How I believe horse+spirit ashes fundamentally destroys the game

[Hades]

Im just curious as to why i'd rather pretend im in Vietnam, as the Vietnamese, using the guerrilla style warfare that is the horse, Vrs the elegant dance of I frames and expertly reading your opponent to dodge, punish and parry.

HOWS IT FUN TO RUN AWAY AND BACK CHARGING R2S THE ENTIRE FIGHT?? and dont tell me otherwise cause the horse doesnt have I frames so everything else means your prolly taking damage.

its boring its not dark souls I hate the stupid horse so much, give me back my beautifully intricate world that had something happening practically every step of the way. instead now its a running simulator with broken up camps of enemies, shortcuts only existing in legacy dungeons now. I think a Large part, at least for me, is the running around to find the same ass dungeons in terms of looks, layout and enemies.

Spirit ashes are how Fromsoft is allowing casual player to choose their difficulty, which i dont have a problem with, what i do have a problem with is that every boss is designed with that feature in mind.

Lets look an there earliest boss i feel suffers from being designed with spirit ashes in mind.
Crucible knight: His shield Pretty much makes long range a no go. he reads button inputs like everything else does, making his two different running attacks insanely good at catching you from a long ways away. he can also chain those two running attacks into each other making him nigh unstoppable (if youre not an overleveled god) until he decides arbitrarily that hes done, Or you parry and pray you dont miss cause he may not be done chaining attacks yet. just kinda annoyed i kinda need spirit ashes (or parry) every time for this fight cause you need to fight him like 11 times.
his tail miracle can reach more then half the boss stage on the second tail slap and couple that with the fact, mother ♥♥♥♥♥♥ can fly then chain that move right after making your attempted punish, a punish on you. and dont get me wrong i have killed everything in this game dozens of times, I just avoid certain enemies now. <=is mostly due to them ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ up boss souls and not making any boss worth their weight in souls always a disappointment

and let me attempt to stop the trolls that will say git gud to this part. I have beaten yhorm the giant with a un-upgraded club. i have beaten dark souls 2 with a soup spoon. when i load up dark souls 1 i kill 4 kings as my 2nd boss and only because i need sif's ring. i beat bloodborne with only guns.
I AM GOOD at this game. yet 400+ hours and i still cant really read most of the bosses. why does every boss have the ability to change combos and delay their attacks and have moves specially designed around roll catching you? thats why i dont parry in this game its why my other dark souls weeb roommate (who i consider a parry god up there with lobo jr like For real) has such a hard time parring in this game in comparison to other souls titles.

[EF_Neo1st]

Hades původně napsal:

Morton Koopa Jr. původně napsal:

Yeah.....by what criterion is OP judging his ability at the game?
Certainly not time count alone...

I have several hundred hours in DS3, and I'm pretty much ♥♥♥♥ at the game.

"and let me attempt to stop the trolls that will say git gud to this part. I have beaten yhorm the giant with a un-upgraded club. i have beaten dark souls 2 with a soup spoon. when i load up dark souls 1 i kill 4 kings as my 2nd boss and only because i need sif's ring. i beat bloodborne with only guns." by this metric learn to read, jared.

By this metric at some point you learned some bosses.
400+ h and still can not read most bosses at Elden Ring and stil consider yourself as good just show how little standards for "being good" you have.

I am not perfect, far from that, but I could read the bosses on my 1st to 3rd attempt, then it was more a matter of more attention, a little bit more reading and patience to dont overdo or to pick the right times to engage or disengage "and I dont consider myself good at the game" as I often do more mistakes than I would like to admit (but I can read the bosses).

[Clail]

Horse combat is fine, given its mobility you don't need iframes.

Spirit ashes aren't that different from NPC summons in previous souls games.

Crucible Knight fight literally doesn't even allow spirit ashes if I recall correctly, and they are perfectly doable without cheese or parry. All of their attacks are well telegraphed and follow a specific flow that's easy to dodge. Later phases just add a tailswipe to throw you off it's original moveset.

Learn the roll catches, pick an appropriate shield and learn whats safe to block. Git gud.

[zero]

EF_Neo1st původně napsal:

Hades původně napsal:

"and let me attempt to stop the trolls that will say git gud to this part. I have beaten yhorm the giant with a un-upgraded club. i have beaten dark souls 2 with a soup spoon. when i load up dark souls 1 i kill 4 kings as my 2nd boss and only because i need sif's ring. i beat bloodborne with only guns." by this metric learn to read, jared.

By this metric at some point you learned some bosses.
400+ h and still can not read most bosses at Elden Ring and stil consider yourself as good just show how little standards for "being good" you have.

I am not perfect, far from that, but I could read the bosses on my 1st to 3rd attempt, then it was more a matter of more attention, a little bit more reading and patience to dont overdo or to pick the right times to engage or disengage "and I dont consider myself good at the game" as I often do more mistakes than I would like to admit (but I can read the bosses).

i mean its a strange argument TC is trying to make cause like: if you can learn bosses in dark souls, you can learn them here, every boss has a limited move pool, once you know it, you know it, from that point on all you need to account for is timing, which is what delayed attacks are, a way to mix things up mid combat, it add variance so you cant just "solve" a boss.

nobody is perfect and we're gonna make mistakes, but the bosses in any of the game all have pretty obvious tells, this is an ARPG afterall, it wants you to respond to the boss via dodge/block, the agency is in your own hands.

[TaurusBully]

Knavenformed původně napsal:

zero původně napsal:

and yes, the delayed attacks is literally designed for people who memorize every move and just roll, it requires you to actually roll when the timing is right rather then simply when you see move A coming at you.

So you do agree that the enemies in Elden Ring are not based on reading enemy movesets but learning their quirks?
Dark Souls 3's combat is based on reading movesets and dodging on instinct, the only real holding enemy is Nameless King yet his momentum is very consistent, enemies like Margit are literally suspended in air, pretty much the only delayed attack boss that feels correct is Mohg who uses his trident as an unwieldy club, there's a huge difference in readability in the games.

Here your dodge has to be less on instintc and more on reading , those delayed atacks happen sooner or later, but you die if you panic roll.

[Hades]

EF_Neo1st původně napsal:

Hades původně napsal:

"and let me attempt to stop the trolls that will say git gud to this part. I have beaten yhorm the giant with a un-upgraded club. i have beaten dark souls 2 with a soup spoon. when i load up dark souls 1 i kill 4 kings as my 2nd boss and only because i need sif's ring. i beat bloodborne with only guns." by this metric learn to read, jared.

By this metric at some point you learned some bosses.
400+ h and still can not read most bosses at Elden Ring and stil consider yourself as good just show how little standards for "being good" you have.

I am not perfect, far from that, but I could read the bosses on my 1st to 3rd attempt, then it was more a matter of more attention, a little bit more reading and patience to dont overdo or to pick the right times to engage or disengage "and I dont consider myself good at the game" as I often do more mistakes than I would like to admit (but I can read the bosses).

ok jared...try to counter some of the points i made not just repeating yourself but slightly differently and for those of you who are just now jumping into this thread to OWN OP.

Crucible Knight is a boss you can easily fight before godrick, kinda even expected to. That offers basically no reward even if youre a faith build, because 1200 runes is next to nothing and the tail slap spell sucks too. That is substantially harder then even radahn. This enemy can chain his two varied running attacks creating almost no openings to attack him, unless youre good at parring (I having one eye and therefor not too good at parring since i dont have depth perception, its basically a guessing game for me to parry) I have killed every crucible knight 12 times over i feel at this point so im not saying this enemy is impossible its just ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ pointless for you to fight any crucible knight.

all 12 crucible knights drops, Tail Slap, a breath attack worse then the ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ dragon Communion spell, a Barely decent spear and a ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ sword, <20,000 runes, all of which is worse then blowing bubbles.
Vrs Godrick, 12000 runes, a decent quality build axe for pve, and a dragon fist weapon that can bomb out 2400 damage, with no buffs, on weapon art. So yeah 12 fights and what might i actually use? a varied crucible helmet and chest piece. thanks for wasting my time Fromsoft.

Moving on to black knife, again i really dont get why anyone is defending elden ring on this ♥♥♥♥♥. but here we go anyways. the basic non-inivis are not that bad (well minus the fact you fight them way too often) but when it comes to Invisi girls (black knifes located in the evergoal town) are just plain and simple bad design. they just ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ are. how can anyone look me in my one functional eye and tell me to read her attacks better. shes ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ invisi girl and doesnt leave foot prints when walking only when jumping, and all you get there is a 2 second puff of snow. bosses in this game barely follow any logic, and bois out here telling me to sac my dual wielding build or my shield build for whatever amount of time to beat some garbage ass enemy that doesn't offer ANYTHING ON DROP!!

Have to drop what im doing and buy a torch to beat an enemy i suppose.

Also ♥♥♥♥ YHORM, ♥♥♥♥ STROM RULER, ♥♥♥♥ BED OF CHOAS, ♥♥♥♥ CHARIOT OF DARK SOULS 2, these are bad bosses hands down. but non of these bosses force me to even leave the area, minus four kings but again sacing a ring slot in dark souls isnt as impactful as stowing a weapon slot away in elden ring. my damage isnt reduced by 50% in dark souls when i take a ring off. my damage does go down by 50% in this game when i take a weapon slot away however.

Like For real why are we even bringing up the older games here? did i say those were good boss designs? no i did defend them but only because i feel like the gimmicks were done better in these OLDER cases. so bite me i guess.

also LMFAO anyone here who can say they beat radhan on patch 1.00? i can. can anyone here say that they've beaten radahn without horse, without summming, and without magic? on patch 1.00? no? maybe back up then before you call someone else bad. I've beaten this game with a oracle horn no summons. im better then 90% of y'all

[zero]

it'd be easier to read her attacks if you used the torch, you just choose not to.

plus you fought several beforehand with the same movesets, so if you truly wanted to you could fight them invis anyway.

[EF_Neo1st]

zero původně napsal:

EF_Neo1st původně napsal:

By this metric at some point you learned some bosses.
400+ h and still can not read most bosses at Elden Ring and stil consider yourself as good just show how little standards for "being good" you have.

I am not perfect, far from that, but I could read the bosses on my 1st to 3rd attempt, then it was more a matter of more attention, a little bit more reading and patience to dont overdo or to pick the right times to engage or disengage "and I dont consider myself good at the game" as I often do more mistakes than I would like to admit (but I can read the bosses).

i mean its a strange argument TC is trying to make cause like: if you can learn bosses in dark souls, you can learn them here, every boss has a limited move pool, once you know it, you know it, from that point on all you need to account for is timing, which is what delayed attacks are, a way to mix things up mid combat, it add variance so you cant just "solve" a boss.

nobody is perfect and we're gonna make mistakes, but the bosses in any of the game all have pretty obvious tells, this is an ARPG afterall, it wants you to respond to the boss via dodge/block, the agency is in your own hands.

Exactly . . . reason why to "not learn bosses" and still consider self as good in the game (or braging about bosses in other games) dont exactly mean much or just show little standards for "being good at it".

Either way, it is weird way of saying "I AM GOOD AT THE GAME" OP did.

[EF_Neo1st]

Hades původně napsal:

EF_Neo1st původně napsal:

By this metric at some point you learned some bosses.
400+ h and still can not read most bosses at Elden Ring and stil consider yourself as good just show how little standards for "being good" you have.

I am not perfect, far from that, but I could read the bosses on my 1st to 3rd attempt, then it was more a matter of more attention, a little bit more reading and patience to dont overdo or to pick the right times to engage or disengage "and I dont consider myself good at the game" as I often do more mistakes than I would like to admit (but I can read the bosses).

ok jared...try to counter some of the points i made not just repeating yourself but slightly differently and for those of you who are just now jumping into this thread to OWN OP.

Crucible Knight is a boss you can easily fight before godrick, kinda even expected to. That offers basically no reward even if youre a faith build, because 1200 runes is next to nothing and the tail slap spell sucks too. That is substantially harder then even radahn. This enemy can chain his two varied running attacks creating almost no openings to attack him, unless youre good at parring (I having one eye and therefor not too good at parring since i dont have depth perception, its basically a guessing game for me to parry) I have killed every crucible knight 12 times over i feel at this point so im not saying this enemy is impossible its just ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ pointless for you to fight any crucible knight.

all 12 crucible knights drops, Tail Slap, a breath attack worse then the ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ dragon Communion spell, a Barely decent spear and a ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ sword, <20,000 runes, all of which is worse then blowing bubbles.
Vrs Godrick, 12000 runes, a decent quality build axe for pve, and a dragon fist weapon that can bomb out 2400 damage, with no buffs, on weapon art. So yeah 12 fights and what might i actually use? a varied crucible helmet and chest piece. thanks for wasting my time Fromsoft.

Moving on to black knife, again i really dont get why anyone is defending elden ring on this ♥♥♥♥♥. but here we go anyways. the basic non-inivis are not that bad (well minus the fact you fight them way too often) but when it comes to Invisi girls (black knifes located in the evergoal town) are just plain and simple bad design. they just ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ are. how can anyone look me in my one functional eye and tell me to read her attacks better. shes ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ invisi girl and doesnt leave foot prints when walking only when jumping, and all you get there is a 2 second puff of snow. bosses in this game barely follow any logic, and bois out here telling me to sac my dual wielding build or my shield build for whatever amount of time to beat some garbage ass enemy that doesn't offer ANYTHING ON DROP!!

Have to drop what im doing and buy a torch to beat an enemy i suppose.

Also ♥♥♥♥ YHORM, ♥♥♥♥ STROM RULER, ♥♥♥♥ BED OF CHOAS, ♥♥♥♥ CHARIOT OF DARK SOULS 2, these are bad bosses hands down. but non of these bosses force me to even leave the area, minus four kings but again sacing a ring slot in dark souls isnt as impactful as stowing a weapon slot away in elden ring. my damage isnt reduced by 50% in dark souls when i take a ring off. my damage does go down by 50% in this game when i take a weapon slot away however.

Like For real why are we even bringing up the older games here? did i say those were good boss designs? no i did defend them but only because i feel like the gimmicks were done better in these OLDER cases. so bite me i guess.

also LMFAO anyone here who can say they beat radhan on patch 1.00? i can. can anyone here say that they've beaten radahn without horse, without summming, and without magic? on patch 1.00? no? maybe back up then before you call someone else bad. I've beaten this game with a oracle horn no summons. im better then 90% of y'all

For real, you started bringing the old games here, also you started bragging about being good at a game while mentioning you could not really read most of the bosses after 400+ hours into the game and my comments were basically over that, you are not good at the game if you can not even read the bosses, no matter if 4 hours into the game, 400 or 4000.

[Malthar]

Hades původně napsal:

not play the game at that point

EXACTLY! If you dont like a game, dont ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ play it!

[Hades]

Malthar původně napsal:

Hades původně napsal:

not play the game at that point

EXACTLY! If you dont like a game, dont ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ play it!

lmao, im guessing youre someone who hasnt played any of the other games. i bought this game day 1 how was i supposed to know weather or not that i would like it before my purchase? or are you telling me that shouldve just burned my 60$ also whos to say i didnt like elden ring read my statement again like with your eyes. its just less then their previous games by a lot still an ok game in a sea of terribleness and meritocracy, that is the gaming market rn

[Hades]

Malthar původně napsal:

Hades původně napsal:

not play the game at that point

EXACTLY! If you dont like a game, dont ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ play it!

i deleted characters in dark souls 2 with 1000s of hours on them so thats my standard and ill be spending less then that characters worth of time on this game

[TaurusBully]

I for one am more sick of so much plataforming, I mean game 2 had a little , but now since they introduced jump button they transformed this game into mario.

think I never had to google other souls game nor blood borne or Sekiro that much for where to go, just for a few itens /npc quests.

Here I find myself alt tabing to fextralife a lot of times.

[Malthar]

Hades původně napsal:

Malthar původně napsal:

EXACTLY! If you dont like a game, dont ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ play it!

lmao, im guessing youre someone who hasnt played any of the other games. i bought this game day 1 how was i supposed to know weather or not that i would like it before my purchase? or are you telling me that shouldve just burned my 60$ also whos to say i didnt like elden ring read my statement again like with your eyes. its just less then their previous games by a lot still an ok game in a sea of terribleness and meritocracy, that is the gaming market rn

Ive played everything since Demon Souls mate, you can pull assumptions out of your ass but theyll more than likely be plain wrong. You can buy games and decide you dont like them later, never said you had to know before purchasing. I'm also not claiming you dont like the game. Im saying, if, IF, you dont like it, dont play it. Thats not a hard subject to grasp.

[Hades]

TaurusBully původně napsal:

I for one am more sick of so much plataforming, I mean game 2 had a little , but now since they introduced jump button they transformed this game into mario.

think I never had to google other souls game nor blood borne or Sekiro that much for where to go, just for a few itens /npc quests.

Here I find myself alt tabing to fextralife a lot of times.

i agree i really dont like plat forming, in any game lmao. and those 3 sections, oof my bones. (dvine tower of cealid, haligtree, getting to the 3 fingers shaft.)

[paulaus333]

what a dumpster fire! :D