From farming the witch:
  
  • 1 (100/100) pet, crab or butterfly
    
  • 1 (80/100) unique leaves
    
  • 1 (80/100) equipment
• 50,000 (5e4) cursed cheese equipment and 17k tower floor
  
• 25,000,000 (2.5e7) curses
  
• 3 half maxed (50/100) trout. 184k materials
  
• Leaf counter: 21600 (3 days with 5/5 mulch shop Leaf Counter Macro)
  
• At least level 16 of the kyanite gem leaf 'leaf damage multiplier'

After completing all these goals, you probably can only complete floor 98ish.

• Double cursed cheese equipment, 1e5 and 34k tower floor
  
• 2 of the following
  
  • Max a trout
    
  • Double curses, 5e7
    
  • Farm witch essence
    
    • 2 (100/100) pet, crab or butterfly
      
    • 2 (80/100) unique leaves
      
    • 2 (80/100) equipment

Don’t bother upgrading tools in the dark glade. Only the fish really matter now, and you can max out all of your other tools later.

* a10 damage/damage%/slap ancient set, copied from Farfar Göran on discord.
Damage Craft Setup: 27/27/26 shard distribution
Craft 1 = 10 Blower enemy damage (flat)
Craft 2 = 10 Blower enemy damage (flat)
Craft 3 = 7 Blower enemy damage (flat) 3 Blower enemy damage %
Craft 4 = 10 Blower enemy damage %
Craft 5 = 10 Blower enemy damage %
Craft 6 = 4 Blower enemy damage % 6 Slap multiplier
Craft 7 = 10 Slap multiplier
Craft 8 = 10 Slap multiplier
Note: you still want Blower enemy damage (flat) and % with slap multiplier on each craft


** Pets and unique leaves need to be equipped to get the damage bonus, hence crab and butterfly. Your 3rd 4th and 5th max pets can be anything else, no other pets will meaningfully boost your damage over the rest. Fisho will give <1% slap damage boost with the minimum recommendation, and that value decreases as you start to max your trout. With that in mind I don't recommend upgrading fisho.

*** A maxed trout gives a special bonus at level 100, equivalent to 100 additional levels.



Question: Should I level pets/uniques/equipment/tools evenly or max one at a time?
Answer: It generally doesn't matter. The cost of each level is roughly proportional to the increase in damage. There is nothing super special about level 100. You could stop at level 96 for example, and get the same amount of damage proportional to the amount of resources spent. Trouts are an exception as trouts provide a large boost at level 100 for slap damage. Only equipped pets contribute to damage, so only upgrade (past level 10) as many pets as you can equip.

Tools need 307k materials to 100/100
Pets need 16k leaf essence to 100/100
Leaves need 27k cosmic essence to 100/100
Equipment need 27k water essence to 100/100

[Silberfuchs]

The other thing to keep in mind:
This topic only provides a proven guideline to what combination of damage increasing sources are able to reach the required amount of damage.

Someone that simply plays for a long time (=> leaf counter) or farms a long time in the tower (=> equip/ cursed cheese) or at the witch (=> curses) will end up getting much more out of those sources of extra damage, hence can cut out getting high level pets or uniques for example.

OP simply made some reasonable assumptions about goals that can be reached by the average player after a while.

But some players can and will choose a more one sided ways to increase their damage. Leading to the leeway needed to neglect other damage increasing sources.

Especially a longer than "normal" time in the tower (=> cursed cheese) might actually not be such a bad idea, because shortly after beating pyramid floor 100 you want to farm 8e16 gem leaves anyways.

[frerouche]

Silberfuchs původně napsal:

Especially a longer than "normal" time in the tower (=> cursed cheese) might actually not be such a bad idea, because shortly after beating pyramid floor 100 you want to farm 8e16 gem leaves anyways.

And I'm currently doing just that, farming gem leaves for that 8e16 I found out you need to buy the seeds' first level yesterday.
My trek from level 10k to 240k which took about 2 weeks and a half had only one leaf with unsharded additional gem leaf(amethyst). All leaves had combo too.
Amethyst after all that time and including the crap ton of time I had already done prior to the climb only ended up short of 3e16.

So to get that 8e16 in a relatively reasonable time, I currently have 2 leaves with 1 shard in combo and 9 shard on the additional gem leaves. Other leaves with unsharded combo. Also +leaf scroll.
With that, I estimate the time for 8e16 to be about 12 to 16 hours. As you can see, there's plenty of room for improvement there. No idea if 1combo/9+gem is the most efficient shard distribution or not.
That is also with plenty of +tower floors since you want to do this with bosses dropping as much gem leaves as possible.

[Silberfuchs]

A higher combo won't be of any use for that.

The game doesn't make any use of our combo modifiers and "enemy resource modifier" if the flat "+additional X leaves" property would result in a bigger reward.

It's one or the other, but those properties don't stack.

A sharded "additional gem leaf" property provides far more leaves than the regular combo based rewards.

Oh, get meeds first and max out your mulch shop with them.
Otherwise the mulch shop upgrades will reset your gem seeds down to zero (unless you keep a store of enough gem leaves to re-purchase them).

Btw:
The tower floor isn't THAT important for gem leaves. I believe they cap out around floor 2000 (might have been 3000 or 4000, i'm not 100% sure^^).

[frerouche]

Oh wow, you're right. Tried it once my emerald got 8e16 by rolling one of the two leaves to have combo and sharding combo did nothing.
Quite a downer.

And meeds was the first new seed I got exactly because of the upgrade that reset seeds.
Edit: also, buying multiple level of that upgrade at once is advised as it will only reset once for that one purchase unlike it resetting it for every individual level bought

[Daunmi]

Should the original post be modified to mention Fisho after the bonus to slap damage was added? It's not a lot, but at least it's noticeable (at the e36 damage range).

[SpicyOtter]

Daunmi původně napsal:

Should the original post be modified to mention Fisho after the bonus to slap damage was added? It's not a lot, but at least it's noticeable (at the e36 damage range).

Unfortunately the damage is additive with the trout tool slap damage. With all three trout at level 50, that increase in damage is <1%, and it only gets more and more insignificant. I don't recommend fisho, but I added it to the footnotes.

[SpicyOtter]

Updated my floor 100 damage suggestions. Key changes regarding this update:

1. Fisho still isn't worth using sadly.... The bonus slap damage is additive with all other effects that boost slap damage.
2. 100/100 other tools (non-trouts) is now slightly less relevant. Still an ok way to get damage, however I don't recommend it.
3. Added equipment upgrades, which gives the same damage boost as unique leaves.
4. Damage requirement for floor 100 seems to have increased?

[BreadButterLight]

This is such an in depth guide! Thank you for making it.

[guniu]

timmytimtim původně napsal:

• 100,000,000 (1e8) curses

How do you farm that? What's the best way?

[Silberfuchs]

guniu původně napsal:

timmytimtim původně napsal:

• 100,000,000 (1e8) curses

How do farm that? What's the best way?

Crafted ancient leaves with the "Witch Curse Multiplier" property, the more shards you can afford to put into it, the better.

Obviously those crafted leaves are used to farm the Witch, aka the best source of curses.

[Daunmi]

Thought of a question about the shard setup for the leaves: wouldn't it be better to spread the shards out more evenly over the various damage stats, or just focus entirely on one?

Your first shard gives +400% bonus, and it goes down with each shard applied. So if you wanted to get the most out of all three stats, wouldn't putting 3/3/4 on each leaf be better for that because you're getting more larger bonuses?

And wouldn't it just be better in general to max out slap damage? I thought slapping dealt more damage (or it looks that way to me).

...of course, I could just be missing something.

[Eprico]

Daunmi původně napsal:

Thought of a question about the shard setup for the leaves: wouldn't it be better to spread the shards out more evenly over the various damage stats, or just focus entirely on one?

Your first shard gives +400% bonus, and it goes down with each shard applied. So if you wanted to get the most out of all three stats, wouldn't putting 3/3/4 on each leaf be better for that because you're getting more larger bonuses?

And wouldn't it just be better in general to max out slap damage? I thought slapping dealt more damage (or it looks that way to me).

...of course, I could just be missing something.

I don't know why, but no

[Silberfuchs]

Daunmi původně napsal:

Thought of a question about the shard setup for the leaves: wouldn't it be better to spread the shards out more evenly over the various damage stats, or just focus entirely on one?

Your first shard gives +400% bonus, and it goes down with each shard applied. So if you wanted to get the most out of all three stats, wouldn't putting 3/3/4 on each leaf be better for that because you're getting more larger bonuses?

And wouldn't it just be better in general to max out slap damage? I thought slapping dealt more damage (or it looks that way to me).

...of course, I could just be missing something.

Slap damage is always based on blowing damage.
Hence two types of damage setups make sense: a set half and half of "+blower damage" and "+blower damage %" (to maximise damage without slapping), and a set that divides 1/3 of the shards to +slap damage modifier (=> max slap damage).

The first type of set isn't as important anymore, because 2.9 introduced auto-slapping. Hence a blower damage focused set only comes in handy in case a player needs a bit more damage but doesn't want to equip a trout.

Oh, and the first shard provides the same bonus all other shards provide: +300%, not +400%. Fully sharded a property provides 31 times of it's starting value, meaning each shard adds 300%, and you obviously already start with "100 %".

In short it doesn't matter in what order properties are sharded, what matters in the total amount of properties (aka basic 100% values, those without shards) and the total amount of shards invested.

A player that is short on shards can benefit from this, by putting in 2-3 random shards (cheaper than targeted sharding) and then adding 7-8 targeted shards. This makes sense for damage leaves, because hitting 3 random shards on a leaf with 3 desirable properties (blower, blower % and +slap) is pretty easy with a bit of shard rerolling. This way a 10/10 damage leaf only takes 52 instead of 70 shards.

[Daunmi]

Silberfuchs původně napsal:

Oh, and the first shard provides the same bonus all other shards provide: +300%, not +400%. Fully sharded a property provides 31 times of it's starting value, meaning each shard adds 300%, and you obviously already start with "100 %".

When I put shards in, the first one tells me it has increased the stat by 400%. The second one says 175%, and it keeps going down. So I thought it might be better to put a shard in each of the three damage bonuses on each leaf so they're all getting at least +400% and the stat you want to put the most shards in gets 8 of them.

So they don't seem to provide the same bonus at all, and I'm not sure what you're trying to tell me.

Is it that 100% (base stat) + 400% (single shard) makes the 175% second shard increase by as much as the first 400% ? So, 100+(100*4)=500, then 500+(500*1.75)=1375?

(I'm not great at thinking out math problems, so if I'm just completely wrong please let me know. Also, I've got no idea how all the stats get applied to each other in the first place)

[Silberfuchs]

Forget about what the game says about +%, just look at the properties on the leaf.

If you start out with lets say "+100 blower damage" and put a shard into it it will turn into "+400 blower damage", and with 10 shards in it will say "+3100 blower damage".

A bit of rounding happens behind the scenes, but the example above works pretty good.

Scaled up to a full damage set this looks a bit like this:
24 basic damage properties (8x blower damage, 8x blower damage %, and 8x slap multiplier) as a base value without any shards.
Then we add 8x 10 shards into the mix and end up with 3*10*8 = 240 additional "levels" of properties. Added together this results in 264 "levels".

This APPEARS more impressive in sets that only care about a single property, in that case the 24 would turn into a 8, and the final value of a sharded vs unsharded set would be 248 vs 8 (aka 31 times of what you started out with)

*:
"1" equals the +whatever a single property provides without shards.
"3" stand for the % gain each shard provides per upgrade.
"8" for the number of leaves in a set.
"10" because each leaf can take 10 shards.
The "24" because even unsharded each and every property is of some value.