How repetitive is this game?

[the]

I want to make waifu and explore

[<( '.' )>]

Hmm, as repetitive as Elden Ring, Sekiro and Dark Souls (though less sight-seeing spots, but more stray cats) XD
But, yeah there's the optional post 1st play-through end-game that's immense if you're into it, considering the well-designed level and loot system of this game, it kinda transforms into Lost Ark (in a good way, before they botched it). Other then that, they're some re-used optional missions from main game, though modified and are made shorter and focus on fighting.

[Senki]

extremely repetitive

still fun though

[Nami]

Originally posted by Senki:

extremely repetitive

still fun though

Originally posted by seir_:

Let me put it like this:
The repetitiveness within the first playthrough is fine.
100%-ing this game on the other hand is much less fun compared to any FromSoft game.

Do i have to go to the same areas again and again like on Nioh 1? or is it an open world?

[<( '.' )>]

Originally posted by seir_:

Originally posted by Nami:

Do i have to go to the same areas again and again like on Nioh 1? or is it an open world?

I haven't played Nioh 1, but I assume it is very similar.
This game is mission based. But within a mission you can roam around freely. Though it's often relatively linear.
And yes, you'll replay the same missions and bosses over and over.

The true strength of this game is the combat system, which I can't deny is top tier.

Huh? "And yes, you'll replay the same missions and bosses over and over.", only if you want to "farm", never replayed any of the missions other then when helping others in randoms/expeditions. It's not a necessity. And finished the base game.
The sub-missions (optional), some of them, recycle parts of the main-mission level to make a straight-forward and short co-op mission (with occasional 1vs1 arenas).

Think people who say it's repetitive are compulsively self-induced farming/grinding the levels like it's a MMORPG and complain that it's too repetitive. Yeah the level aesthetics are kinda bland, though have variation, the layout of the logistics are all very different and intricate if you're not speed-running through or mass-push in co-op.


And technically every game is repetitive, it's a subjective feeling of progress and variation (video game is an art form after all), including our lives too.
What I think this game manages to do well is to satisfy multiple reasons to like it.
The Truth is in the Eye of the Beholder, after all.
For that the teams that worked on this game are all geniuses.

[<( '.' )>]

Originally posted by seir_:

Originally posted by Sir Diealot:

Huh? "And yes, you'll replay the same missions and bosses over and over.", only if you want to "farm", never replayed any of the missions other then when helping others in randoms/expeditions. It's not a necessity. And finished the base game.
The sub-missions (optional), some of them, recycle parts of the main-mission level to make a straight-forward and short co-op mission (with occasional 1vs1 arenas).

Think people who say it's repetitive are compulsively self-induced farming/grinding the levels like it's a MMORPG and complain that it's too repetitive. Yeah the level aesthetics are kinda bland, though have variation, the layout of the logistics are all very different and intricate if you're not speed-running through or mass-push in co-op.


And technically every game is repetitive, it's a subjective feeling of progress and variation (video game is an art form after all), including our lives too.
What I think this game manages to do well is to satisfy multiple reasons to like it.
The Truth is in the Eye of the Beholder, after all.
For that the teams that worked on this game are all geniuses.

I overall agree with you. But while sub- and twllight-missions are indeed optional, I feel like most players will want to complete some of them. And bosses are frequently reused, even when you're only playing main missions.

Yeah these twilight missions and the subs feel like really were put there for co-op parties (personally never tried soloing them, kinda boring), mindless fun with strangers/friends to get some Amirata(EXP) and some loot, big contrast from main missions (solo IMO). Definitely helps to do them to have a boost for the next region, but can simply done once in any-case. I've skipped some of them and came back later without missing much on main-story campaign.
As for previous bosses come-back, it's kinda well placed and doesn't feel "wrong" in this one, I know a lot of other game use that and it feels super cheap, like their budget ran out or something. And considering the scale and effort put into this game, can hardly bash the dev. team for it. XD

Spoiler Alert ! ->
Oh, the only main mission level that was annoying is that Tokichiro's Mansion/Castle with like paintings on the wall... Fight all the previous-bosses in one mission, Damn. Thanks Team Ninja for allowing Co-op on this one

[Mike]

All depends. You can stop after the first playthrough and have a good time but the GAME really starts in the NG+ cycles where you actually start building your character, unlocking higher tiers of loot and facing harder and harder challenges.

The game at the end of the the day is a loot action RPG, where you will be getting ALOT of loot and making fun build round your weapon skills and the loot. So, naturally there is a lot of repetition on levels, boss fights, looting,...etc

Early game you can play it like a normal RPG, bt after the first playthrough you will be replaying missions, grinding loot, going through the endgame depths,...etc.

My opinion is to DROP the "souls-like" label and to look at the game like a 3rd person diablo game mixed with the combat depth of a 3D Ninja Gaiden game. If you look at Nioh 2 this way your expectations will be in check. Otherwise you will expect a souls game when it has very little in common with those types of games. I;ve have seen MANY forum posts of souls players trashing on the game because its not "soulsy" enough and the reason is because IT NOT A SOULS GAME, its a action RPG looter hack and slash.

[<( '.' )>]

Originally posted by Mike:

All depends. You can stop after the first playthrough and have a good time but the GAME really starts in the NG+ cycles where you actually start building your character, unlocking higher tiers of loot and facing harder and harder challenges.

The game at the end of the the day is a loot action RPG, where you will be getting ALOT of loot and making fun build round your weapon skills and the loot. So, naturally there is a lot of repetition on levels, boss fights, looting,...etc

Early game you can play it like a normal RPG, bt after the first playthrough you will be replaying missions, grinding loot, going through the endgame depths,...etc.

My opinion is to DROP the "souls-like" label and to look at the game like a 3rd person diablo game mixed with the combat depth of a 3D Ninja Gaiden game. If you look at Nioh 2 this way your expectations will be in check. Otherwise you will expect a souls game when it has very little in common with those types of games. I;ve have seen MANY forum posts of souls players trashing on the game because its not "soulsy" enough and the reason is because IT NOT A SOULS GAME, its a action RPG looter hack and slash.

Yeah excellent summary, though for the sake of new players wondering about the game, the NG+ etc. game shouldn't represent the base game, originally NG+ was meant for returning players etc, like finished the game and after a couple of years come-back to it with the same character and replay the missions with alternate enemies etc. (like all the other games)
Saying something like base game is just a "tutorial" etc... misleading. And more of a self-glorifying power-mongering empowerment due "making it to NG+" etc., XD

Regarding souls-like, the level design philosophy and the solo experience of dying from 2-3 hits in most frustrating ways kinda represents well the genre and I think it just needs a mix term, like Lost-Ark Soulslike haha. Like the term Metroidvania, applied to all plarformers...

One of the reasons I stayed far away from Nioh 2 is due that stigma-stereotype of being a grindy looter RPG, how wrong is that in the base-game, eh. Now, having played it, it's so wrong description.
(The end game was kinda added with DLCs more or less too, heard lots of changes were made to make it easier to get decent equipment too)
Just my opinion, as always.

Aaand....
"And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you." -Nietzsche
(Abyss pun. joke)

[Mike]

Originally posted by Sir Diealot:

Originally posted by Mike:

All depends. You can stop after the first playthrough and have a good time but the GAME really starts in the NG+ cycles where you actually start building your character, unlocking higher tiers of loot and facing harder and harder challenges.

The game at the end of the the day is a loot action RPG, where you will be getting ALOT of loot and making fun build round your weapon skills and the loot. So, naturally there is a lot of repetition on levels, boss fights, looting,...etc

Early game you can play it like a normal RPG, bt after the first playthrough you will be replaying missions, grinding loot, going through the endgame depths,...etc.

My opinion is to DROP the "souls-like" label and to look at the game like a 3rd person diablo game mixed with the combat depth of a 3D Ninja Gaiden game. If you look at Nioh 2 this way your expectations will be in check. Otherwise you will expect a souls game when it has very little in common with those types of games. I;ve have seen MANY forum posts of souls players trashing on the game because its not "soulsy" enough and the reason is because IT NOT A SOULS GAME, its a action RPG looter hack and slash.

Yeah excellent summary, though for the sake of new players wondering about the game, the NG+ etc. game shouldn't represent the base game, originally NG+ was meant for returning players etc, like finished the game and after a couple of years come-back to it with the same character and replay the missions with alternate enemies etc. (like all the other games)
Saying something like base game is just a "tutorial" etc... misleading. And more of a self-glorifying power-mongering empowerment due "making it to NG+" etc., XD

Regarding souls-like, the level design philosophy and the solo experience of dying from 2-3 hits in most frustrating ways kinda represents well the genre and I think it just needs a mix term, like Lost-Ark Soulslike haha.

One of the reasons I stayed far away from Nioh 2 is due that stigma-stereotype of being a grindy looter RPG, how wrong is that in the base-game, eh. Now, having played it, it's so wrong description.
(The end game was kinda added with DLCs more or less too, from what I heard)
Just my opinion, as always.

I see your point, but most players who adore Nioh 2 do so because of the loot, endgame, combat depth, build diversity,...etc and NONE of that is really experienced in the first playthrough. There is NO other game that combines genres like Nioh 2 does. Nioh 2 has combat depth out of this world, its has endgame and looting that competes with the best of them, and it has that challenging skill based combat.

I would also argue that the NG+ cycles are 100% part of the core game experience because it released with all of the content on PC, and the loot/gear is a BIG part of the experience which only gets better the deeper you go.

The reason I say people need to not look at the game as a souls-like is because many complaints from some people is that the game it too grindy after the initial playthrough and the only reason they say that is because they wanted a sous-like when then game is closer to a diablo game in essence.

People can play the game however they want but imo if you ignore the NG+ cycles your literally ignoring 50% or more of the overall experience.

I use to look at Nioh/Nioh 2 like a souls-like as well and it never clicked with me and then I looked at it as if it was a 3rd person diablo hack and slash with deep combat systems and all of a sudden the game ends up as one my favorites of all time (the same goes for other Team Ninja games like Strangers of Paradise and Wo Long). Expectations are everything and if you come in expecting one thing and its something else, you won't end up appreciating the amount of content and work the devs put into the game, thats the point I;m trying to get across.

[<( '.' )>]

Originally posted by Mike:

Originally posted by Sir Diealot:

Yeah excellent summary, though for the sake of new players wondering about the game, the NG+ etc. game shouldn't represent the base game, originally NG+ was meant for returning players etc, like finished the game and after a couple of years come-back to it with the same character and replay the missions with alternate enemies etc. (like all the other games)
Saying something like base game is just a "tutorial" etc... misleading. And more of a self-glorifying power-mongering empowerment due "making it to NG+" etc., XD

Regarding souls-like, the level design philosophy and the solo experience of dying from 2-3 hits in most frustrating ways kinda represents well the genre and I think it just needs a mix term, like Lost-Ark Soulslike haha.

One of the reasons I stayed far away from Nioh 2 is due that stigma-stereotype of being a grindy looter RPG, how wrong is that in the base-game, eh. Now, having played it, it's so wrong description.
(The end game was kinda added with DLCs more or less too, from what I heard)
Just my opinion, as always.

I see your point, but most players who adore Nioh 2 do so because of the loot, endgame, combat depth, build diversity,...etc and NONE of that is really experienced in the first playthrough. There is NO other game that combines genres like Nioh 2 does. Nioh 2 has combat depth out of this world, its has endgame and looting that competes with the best of them, and it has that challenging skill based combat.

I would also argue that the NG+ cycles are 100% part of the core game experience because it released with all of the content on PC, and the loot/gear is a BIG part of the experience which only gets better the deeper you go.

The reason I say people need to not look at the game as a souls-like is because many complaints from some people is that the game it too grindy after the initial playthrough and the only reason they say that is because they wanted a sous-like when then game is closer to a diablo game in essence.

People can play the game however they want but imo if you ignore the NG+ cycles your literally ignoring 50% or more of the overall experience.

I use to look at Nioh/Nioh 2 like a souls-like as well and it never clicked with me and then I looked at it as if it was a 3rd person diablo hack and slash with deep combat systems and all of a sudden the game ends up as one my favorites of all time (the same goes for other Team Ninja games like Strangers of Paradise and Wo Long). Expectations are everything and if you come in expecting one thing and its something else, you won't end up appreciating the amount of content and work the devs put into the game, thats the point I;m trying to get across.

Precisely. Though the equipment and skill build is more crucial post-game (I mean you still need something that makes sense, but you get all the drops without too much thought), hence on the 1st play-through it is essentially a souls-like, with equipment drops that is there to kinda prepare and get new players 'used' to what is coming (learn to filter drops etc, how soul-cores work, even crafting is kinda, eh without all the texts) (example; I mean 15% damage boost on 750 attack, vs 45% on a 1500+ is a big difference).
Again, my focus is more on potential newcomers to Nioh 2, and that most will probably be content with finishing the story-line and have good vibes finishing it without the crazy-grind (yeah it has a story, I kinda liked it too, Oscar to Tokichiro for the final line).
And I'm hopping on another game once I'm done with the final DLC, though will be here for expeditions and randoms for some time. But will surely boot it up in a couple of years, and will definitely be happy with the NG+ and it's loot system and the complex level stats, and kinda see why it is there. Cause they knew some people love this game.

PS; I did it just to find all the lost Kodamas lol

[Mike]

Originally posted by Sir Diealot:

Precisely. Though the equipment and skill build is more crucial post-game (I mean you still need something that makes sense, but you get all the drops without too much thought), hence on the 1st play-through it is essentially a souls-like, with equipment drops that is there to kinda prepare and get new players 'used' to what is coming (learn to filter drops etc, how soul-cores work) (example; I mean 15% damage boost on 750 attack, vs 45% on a 1500+ is a big difference).
Again, my focus is more on potential newcomers to Nioh 2, and that most will probably be content with finishing the story-line and have good vibes finishing it without the crazy-grind (yeah it has a story, I kinda liked it too, Oscar to Tokichiro for the final line).
And I'm hopping on another game once I'm done with the final DLC, though will be here for expeditions and randoms for some time. But will surely boot it up in a couple of years, and will definitely be happy with the NG+ and it's loot system and the complex level stats, and kinda see why it is there. Cause they knew some people love this game.
:sunekosuri::praisesun:
PS; I did it just to find all the lost Kodemas lol

I get your point, its just many people would come in expecting a souls-like game on the first playthrough and then when they see looter RPG grinding aspects they do a complete 180 on the game and say that it should not have those aspects. close to and after launch there was many forums of people complaining that the loot aspects should have been removed and the game should have been a pure souls-like and my argument is the game is NOT a souls-like and their wrong expectations was what lead them to that way of thinking.

If a person sees the FULL picture of a game they will know what to expect besides only having a limited view of it and being letdown/disappointed when they see the other aspects that may not be to their liking.

I agree the first playthrough is mainly skill based and loot is not important (just equip the best gear), but that does not mean the game should be "sold" to people as just that snipet of content. Once that person beats the game and realizes the endgame cycles are repetitive (but fun imo) RPG grinding they will get a sour taste in their mouth because its not really a "souls-like".

I'm for just saying what the FULL game really is about and not just the first playthrough. Many souls-like players will enjoy the first playthrough but they will despise the rest if they are still expecting a souls-like as the game is not really that imo. That is mainly why I am so against the "souls-like" label for most Team Ninja games.

[Mike]

Originally posted by Sir Diealot:

Originally posted by Mike:

I get your point, its just many people would come in expecting a souls-like game on the first playthrough and then when they see looter RPG grinding aspects they do a complete 180 on the game and say that it should not have those aspects. close to and after launch there was many forums of people complaining that the loot aspects should have been removed and the game should have been a pure souls-like and my argument is the game is NOT a souls-like and their wrong expectations was what lead them to that way of thinking.

If a person sees the FULL picture of a game they will know what to expect besides only having a limited view of it and being letdown/disappointed when they see the other aspects that may not be to their liking.

I agree the first playthrough is mainly skill based and loot is not important (just equip the best gear), but that does not mean the game should be "sold" to people as just that snipet of content. Once that person beats the game and realizes the endgame cycles are repetitive (but fun imo) RPG grinding they will get a sour taste in their mouth because its not really a "souls-like".

I'm for just saying what the FULL game really is about and not just the first playthrough. Many souls-like players will enjoy the first playthrough but they will despise the rest if they are still expecting a souls-like as the game is not really that imo. That is mainly why I am so against the "souls-like" label for most Team Ninja games.

So, souls-like with looting, a "Souls-Looter", or "Soul-Looter" lol
:sudama:

Ehh kind of.... lol
- Nioh has fast paced complex combat (stances, cancels, combos,..etc), Souls has very slow methodical combat that focuses more on single hits.
- Nioh is missions based with very little exploration, Souls games are usually semi-open world with focus on exploration.
- Nioh has Diablo style RNG loot drops with random stats, loot tiers...etc, Souls has set item drops with no RNG stats.
- Nioh has skill trees per weapon type to customize your moveset per weapon, Souls just has a specific movesets depending on the weapon you have.
- Nioh has a stamina system that applies to both players and enemies alike, Souls stamina system is only limited the player.
- Nioh has an endgame loop similar to diablo games (rerunning missions, depths,...etc for better loot), Souls has NG+ cycles that just give enemies more health with very little additional unique challenges.

I could go on and on about the major differences that Nioh 2 has in comparison to Souls games. Yeah obviously there is a handful of features pulled from souls games like bloodstains, and losing leveling currency on death, but overall both are so difference its a disservice to directly compare the 2 imo.

Both are great but the audience/playerbase has less overlap then people think.

[toughnails]

Originally posted by cool man dam:

I want to make waifu and explore

There's nothing to explore. All loot is RNG and everywhere looks the same.

[D. Flame]

Game is not for you. It is all about loot hunting and grinding. You will be replaying the same levels repeatedly to get the best gear.

[Anzuvere]

The game expects you to re-play through it several times, the same missions with some minor changes, harder enemy placements and better loot tiers. But very little changes after your first playthrough. Honestly though it's worth playing through once and experiencing the three DLC. The story is very good, especially if you like your Japanese history - fun to see their take on it.