Community tracks

[BETONEIRAS]

I believe that a lot of people have already been irritated by the fact that it is not possible to play the community tracks without using multiplayer mode. I think it's a big mistake, as it takes a lot of the fun out of the game. Yes, I know it's possible to play them in time attack mode, but in this post I'm referring to normal racing mode.
Sometimes I want to play a private game to show a track to a friend, and I simply can't because there's no way to choose the track. Or sometimes even in local mode, wanting to test some tracks, see what the community produces, none of that is possible, you can only see them, but you can't play them, unless by pure luck it falls into the vote of multiplayer mode.
This also takes away a lot of the desire to produce new tracks, as you can't even play them yourself without using the track builder. And I also want other people to be able to play on my tracks whenever they want.
As I said, I know it's possible to play them in time attack mode, but it would be very interesting to also be able to play them in normal racing mode, even to be able to train with bots, or just play with friends.
(Sorry if I misspelled something or misinterpreted you, I'm still learning English :P)

[captaincofresi]

I play this game on the PS4 and I agree with you. It is dissapointing that (1) There are no other AI / bot cars available for Community tracks. (2) There are only two modes for Community tracks: Time Attack and Split Screen (with just two player cars als also no AI / bots).

Although I am not quite sure how this is for 'online multiplayer' , I think I did read it is more of the same. For me this is the reason I just stuck to creating just the one track for the game. And it is quite dissapointing for a game with so much potential, and even in Hotwheels Unleashed 2 it is the same all over again. Quite a huge miss by the development team, and skipped that one because of zero improvement on this matter ;-) . Going a bit off topic: In the end my creative focus in Hotwheels Unleashed was mainly on creating nice 'realistic' looking liveries, and I did have some fun with that.

[SecretAgentKiiN 特务健]

Originally posted by BETONEIRAS:

it is not possible to play the community tracks without using multiplayer mode. I think it's a big mistake play them in normal racing mode

Agree, but I won't call it "a mistake" because they want to encourage people to play online. In the past years, people often call games as "dead game", just because most people playing downloaded tracks in offline mode.

Unless we people have better solution for the problem: Dead game

Their Solution: Force everyone play online

[captaincofresi]

Originally posted by SecretAgentKiiN 特务健:

Originally posted by BETONEIRAS:

it is not possible to play the community tracks without using multiplayer mode. I think it's a big mistake play them in normal racing mode

Agree, but I won't call it "a mistake" because they want to encourage people to play online. In the past years, people often call games as "dead game", just because most people playing downloaded tracks in offline mode.

Unless we people have better solution for the problem: Dead game

Their Solution: Force everyone play online

Just curious about what 'online multiplayer' means here? As from these posts I have now read I think it is like this:
- Massive multiplayer online: Custom tracks available, without AI / bots on track.
- Multiplayer online - private with friends: Custom tracks NOT available.
- Offline multiplayer split screen: Custom tracks available, without AI / bots on track.

Correct me if I am wrong, As I am still wondering if for the PS4 an online subscription might be worth it for this game, but for me this would only be if I can play versus people I know, hence: private with friends multiplayer on Custom Tracks.

[Juke Nukem]

I think one of the primary reasons (if not THE reason) might be that AI racers wouldn't necessarily be able to navigate user created tracks. As long as it's a closed loop or a long connected section they could probably handle it, but I've seen some crazy - and I mean CRAZY - custom levels where even I had trouble finding my way (not implying I'm some sort of genius, but I do possess a normal human brain which - in general - is quite adept at problem solving and quickly adapting to previously unencountered situations - unlike a deterministic AI) and / or it involved some unusually tricky bits, like using your boost to fight gravity etc.

It's probably no accident that in Trackmania - another game famous for its (comparatively more simple) track editor - you could also only race against others or your ghost. If my memory serves well, in Stunts (a really old DOS game which was among the firsts to include a level editor) the AI could race on your tracks, but it only had like 2 dozen different basic elements that all took up the same amount of space on the building grid and they all had to connect with each other. (Even then, the computer controlled opponent was prone to crashing on them.)

[BETONEIRAS]

Originally posted by captaincofresi:

Originally posted by SecretAgentKiiN 特务健:

Agree, but I won't call it "a mistake" because they want to encourage people to play online. In the past years, people often call games as "dead game", just because most people playing downloaded tracks in offline mode.

Unless we people have better solution for the problem: Dead game

Their Solution: Force everyone play online

Just curious about what 'online multiplayer' means here? As from these posts I have now read I think it is like this:
- Massive multiplayer online: Custom tracks available, without AI / bots on track.
- Multiplayer online - private with friends: Custom tracks NOT available.
- Offline multiplayer split screen: Custom tracks available, without AI / bots on track.

Correct me if I am wrong, As I am still wondering if for the PS4 an online subscription might be worth it for this game, but for me this would only be if I can play versus people I know, hence: private with friends multiplayer on Custom Tracks.

I didn't actually know that you could play customized tracks in split-screen, I'd never stopped to see how this mode worked. But that's basically it, but in the private online multiplayer mode you can play community tracks, but only by voting for a track.
And if you have friends who can and also want to play, I think it's worth having the subscription. I particularly like playing with random people, but sometimes I can't find any matches. This falls a bit in line with the other fellow's comment about "dead games".
I don't know if it's just because Hot Wheels 2 has just been released or if people just got tired of the game, but it's been harder to find full matches, I usually only find 3-5 players, or none.

[BETONEIRAS]

Originally posted by Juke Nukem:

I think one of the primary reasons (if not THE reason) might be that AI racers wouldn't necessarily be able to navigate user created tracks. As long as it's a closed loop or a long connected section they could probably handle it, but I've seen some crazy - and I mean CRAZY - custom levels where even I had trouble finding my way (not implying I'm some sort of genius, but I do possess a normal human brain which - in general - is quite adept at problem solving and quickly adapting to previously unencountered situations - unlike a deterministic AI) and / or it involved some unusually tricky bits, like using your boost to fight gravity etc.

It's probably no accident that in Trackmania - another game famous for its (comparatively more simple) track editor - you could also only race against others or your ghost. If my memory serves well, in Stunts (a really old DOS game which was among the firsts to include a level editor) the AI could race on your tracks, but it only had like 2 dozen different basic elements that all took up the same amount of space on the building grid and they all had to connect with each other. (Even then, the computer controlled opponent was prone to crashing on them.)

In fact, there are many extremely CRAZY tracks, when I played some of them I felt like a complete amoeba. And I'm sure that playing these tracks with bots wouldn't go very well.
Honestly, thinking about it now, I don't know how it would be possible to add bots to these exotic tracks, if at all. Maybe do something like run with your own ghost, when you complete the track after creating it, the bots could read the path you took and try to replicate it, but I don't know if that would work anyway.
But I think it could be like it is in split-screen at least, but in private multiplayer, playing online with your friends and with bots, but on the game's own tracks

[captaincofresi]

Originally posted by Juke Nukem:

I think one of the primary reasons (if not THE reason) might be that AI racers wouldn't necessarily be able to navigate user created tracks. As long as it's a closed loop or a long connected section they could probably handle it, but I've seen some crazy - and I mean CRAZY - custom levels where even I had trouble finding my way (not implying I'm some sort of genius, but I do possess a normal human brain which - in general - is quite adept at problem solving and quickly adapting to previously unencountered situations - unlike a deterministic AI) and / or it involved some unusually tricky bits, like using your boost to fight gravity etc.

It's probably no accident that in Trackmania - another game famous for its (comparatively more simple) track editor - you could also only race against others or your ghost. If my memory serves well, in Stunts (a really old DOS game which was among the firsts to include a level editor) the AI could race on your tracks, but it only had like 2 dozen different basic elements that all took up the same amount of space on the building grid and they all had to connect with each other. (Even then, the computer controlled opponent was prone to crashing on them.)

I know this CAN be an issue, also on the 'spiritual successor' to Stunts called Crashday it is possible to create custom tracks with stunts like corkscrews / jumps and such. The trouble in that game is that AI can not cope with this. So I made 'AI friendly' stunts and a guide on how to use that in the track editor. Just trying to get that right is so much fun, in the end I spent 228 hours in this game. Mainly doing a lot of custom AI friendly tracks design and really enjoyed it, even though the game has its issues. Although for me the game now is too outdated.

I think the real issue is, the developers are not developing an option to choose to create either AI friendly tracks OR full freedom to create crazy tracks for the community. It really comes down to a game design choice. I would just like to see a game designer / developer to at least give the user the choice, to make both versions. And have the ability to use AI / bots on custom made tracks, so fingers crossed for the announced Wreckreation by THQnordic, although I wouldn't hole my breath for this ;-) .

[captaincofresi]

Originally posted by BETONEIRAS:

Originally posted by captaincofresi:

Just curious about what 'online multiplayer' means here? As from these posts I have now read I think it is like this:
- Massive multiplayer online: Custom tracks available, without AI / bots on track.
- Multiplayer online - private with friends: Custom tracks NOT available.
- Offline multiplayer split screen: Custom tracks available, without AI / bots on track.

Correct me if I am wrong, As I am still wondering if for the PS4 an online subscription might be worth it for this game, but for me this would only be if I can play versus people I know, hence: private with friends multiplayer on Custom Tracks.

I didn't actually know that you could play customized tracks in split-screen

Well, I was wrong. I got confused, because you can use a track you made yourself and is available locally in Split Screen (withouth AI / bots), but NOT a shared Community Track.

[captaincofresi]

Originally posted by BETONEIRAS:

Originally posted by captaincofresi:

Just curious about what 'online multiplayer' means here? As from these posts I have now read I think it is like this:
- Massive multiplayer online: Custom tracks available, without AI / bots on track.
- Multiplayer online - private with friends: Custom tracks NOT available.
- Offline multiplayer split screen: Custom tracks available, without AI / bots on track.

Correct me if I am wrong, As I am still wondering if for the PS4 an online subscription might be worth it for this game, but for me this would only be if I can play versus people I know, hence: private with friends multiplayer on Custom Tracks.

And if you have friends who can and also want to play, I think it's worth having the subscription. I particularly like playing with random people, but sometimes I can't find any matches. This falls a bit in line with the other fellow's comment about "dead games".
I don't know if it's just because Hot Wheels 2 has just been released or if people just got tired of the game, but it's been harder to find full matches, I usually only find 3-5 players, or none.

Do you mean you CAN play all Custom Tracks in a private setting with friends online? Or not?

[BETONEIRAS]

Originally posted by captaincofresi:

Originally posted by BETONEIRAS:

And if you have friends who can and also want to play, I think it's worth having the subscription. I particularly like playing with random people, but sometimes I can't find any matches. This falls a bit in line with the other fellow's comment about "dead games".
I don't know if it's just because Hot Wheels 2 has just been released or if people just got tired of the game, but it's been harder to find full matches, I usually only find 3-5 players, or none.

Do you mean you CAN play all Custom Tracks in a private setting with friends online? Or not?

I don't know if exactly all the tracks, but yeah it is possible to play custom tracks, but private multiplayer is the same as massive multiplayer, the game gives you 5 random tracks (both custom tracks and from the game itself) and the players choose one of them, you can't choose a specific track like you can in offline modes.

[captaincofresi]

Originally posted by BETONEIRAS:

Originally posted by captaincofresi:

Do you mean you CAN play all Custom Tracks in a private setting with friends online? Or not?

I don't know if exactly all the tracks, but yeah it is possible to play custom tracks, but private multiplayer is the same as massive multiplayer, the game gives you 5 random tracks (both custom tracks and from the game itself) and the players choose one of them, you can't choose a specific track like you can in offline modes.

Wow, only random tracks, no wonder I hear a lot of people saying they stopped playing this game. Kinda makes sense if there is no option to show off your own creations to friends, and enjoy this together. Seems online multiplayer for this game is a big no go for me then. Thanks very much for all the info, it really helps me to make this informed decision ;-) .