.243 on Mule Deer

[Taki1980]

I like alot about this game. Everything the other one on the market is doing wrong, this one is doing it good.

In cotw i didnt like the renderdistance. Its better here. Now i can see them in >300m.

Thats fine.

But what i dont like is the magnifikation of the Scope and the effect on target of a .243 bullet.

I hit around 12x female mule deer on the broadside somewhere close to lungshot. Even on 300m this should be enough to penetrate and hit vitals but i only get small blood loss and cant find them. Sometimes i maybe hit a rib, thats fine to me. But the bulletspecs seem to be a bit weak on distances greater than 150 -200m

[Taki1980]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z_RG2se-JO0

Even with 80Grains and +200m this buck dropped almost instantly with bullet exit left shoulder.

[Taki1980]

Made an Ingame Shot on 65m with .243
Double Lung shot and bullet exit on the other side of the thorax.

The Whitetail Buck with 77kg was running for 98m until he dropped. Maybe thats a bit too much?

And another example:
Whitetail female. Double Lung Shot on 203m, bullet exits other side but ran 195m till it dropped.

[[SOT]Avongunn]

300m is a bit far for that round. I think the joules is about 1200 at that range(without loading the game up again ) Mule Deer need nearly 1400+ for sure kill shots I believe

[Taki1980]

I can live with not that accurate or much dmg on that Round on 300m, but even on 200m and double lung shots the Deer run way to far.

Penetration Power seems to be accuarte. But Hitting Circle and Damage inside the body seems to be a bit off. I have heard that the other .243 Rifle that you can buy seems to be more accurate.

[Taki1980]

I thought: Okay, than take the .300 Win Mag to solve the Problem. But even on 200m its got to high Joule for whitetail and Muledeer.

.308 seems to be optimal. But to expensive atm

[Sharp]

caliber balistic rates are joke on this game, they are real on values but nothing works based on thoose values when you actually shooting at the animals..you can hit a hog with 338 lapua and penetrate it's both longs and it can still travel 48 hours..

243. has more stopping power than 7mm cartridge in this game, even newbie hunters knows that caliber is much more higher power than 243. I mentioned that 20 times in discussion boards and discord channel they still didn't fix it yet.
Also never went away hunting pressure and ghost zones aperead after first update and they still didn't fix that yet.

Scopes are not working, 7x or 18 x scope does not give you any more accurate shot placement option, rather than nice visuals.
its an arcade game which looks like a simulation but it is not.
I hope ultimate hunting gonna adress proper simulation as they promised.

[Geronimo]

Have to somewhat agree with Power Core regarding ballistics.

There's not alot of options with regard to weapons, and what is available is certainly out of synch with reality.

The 300 and the 7mm are both underpowered IMHO. But the 7mm should definitely be a more powerful step up from the 243, just as it is in CoTW, and real life.

I hope that some of these indescrepancies I'm seeing in ballistics and other areas aren't an attempt by the Dev to try to avoid being labeled as a clone. Because there are some things that are going to be 'universal absolutes' that can't be ignored for the sake of competition.

You can't create a hunting sim without having a weapon. Every game will have some type of weapon. It sounds ridiculous to have to even point out, but I know that competition is a huge dynamic in Development, and the creators need to make sure they don't throw the baby out with the bath water.

IMO, the 7mm should be almost, but not quite, at the present power of the 300, and the 300 should be a bit more powerful than it now is.

The 300 advantage should be in maintaining hitting power at a longer range, which also means much more confident dropping power at ranges less than 175 yards.

At 175 yards, a clear shot broadside should be a certain double lung with enough shock to drop the animal, even if it does still manage to get up and run a short distance before running out of breath and blood.

What's the purpose of having the top tier weapon lack the power to do what's necessary to take down big game?

These Devs seem to think that the weapon table is just a matter of creating a step factor of progression, without actual consideration of real ballistics.

They present is with the 30/30, as the starting rifle, which is actually traditionally known as THE classical weapon for hunting whitetail in heavy cover at close range. Because it has the power needed to drop an animal of that size.

I don't think the Devs realize this.

Than they present the 243 as the step up from the 30/30, which it isn't.

The next step the Devs present is the 7mm, which should be a considerable step up, but they didn't program in the appropriate power difference.

[kubanskiloewe]

i have no problems with my rifles; 7mm and 308 i dont have anyway.
30-30; Steyr 0.243 and Steyr 300Mag does all jobs well enough. yeah sometimes on a 5star the 0.243 is a bit weak....its ok; use the 308 instead.

and the 0.243 is definately a step up to the 30-30.

[Taki1980]

I like the penetration performances. They are okay. But the maginification of a x14 scope is to weak and the distance they go after a double lung shot is waay of. no problem they run 200m or more after a bad placed shot.

[Roman 45]

Originally posted by Geronimo:

Have to somewhat agree with Power Core regarding ballistics.

The 300 and the 7mm are both underpowered IMHO. But the 7mm should definitely be a more powerful step up from the 243, just as it is in CoTW, and real life.

Im not a weapon expert but i heard/red that the 7mm in WOTH is not the same "level" as in COTW. It is a "7mm-08 Rem" in WOTH, while a "standard" 7mm in COTW. Correct me if i am wrong though....

[kubanskiloewe]

Ron on .243 vs 7mm-08 ;-)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nd7nZGOZvuY

[VictoriaHuntress]

Originally posted by Roman 45:

Originally posted by Geronimo:

Have to somewhat agree with Power Core regarding ballistics.

The 300 and the 7mm are both underpowered IMHO. But the 7mm should definitely be a more powerful step up from the 243, just as it is in CoTW, and real life.

Im not a weapon expert but i heard/red that the 7mm in WOTH is not the same "level" as in COTW. It is a "7mm-08 Rem" in WOTH, while a "standard" 7mm in COTW. Correct me if i am wrong though....

In COTW, the 7mm is a magnum cartridge/rifle, although we don't know if it is equivalent to the 7mm Remington Magnum or the 7mm Remington Ultra Magnum, or some other 28 caliber magnum type ( all 7mm bullets are actually 0.284" in diameter, and the rifle barrel's bore is 0.280" in diameter).

The 7mm Rem Mag cartridge is based on the 30-06 cartridge (necked down to take a 0.284" diameter bullet).

The 7mm-08 (and the 243 Winchester) are based on the 308 Winchester cartridge, and the 308 is basically a shorter version of the 30-06 cartridge.

But it is more than just the cartridge case size and bullet diameter.
Powder type? How much chemical potential energy per grain? Fast or slow burning?
Actual powder charge weight?
Bullet weight? (for a given caliber, you change this by changing the length of the bullet)
Bullet design and construction?
Maximum chamber pressure that the rifle action can sustain? The higher this value, the hotter the powder charge can be, yielding more muzzle KE
Rifle barrel length?
Rifle twist rate?

Since we don't have any of this information in the encyclopedia, we can only assume that the game designers consulted the manufacturers' specifications to perform the right calculations.

Like what you could find here:
https://www.federalpremium.com/reloading-data/

[Sharp]

They even don't know the difference of the 243 and 7mm
7mm known as hard hitter all around the word it's not a underlying screet,
(like 158 +p 38 special) all it takes little bir attention to the subject, which it doesn't exist.

Minute of angles are also higher at longer ranges,
300 wsm and 338, thoose can hit 3 moa groups from 1100 especially 338 in with the platforms such as steyr and sako.
But if am am not wrong 338 has the worst accuracy in the game, Reticles are also joke.
Designers never held a gun.
It looks like creating driving simulation while you do not even know how to drive car.

[-M*A*S*H-]

Originally posted by Power Core:

Reticles are also joke.
Designers never held a gun.
It looks like creating driving simulation while you do not even know how to drive car.

+1
https://media0.giphy.com/media/RavXJWRY3veEw/giphy.gif?cid=ecf05e47e37ksroyj8rf29wdbrishtwa9y7rh0dok5or7nua&rid=giphy.gif&ct=g

[VictoriaHuntress]

FYI this is what I found for the rifles and ammunition (from the manufacturers' web sites)
Assumptions:
1. the image of the ammunition box in the encyclopedia represents what the game is using.
2. ammunition test fired from 24" barrels - you'd have to make a small correction to the muzzle velocity for other barrel lengths
3. you can calculate the sectional densities (SD) yourselves
SD = weight(gr)
------------------------------
7000 gr/lb * diam(inches)^2

higher values usually indicate better penetration performance for the same bullet types.

Steyr Pro Hunter II: 7mm-08 Remington 20" barrel, 1:8.7" twist - Federal Power-Shok
150gr MV: 2650 FPS JSP BC: 0.408 ME: 2350ft-lbs(3186.17J)
https://www.federalpremium.com/rifle/power-shok/power-shok-rifle/11-708CS.html

Steyr Monobloc: 308 Winchester 22" barrel Remington Core-Lokt Tipped (may be softpoint)
150gr: 2820 FPS, BC: 0.314 ME: 2650ft-lbs(3592J) : https://www.remington.com/rifle/core-lokt/29-27842.html
180gr: 2620 FPS: BC: 0.383 ME: 2750ft-lbs(3728J) : https://www.remington.com/rifle/core-lokt/29-21479.html

Remington 783 243 Winchester: 22" barrel 1:9.125" twist Remington AccuTip?
could only find Core-Lokt: https://www.remington.com/rifle/core-lokt/29-R27802.html
Steyr Pro Hunter 243 Win: 23.6" barrel (1:10 twist, or maybe 1:12")
? 100 gr MV: 2960 BC: 0.356 ME: 1950ft-lbs(2643.84J)



Steyr SM12 300 Win Mag 25" barrel Federal Terminal Ascent 200gr
BC: 0.608(G1), 0.304(G7) MV: 2810 FPS, Muzzle KE (3500 ft-lbs, 4745.36J)
https://www.federalpremium.com/rifle/terminal-ascent/11-P300WTA1.html

Steyr Carbon CL II 338 Lapua Magnum 26" barrel Federal Premium Trophy 250gr
MV 2850 FPS, BC: 0.625, Polymer Tip, ME: 4500ft-lbs (6101.18J)
https://www.federalpremium.com/rifle/premium-centerfire-rifle/trophy-copper/11-P338LTC1.html

Except for the Lapua, the bullets seem to be soft-points, rather than polymer-tipped.

you can use the muzzle KE values to compare with the ballistics firing solution calculator used in the game.

I ran a quick check on the firing solution calculator
For the Lapua, at 5.9m, it gave an energy of 6101 Joules, which is consistent with the muzzle KE I estimated from the specs.

For the 308, the ME at 5.9m was 3556J,. which is consistent with the 150gr bullet esitmates, above