Morgott did nothing wrong (spoilers)

[Mr_Blank]

Something that bugs me about the fan base is how much a lot of us hate morgott, when he’s possibly the most redeemable god other than miquella. I will explain what each child of marika/Radagon has done to make them below morgott, and why morgott doesn’t deserve the Shade I see him getting. Reason I’m doing this is because of the Shade my man gets in the official discord.

Renalla and the Carians entered war with the golden order, but she and Radagon fell in love on the battlefield and created peace. While the peace is good, she pretty much abandons the ideals of the carians in favour of the golden order, which hurts her relationship with her troops and children. speaking of which;

Radahn didn’t start out malicious, as were told that he literally only studies gravity magic to be able to ride his horse Leonard. However, likely due to his admiration of Godfrey, he would become a warlord searching for a worthy opponent, which obviously ended in a lotta meaningless bloodshed.

Rykard left his family to create his own order, and eventually fed himself to the god devouring serpent to become immortal. In the process however, he murdered and killed thousands of warriors, as we see in his arena and I. The blasphemous blade.

Ranni started the shattering and that’s the end of that discussion.

Malenia and Miquella are both major traitors. miquella is a traitor to the erdtree because of his work on the Haligtree. Malenia literally destroyed all of caelid by using her bloom of scarlet rot. She ALSO did this to the haligtree for a purpose I do not know (feel free to mald me in the comments about it).

Mohg is a traitor because although I understand why he wanted to leave the shunning grounds he in turn created a dynasty of pure lust and terror that treats everyone who is a part of it like trash, except maybe Varre. Mohg also kidnapped a child so that’s the end of that.

Godrick stole his brother godefroys great rune after he died, making godrick a traitor, AND godrick also steals peoples limbs and grafts them to himself. His poor gatekeeper Gosfoc lost his entire arm to his evil master.

Finally Godwyns a really bad friend since he unintentionally both cursed and trapped his dragon friend fortisaxx after he died. I don’t have any arguement better than that since we know very little about him.

As for the other parents, Godfrey slaughtered an entire race of giants during the war, leaving the mountains without their main protectors to become a Chaotic land (I’m referring to the smaller giants being bullied by crows and giant hands obviously).

Marika and Radagon are the same person meaning Radagon is at fault as much as marika, who was the idiot who shattered the ring in the first place.

Morgott has not killed or fought anyone he didn’t see as a threat, as we know he fought radahn off during the shattering when the demigods raced to grab shards, and we know he only fights the tarnished because he knows they’re in search for the elden ring, and fights them again when they’re at the foot of the erdtree.

Morgott also hasn’t betrayed the erdtree or the golden order, despite all of his family doing so, and despite the erdtree shunning him And not giving him grace. He suffered the same fate as mohg in the shunning grounds yet he still serves the order.

In conclusion, morgott is the only god worth redeeming other than maybe radahn be a use of his love for Leonard, and maybe Godwyn since we don’t know a lot about him.

[Norm Macdonald's Ghost]

Originally posted by Koala 4peace:

...Also, we have to show this little ♥♥♥♥ that he can't hold a candle to Morgoth.

Morgoth isn't fit to carry Bal-Sagoth's books to class.

[Alby]

Originally posted by Koala 4peace:

In the end, Morgott is just another bag of runes we need to improve the character and progress in the game. What he did is irrelevant...

Also, we have to show this little ♥♥♥♥ that he can't hold a candle to Morgoth.

Starting to sound like a real Koala 4Violence

[UnholyDentist]

Ranni is neutral, she didn't want the common people to be oppressed by the Golden Order, nor to have her destiny set by the Two Fingers. Her father was also a lustful gigolo, no wonder she hated him and her fake family. Would the world be better without the shattering? Hard to tell, and it's down to perspective.

Morgott is the opposite, he was a good loyal dog and the type that follows the principle of "doing everything by the book". See where that got him and the Elden Ring. Again, this is down to one's perspective, but I see such people hypocrites and oppressors. Extreme politics, that take away much freedom never worked in reality for long, but this is a fantasy world so who knows. I personally don't like Morgott and I was pleased to separate his head from his shoulders. Good riddance.

[Koala 4peace]

Originally posted by Norm Macdonald's Ghost:

Originally posted by Koala 4peace:

...Also, we have to show this little ♥♥♥♥ that he can't hold a candle to Morgoth.

Morgoth isn't fit to carry Bal-Sagoth's books to class.

Unfortunately, my general ignorance about anything music related made this flew over my head...

[Mr_Blank]

Originally posted by UnholyDentist:

Ranni is neutral, she didn't want the common people to be oppressed by the Golden Order, nor to have her destiny set by the Two Fingers. Her father was also a lustful gigolo, no wonder she hated him and her fake family. Would the world be better without the shattering? Hard to tell, and it's down to perspective.

Morgott is the opposite, he was a good loyal dog and the type that follows the principle of "doing everything by the book". See where that got him and the Elden Ring. Again, this is down to one's perspective, but I see such people hypocrites and oppressors. Extreme politics, that take away much freedom never worked in reality for long, but this is a fantasy world so who knows. I personally don't like Morgott and I was pleased to separate his head from his shoulders. Good riddance.

This does make sense to me except anything and everything morgott may have done for the golden order is only a may have done. What we know about him is that he kills tarnished that threaten the elden ring and his throne, and that he fought to the teeth with demigods like Radahn. Clearly, he only kills when he feels he is being threatened ( the secret encounter he has InThe leyndell plains in front of the capital) or when the elden ring or throne is being threatened

Ranni on the other hand, while neutral is not afraid to kill or even assassinate those who suppose her ideals. While we don’t know why Goldwyn was the one chosen to be killed, and my working theory is he was marikas favourite, ranni still did not hesitate to steal from malekith and assassinate Godwyn, hurting two family members at once. And in doing this, she caused the shattering, which ended in miquella being kidnapped, the creation of caelid, the entrapment of fortisaxx, the false power of godrick allowing him to take stormveil, renallas insanity and obsess with rebirth, the imprisonment of Radagon and marika, and the potential banishment of malekith.

Even if morgott wasn’t afraid to kill to protect himself and his ideals, Ranni wasn’t afraid to ruin everyone’s lives just so she could rise to power and “make the world better”.

[GloriousZote]

Originally posted by Mr_Blank:

Originally posted by UnholyDentist:

Ranni is neutral, she didn't want the common people to be oppressed by the Golden Order, nor to have her destiny set by the Two Fingers. Her father was also a lustful gigolo, no wonder she hated him and her fake family. Would the world be better without the shattering? Hard to tell, and it's down to perspective.

Morgott is the opposite, he was a good loyal dog and the type that follows the principle of "doing everything by the book". See where that got him and the Elden Ring. Again, this is down to one's perspective, but I see such people hypocrites and oppressors. Extreme politics, that take away much freedom never worked in reality for long, but this is a fantasy world so who knows. I personally don't like Morgott and I was pleased to separate his head from his shoulders. Good riddance.

This does make sense to me except anything and everything morgott may have done for the golden order is only a may have done. What we know about him is that he kills tarnished that threaten the elden ring and his throne, and that he fought to the teeth with demigods like Radahn. Clearly, he only kills when he feels he is being threatened ( the secret encounter he has InThe leyndell plains in front of the capital) or when the elden ring or throne is being threatened

Ranni on the other hand, while neutral is not afraid to kill or even assassinate those who suppose her ideals. While we don’t know why Goldwyn was the one chosen to be killed, and my working theory is he was marikas favourite, ranni still did not hesitate to steal from malekith and assassinate Godwyn, hurting two family members at once. And in doing this, she caused the shattering, which ended in miquella being kidnapped, the creation of caelid, the entrapment of fortisaxx, the false power of godrick allowing him to take stormveil, renallas insanity and obsess with rebirth, the imprisonment of Radagon and marika, and the potential banishment of malekith.

Even if morgott wasn’t afraid to kill to protect himself and his ideals, Ranni wasn’t afraid to ruin everyone’s lives just so she could rise to power and “make the world better”.

You know what they say, things will get worse before they get better - what Ranni did is definitely awful, but i do think it'll lead to a better future once the age of stars kicks off.

[An Irate Walrus]

Originally posted by Mr_Blank:

Originally posted by UnholyDentist:

Ranni is neutral, she didn't want the common people to be oppressed by the Golden Order, nor to have her destiny set by the Two Fingers. Her father was also a lustful gigolo, no wonder she hated him and her fake family. Would the world be better without the shattering? Hard to tell, and it's down to perspective.

Morgott is the opposite, he was a good loyal dog and the type that follows the principle of "doing everything by the book". See where that got him and the Elden Ring. Again, this is down to one's perspective, but I see such people hypocrites and oppressors. Extreme politics, that take away much freedom never worked in reality for long, but this is a fantasy world so who knows. I personally don't like Morgott and I was pleased to separate his head from his shoulders. Good riddance.

This does make sense to me except anything and everything morgott may have done for the golden order is only a may have done. What we know about him is that he kills tarnished that threaten the elden ring and his throne, and that he fought to the teeth with demigods like Radahn. Clearly, he only kills when he feels he is being threatened ( the secret encounter he has InThe leyndell plains in front of the capital) or when the elden ring or throne is being threatened

Ranni on the other hand, while neutral is not afraid to kill or even assassinate those who suppose her ideals. While we don’t know why Goldwyn was the one chosen to be killed, and my working theory is he was marikas favourite, ranni still did not hesitate to steal from malekith and assassinate Godwyn, hurting two family members at once. And in doing this, she caused the shattering, which ended in miquella being kidnapped, the creation of caelid, the entrapment of fortisaxx, the false power of godrick allowing him to take stormveil, renallas insanity and obsess with rebirth, the imprisonment of Radagon and marika, and the potential banishment of malekith.

Even if morgott wasn’t afraid to kill to protect himself and his ideals, Ranni wasn’t afraid to ruin everyone’s lives just so she could rise to power and “make the world better”.

Ranni doesn't actually take power, though. In the Age of Stars ending, she breaks the hold of the Greater Will--and indeed, all outer gods--and then leaves the Lands Between entirely on a journey of her own.

Her goal is not to rise to godhood herself, but to shrive the Lands Between of the influence of any god, herself included. The "journey into darkness and fear" she mentions in her ending cutscene refers to the uncertainty inherent in humanity having to chart its own course, without external guidance of any kind.

You can dislike her methods; they're messy, and broke a lot of stuff, after all. But mischaracterizing her goals to suit a preferred narrative doesn't really help your argument.

[UnholyDentist]

Originally posted by Mr_Blank:

Originally posted by UnholyDentist:

Ranni is neutral, she didn't want the common people to be oppressed by the Golden Order, nor to have her destiny set by the Two Fingers. Her father was also a lustful gigolo, no wonder she hated him and her fake family. Would the world be better without the shattering? Hard to tell, and it's down to perspective.

Morgott is the opposite, he was a good loyal dog and the type that follows the principle of "doing everything by the book". See where that got him and the Elden Ring. Again, this is down to one's perspective, but I see such people hypocrites and oppressors. Extreme politics, that take away much freedom never worked in reality for long, but this is a fantasy world so who knows. I personally don't like Morgott and I was pleased to separate his head from his shoulders. Good riddance.

This does make sense to me except anything and everything morgott may have done for the golden order is only a may have done. What we know about him is that he kills tarnished that threaten the elden ring and his throne, and that he fought to the teeth with demigods like Radahn. Clearly, he only kills when he feels he is being threatened ( the secret encounter he has InThe leyndell plains in front of the capital) or when the elden ring or throne is being threatened

Ranni on the other hand, while neutral is not afraid to kill or even assassinate those who suppose her ideals. While we don’t know why Goldwyn was the one chosen to be killed, and my working theory is he was marikas favourite, ranni still did not hesitate to steal from malekith and assassinate Godwyn, hurting two family members at once. And in doing this, she caused the shattering, which ended in miquella being kidnapped, the creation of caelid, the entrapment of fortisaxx, the false power of godrick allowing him to take stormveil, renallas insanity and obsess with rebirth, the imprisonment of Radagon and marika, and the potential banishment of malekith.

Even if morgott wasn’t afraid to kill to protect himself and his ideals, Ranni wasn’t afraid to ruin everyone’s lives just so she could rise to power and “make the world better”.

Ranni wasn't interested in her fake family, Godwyn was her step brother and Miquella was also an offspring of her step mother. She doesn't want to have business with anything that is part of the Greater Will. Her purpose was to put a stop to the Golden order and the endless cycle of Greater Will, not to destroy. Those who she killed, assassinated, kidnapped, betrayed were the people who were involved in what she despised and opposed. I suppose she could've asked them nicely? Like, "I'm gonna need you stop oppressing the world and if you could also turn down your gods, that'd be great."

Morgott was defensive yes, but he is also a doggo of Golden Order, and the type of person I personally don't like. I have many people in my life that do it by the book and force their ideals on others, and I don't like any of them. Morgott just reminds me of them. It's a personal opinion, you and other may like him more.

[Mr_Blank]

Originally posted by UnholyDentist:

Originally posted by Mr_Blank:

This does make sense to me except anything and everything morgott may have done for the golden order is only a may have done. What we know about him is that he kills tarnished that threaten the elden ring and his throne, and that he fought to the teeth with demigods like Radahn. Clearly, he only kills when he feels he is being threatened ( the secret encounter he has InThe leyndell plains in front of the capital) or when the elden ring or throne is being threatened

Ranni on the other hand, while neutral is not afraid to kill or even assassinate those who suppose her ideals. While we don’t know why Goldwyn was the one chosen to be killed, and my working theory is he was marikas favourite, ranni still did not hesitate to steal from malekith and assassinate Godwyn, hurting two family members at once. And in doing this, she caused the shattering, which ended in miquella being kidnapped, the creation of caelid, the entrapment of fortisaxx, the false power of godrick allowing him to take stormveil, renallas insanity and obsess with rebirth, the imprisonment of Radagon and marika, and the potential banishment of malekith.

Even if morgott wasn’t afraid to kill to protect himself and his ideals, Ranni wasn’t afraid to ruin everyone’s lives just so she could rise to power and “make the world better”.

Ranni wasn't interested in her fake family, Godwyn was her step brother and Miquella was also an offspring of her step mother. She doesn't want to have business with anything that is part of the Greater Will. Her purpose was to put a stop to the Golden order and the endless cycle of Greater Will, not to destroy. Those who she killed, assassinated, kidnapped, betrayed were the people who were involved in what she despised and opposed. I suppose she could've asked them nicely? Like, "I'm gonna need you stop oppressing the world and if you could also turn down your gods, that'd be great."

Morgott was defensive yes, but he is also a doggo of Golden Order, and the type of person I personally don't like. I have many people in my life that do it by the book and force their ideals on others, and I don't like any of them. Morgott just reminds me of them. It's a personal opinion, you and other may like him more.

That’s fair and we’ll leave it at that. I don’t hate any of the gods either (except for godrick and mohg) and I think they’re all designed and written REALLY well, ESPECIALLY Ranni who has one of the most interesting motives. But if I’m judging the demigods by their actions solely, the lady responsible for basically the 2012 movie events happening to the lands between us a little less redeemable than the guy who suplexes people who threaten his beleifs, good or bad. Anyway opinions are subjective and comparison is the thief of joy, so if you don’t like morgott I’m not gonna come after you with a +25 cross naginata, I don’t care lol. Just don’t think the guy deserves the bad talk he gets in the official discord is all.

[UnholyDentist]

Originally posted by Mr_Blank:

Originally posted by UnholyDentist:

Ranni wasn't interested in her fake family, Godwyn was her step brother and Miquella was also an offspring of her step mother. She doesn't want to have business with anything that is part of the Greater Will. Her purpose was to put a stop to the Golden order and the endless cycle of Greater Will, not to destroy. Those who she killed, assassinated, kidnapped, betrayed were the people who were involved in what she despised and opposed. I suppose she could've asked them nicely? Like, "I'm gonna need you stop oppressing the world and if you could also turn down your gods, that'd be great."

Morgott was defensive yes, but he is also a doggo of Golden Order, and the type of person I personally don't like. I have many people in my life that do it by the book and force their ideals on others, and I don't like any of them. Morgott just reminds me of them. It's a personal opinion, you and other may like him more.

That’s fair and we’ll leave it at that. I don’t hate any of the gods either (except for godrick and mohg) and I think they’re all designed and written REALLY well, ESPECIALLY Ranni who has one of the most interesting motives. But if I’m judging the demigods by their actions solely, the lady responsible for basically the 2012 movie events happening to the lands between us a little less redeemable than the guy who suplexes people who threaten his beleifs, good or bad. Anyway opinions are subjective and comparison is the thief of joy, so if you don’t like morgott I’m not gonna come after you with a +25 cross naginata, I don’t care lol. Just don’t think the guy deserves the bad talk he gets in the official discord is all.

Ranni is pretty much the Eren (AoT/SnK) of Elden Ring. Morgott is like the CEO of the Lands Between. He desperately wants to keep his annual bonuses, even if that means hunting and slaughtering great champions, who might be better for the job.

[hemorrhage911]

Originally posted by UnholyDentist:

Originally posted by Mr_Blank:

This does make sense to me except anything and everything morgott may have done for the golden order is only a may have done. What we know about him is that he kills tarnished that threaten the elden ring and his throne, and that he fought to the teeth with demigods like Radahn. Clearly, he only kills when he feels he is being threatened ( the secret encounter he has InThe leyndell plains in front of the capital) or when the elden ring or throne is being threatened

Ranni on the other hand, while neutral is not afraid to kill or even assassinate those who suppose her ideals. While we don’t know why Goldwyn was the one chosen to be killed, and my working theory is he was marikas favourite, ranni still did not hesitate to steal from malekith and assassinate Godwyn, hurting two family members at once. And in doing this, she caused the shattering, which ended in miquella being kidnapped, the creation of caelid, the entrapment of fortisaxx, the false power of godrick allowing him to take stormveil, renallas insanity and obsess with rebirth, the imprisonment of Radagon and marika, and the potential banishment of malekith.

Even if morgott wasn’t afraid to kill to protect himself and his ideals, Ranni wasn’t afraid to ruin everyone’s lives just so she could rise to power and “make the world better”.

Ranni wasn't interested in her fake family, Godwyn was her step brother and Miquella was also an offspring of her step mother. She doesn't want to have business with anything that is part of the Greater Will. Her purpose was to put a stop to the Golden order and the endless cycle of Greater Will, not to destroy. Those who she killed, assassinated, kidnapped, betrayed were the people who were involved in what she despised and opposed. I suppose she could've asked them nicely? Like, "I'm gonna need you stop oppressing the world and if you could also turn down your gods, that'd be great."

Morgott was defensive yes, but he is also a doggo of Golden Order, and the type of person I personally don't like. I have many people in my life that do it by the book and force their ideals on others, and I don't like any of them. Morgott just reminds me of them. It's a personal opinion, you and other may like him more.

Morgott is more like a beaten dog - that's why his story is sad. Born cursed, shunned, never loved, shackled, probably mentally and physically abused - I think it's probably the correct assumption that he was very much conditioned into being the way that he is.

[CazadorDeLobo]

Originally posted by warriorx:

here we go again - people discussing the story of a game with no ingame story whatsoever - in fact its just "a zombie with no renown wakes up and mindless kill everyone to be elden lord"

Yeah, it's almost like there is, in fact, story to be found in the game.

[hemorrhage911]

Originally posted by warriorx:

here we go again - people discussing the story of a game with no ingame story whatsoever - in fact its just "a zombie with no renown wakes up and mindless kill everyone to be elden lord"

Okay, first off, even if it was JUST that...it would qualify as a story. But this is like reading the first page and last page of a book and saying there was nothing else between. This style of Fromsoftware games are over a decade old, why is this stupid argument still persisting?

Dark Souls, Bloodborne, and Elden Ring all have stories they are just told in a more unconventional way. The story itself is put together like a puzzle, there are certain pieces intentionally left out for players to add in their own interpretation and create discussion. There being so many multi-hour videos online about the lore/story of these games tells you that the developers succeeded at what they were going for.

Not every game needs 20 hours of cutscene exposition to have a story the same way a book doesn't need a thousand pages to tell a story.

[CourtesyFlush09]

Originally posted by warriorx:

here we go again - people discussing the story of a game with no ingame story whatsoever - in fact its just "a zombie with no renown wakes up and mindless kill everyone to be elden lord"

You're always welcome to go back to your "where nude modz?" and "Ranni best waifu" threads.

[CazadorDeLobo]

Originally posted by hemorrhage911:

Originally posted by warriorx:

here we go again - people discussing the story of a game with no ingame story whatsoever - in fact its just "a zombie with no renown wakes up and mindless kill everyone to be elden lord"

Okay, first off, even if it was JUST that...it would qualify as a story.

NES-tier story, but yeah. In fact, a lot of the design elements of FS games seem to take inspiration from the NES library, in regards to difficulty, cryptic story-telling or puzzle solutions, and the general pacing of the story(as a supplement to the gameplay, rather than the other way around as is prevalent in modern AAA game design).