20 vs 12 gauge differences?

[ravensview]

I realize there are IRL differences, does it matter in the game? Has anyone measured this, like wider/narrow spread, better change of killing?

[Lord Haart]

12 Gauge: The bore diameter of a 12-gauge shotgun is larger than that of a 20-gauge shotgun. The exact diameter can vary slightly, but it is generally around 0.729 inches (18.5 mm).
20 Gauge: The bore diameter of a 20-gauge shotgun is smaller than that of a 12-gauge. It is typically around 0.615 inches (15.6 mm).

I'm a farmer's son and have regularly shot both.

The 12 Gauge or "12-Bore" as we call it in England is a larger, more powerful gun.

And boy does it blow you back more.

[ravensview]

Yes, those are the real world differences, I'm aware of them, I've hunted in my younger days.
Thanks, but my question was whether it makes a difference in the game,

[Lord Haart]

Well the 12-bore will have more power and spread and be marginally better in the air in the hands of the right person. The smaller gun is generally more precise

[ravensview]

But not in the game - all the shotguns are modeled the same by the software for identical range, shot spread, and shot damage.
I'm spoiled by some of the details in Call of the Wild, such as gun ratings for Accuracy, and ammo for Range, Penetration, and Expansion

[Pete Gaimari]

Originally posted by ravensview:

But not in the game - all the shotguns are modeled the same by the software for identical range, shot spread, and shot damage.
I'm spoiled by some of the details in Call of the Wild, such as gun ratings for Accuracy, and ammo for Range, Penetration, and Expansion

How do you know this?

It's hard to believe the devs aren't aware of the different powers of each gauge and made them all the same.

[Lord Haart]

They are different, OldMM is right. The spread for a start. Also, the fired shot's resistance to wind.

[Alf Tupper]

Originally posted by ravensview:

I realize there are IRL differences, does it matter in the game? Has anyone measured this, like wider/narrow spread, better change of killing?

I am not sure as as far as I know we don't have a firing range with paper to measure spread, is there any way to achieve this in the game, eg shoot a wall or something? I know from having shot animals with it, you do see some visual indication of pellet spread and penetrations - is there any data there that could guide us as to differences?

I.m off to see what I can find out

SPEED EDIT - just firing into a wall you get holes to indicate the pattern spread. Be right back!!

[Alf Tupper]

https://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198023164239/screenshot/2256927864515886538/

and two more screenshots posted if you're bored....

I am not seeing differences at 25 metres between any of the available shotguns in terms of pattern or spread. I did a couple of comparisons at 50 metres and 75 metres, nothing jumped out at me as noteably different.

I am not a shotgun expert but it may be worth saying that many things in a shotgun can affect shot patterns eg choke being the main factor so in theory there is no reason why 12 bore, 16 bore and 20 bore should produce the same spread at the same range.

However - I am assuming we are shooting birdshot - there are not a lot of holes to be seen!

I have killed a Moose trapped under a hunting tower with birdshot in this game, I am just trying to remember how the game represents shot hitting the target - birds and hares - to see if it gives any data on energy delivered and if this is informative. Any ideas anyone?

[ravensview]

Alf Tupper - great idea, thanks. I know what the spread should be IRL, and I know what it SHOULD be if the devs mirrored that in-game, but I had my doubts as to what it was actually like in game.
So all are the same - at least for now. Maybe a future release will tweak it.
BTW - I like that in COTW for shotguns, choices are birdshot, buckshot, and slug.

[Alf Tupper]

Originally posted by ravensview:

Alf Tupper - great idea, thanks. I know what the spread should be IRL, and I know what it SHOULD be if the devs mirrored that in-game, but I had my doubts as to what it was actually like in game.
So all are the same - at least for now. Maybe a future release will tweak it.
BTW - I like that in COTW for shotguns, choices are birdshot, buckshot, and slug.

No problem. The patterns do open up at longer ranges, but the different calibres don't seem to open up more or less than each other.

I can't say anything about the power at this time, but did feel when doing missions that the 16 and 20 don't have the hitting power of the 12, that's all I can honestly say.

[Lord Haart]

Pal the intricacies of shotgun mechanics in a virtual hunting environment can be as challenging as the real thing, and your observations on the uniform spread among different calibers in the game are intriguing. While mirroring real-world ballistic performance in virtual simulations is a complex task, the developers' decision to standardize the spread for all calibers in the current release offers a level playing field for hunters. It's refreshing to hear that theHunter: Call of the Wild incorporates realism in its shotgun choices, allowing players to opt for birdshot, buckshot, or slug depending on the situation. However, your insight into the potential discrepancy in hitting power between the 12, 16, and 20 gauges raises questions about the nuanced representation of firearm power in the game. As we eagerly await future releases, it remains to be seen whether the developers will refine the in-game experience to accurately reflect the distinct characteristics of each shotgun caliber, adding a layer of authenticity that discerning hunters can appreciate.

[Alf Tupper]

Originally posted by Lord Haart:

Pal the intricacies of shotgun mechanics in a virtual hunting environment can be as challenging as the real thing...

Indeed. I can only add that what I was seeing on the wall hits was a graphic effect, and may not at all represent how the shot interacts with an animal target; I think that's only fair to the devs to say that.

Until I find some evidence about how shot patterns hit animals and what the shot does to them, I'm sitting firmly on that fence!

EDIT - I am out hunting poor Honey Badgers with shotguns in the name of science... check out the screenshots I am uploading, see what you think yourselves about power and spread.

[Alf Tupper]

I'm not sure if the spread or number of pellets changes between shotguns but looking at a few bullet cam screen shots...

The 12 bore seems to consistently do more damage with a good hit than the 20 bore

All the Honey Badgers took multiple hits to kill, it was often a close range final shot that finished them off, and the 12 bore seemed to do the job quicker and better.

Just my opinion on a small amount of evidence, but I think the power thing is fine.

Maybe repeat this experiment yourselves, see what you come up with? Maybe try and measure the spread and penetration on the bullet cam if it's something you have the patience to do? NB - I forgot to taxidermy three of them to use the bullet cam repeatedly... whoops!

[Lord Haart]

I was about 14 when I first fired a shotgun and in that instant I thought 'I am so glad I'm not the other end of that. It's a bomb going off. Sudden recoil aftershock. That aural blast.

You never understand just how dangerous those things are until you have fired one.

[ravensview]

Interesting results, thx all. Once I can afford two shotguns, I'll try myself to see how much difference I find between the 12 and 20 gauge for damage. Would be interesting to see how the devs tweak the shotguns - if they do. Maybe more damage from a 12 but add more recoil, so it's harder to get off two shots.
I had a 20 g double barrel in my younger days, even that was plenty loud.