Elden ring bosses were bad, DLC's are terrible

[Juanill0]

So, here we are, I finally completed the entire DLC with the final boss included. This said, I think Elden Ring is an incredible game brought down by bad bosses.

These bosses never feel satisfying to beat, neither do they feel like a challenge like those of Sekiro, Bloodborne or DS3. They aren't tests of skill, but rather of how fast you can memorise all their moveset... the cause? Delayed attacks and how unnaturally the bosses move.

This is the single worst thing about Elden Ring for me. Delayed attacks can be a good tool to catch the players off guard when they aren't paying attention, the dancer of the boreal valley is a great example of an incredible boss that uses an irregular rythm and delayed attacks to surprise the player.

But what happens when virtually every single combo of every single boss spams them? That you completely break the rythm of the fight.

Let's take Slave Knight Gael, a true last boss that tests all you have learned through DS3, however, he couldn't be more different from ER bosses. His combos are relatively short (between 3 and 6 attacks), with only one important delayed attack and very little AoE, as well as very telegraphed finishers with big gaps to hit back.

This is what makes a good boss, he has rythm. The entire fight is an epic back and forth, a dance of death where he desperately tries to kill you as you grit your teeth through his phases, dodging as you can and punishing him. Most importantly, you have more than enough time to strategise and heal in between combos, or punishing him with a combo.

Now let's take ER DLC bosses... not a single one has rythm, why? Every single attack is a cheesy delayed attack, every 3 attacks 1 is a crazy AoE, every combo is 20 seconds long so you just sit there with your thumb up your ass waiting for him to finish so you can poke him once. Oh, and let's not forget even after they finish their combos, if you as much as touch the estus button half the time they will instantly turn around halfway through their animation and hit you with another 20 hit combo.

And let's not forget how now every single boss has to zoom across the arena every single time he gets bored, meaning you can spend half the fight chasing a boss around as he spams his ''beyblade of death'' attack on you.

ER bosses (and specially those of the DLC) are clearly meant to be fought by 2 people, a summons and you, this sucks if you prefer to solo them and becomes incredibly obvious when even the most bassic attacks of the easiest DLC bosses have giant reach and cover 210º, hitting you even behind the boss.

This also messes completely with the balance up, with bosses doing ridiculous damage and having ridiculous healthpools (and don't you dare summon someone or it gets even worse).

So in the end these bosses aren't fun and don't feel rewarding. They are so grossly agressive and overpowered that after beating the last DLC boss I felt nothing, in fact I didn't feel anything with none of the DLC bosses, they felt like boring roadblocks rather than engaging fights. This is due to how lacking they are in Rythm.

Weirdly enough, even the DLC bosses were relatively simple to beat, with the last boss being the only one that took more than 10 tries, so I don't think difficulty is the issue. And I think these bosses wouldn't be bad if we had Bloodborne's rally mechanic and mobility.

This is so sad because everything else about the game (except the subpar soundtrack) is almost perfect, and it kinda sucks the bosses are so boring and gnerally bad. God bless.

[Janthis]

This is what I don't understand about bosses being stupidly hard and people saying "yeah but it's so rewarding when you finally beat them though." My usual experience in such cases was not a feeling of accomplishment, rather just being glad it was over and sorta feeling like I won through luck.

[p0k314NET]

This DLC is FromSoftware's worst-rated product in the last 15 years. Something like this didn't appear out of nowhere and unfortunately it says a lot about the serious internal problems of this studio.

[BingusDingus]

I didn't find the bosses too bad. There were some really good ones like Midra, he felt like a good old fashion fromsoft boss, a deadly dance. I also liked the NPC gank fight, not because it was particularly flashy or anything but it was different, and funnily enough had some complex AI for what it was, the AI had teamwork.
But i wish they'd bring back the variety, making every boss fly around like they're at Cirque du Soleil, have 2 phases and combo attacks/AOEs non stop gets tiring. Fromsoft games used to have great variety, even if some of it wasn't that great. They also really need to work on their camera Tech, idk why they'd design a boss like the Dancing Lion if they knew their camera would bug out because of him.

Do agree some of the rewards are trash though, mostly because they are undertuned. Like look at the final boss for example, when you beat him you get a choice between an extremely undertuned spell and two identical weapons but with different Ashes of War, one of which is laughably undertuned. Couldn't they of just made it the same weapon by making the Ashes of War the Light attack and Heavy Attack version?

[Zoid13]

Originally posted by p0k314NET:

This DLC is FromSoftware's worst-rated product in the last 15 years. Something like this didn't appear out of nowhere and unfortunately it says a lot about the serious internal problems of this studio.

i personally think that has less to do with the DLC directly and more to do with the general modern complaining about everything (not just games)
these days everything is constant overreactions. its all either a 10/10 if you liked something or a 1/10 if there was something that rubbed you the wrong way lol

i think the dlc is fantastic personally. and yeah its "hard" (until you get scadu then its even easier than the base game because you do like double damage lol) but the entry condition for the DLC is Mohg. a high level 'end game' boss. the difficulty makes perfect sense.

its also a sudo character reset on entering DLC world so the geared people don't just steamroll it in an hour and complain that there's no content.

cant please everyone. i loved it and am still loving it :)

[p0k314NET]

Originally posted by Aerieanei:

Originally posted by p0k314NET:

This DLC is FromSoftware's worst-rated product in the last 15 years. Something like this didn't appear out of nowhere and unfortunately it says a lot about the serious internal problems of this studio.

Radahn and Miquella didn't deserve this.

More like Sister Friede didn't deserve this - a perfect end game boss in whole gaming history (in that genre of course). Since Dark Souls 3, two trends can be felt: recycling and lowering production costs. And all this with record profits. A disastrous combination that bodes ill for the future. Elden Ring was an outstanding game with many problems, the DLC is a complete failure in creative and technical terms. Aslo Armored Core 6 was a failure at the mechanics level, which resulted in bad sales including Japan! (deservedly so). Two big flops in one year. The direction is clear.

[Janthis]

Originally posted by p0k314NET:

Originally posted by Aerieanei:

Radahn and Miquella didn't deserve this.

More like Sister Friede didn't deserve this. Since Dark Souls 3, two trends can be felt: recycling and lowering production costs. And all this with record profits. A disastrous combination that bodes ill for the future. Elden Ring was an outstanding game with many problems, the DLC is a complete failure in creative and technical terms. Aslo Armored Core 6 was a failure at the mechanics level, which resulted in bad sales (deservedly so!). Two big flops in one year. The direction is clear.

Unfortunately they can afford to keep doing this because of their legion of fanboys who don't care about the quality, just belonging to the "ultra elite club" of telling each other how great the game is while looking down on everyone else. Miyazaki could release a black screen and they would insist it's genius and anyone who says different needs to "git gud".

[Zoid13]

Originally posted by Johnny_B_80:

Unfortunately they can afford to keep doing this because of their legion of fanboys who don't care about the quality, just belonging to the "ultra elite club" of telling each other how great the game is while looking down on everyone else. Miyazaki could release a black screen and they would insist it's genius and anyone who says different needs to "git gud".

i greatly enjoyed all 200+ hours of playing elden ring and the DLC. i have my gripes with certain aspects of it. like all games nothings perfect there's always something that could be better. but it was fantastic none the less. its not a 10/10 its also not a complete failure like so many are touting. games a solid 7.5-8
don't need anyone to agree with me to know i enjoyed the game so much so that im playing it through again from scratch atm lol

[BingusDingus]

Originally posted by Johnny_B_80:

Originally posted by p0k314NET:

More like Sister Friede didn't deserve this. Since Dark Souls 3, two trends can be felt: recycling and lowering production costs. And all this with record profits. A disastrous combination that bodes ill for the future. Elden Ring was an outstanding game with many problems, the DLC is a complete failure in creative and technical terms. Aslo Armored Core 6 was a failure at the mechanics level, which resulted in bad sales (deservedly so!). Two big flops in one year. The direction is clear.

Unfortunately they can afford to keep doing this because of their legion of fanboys who don't care about the quality, just belonging to the "ultra elite club" of telling each other how great the game is while looking down on everyone else. Miyazaki could release a black screen and they would insist it's genius and anyone who says different needs to "git gud".

Yeah, it's kind of sad that people accept these issues and down play them with either "Git gud" or "Well I liked it."
We all want a better game, and Elden Ring is a very flawed game that while it is fun, could be massively improved. I really hope they take another crack at this type of game and take everything they learned from Elden Ring and improve on every single issue it had.

Toxic positivity ruins games, criticism should be given when it is needed and especially when you see them going in a worrying direction. Nothing good comes from ignoring or downplaying issues

[楊玄。杨玄。LangrisserWWE]

If it is too hard for you and you are not enjoying it. Try starting a comfort group where you guys can sit in a circle and spill all the frustrations you have for the game and how you can/cannot refund it. But real people usually just stop playing it or not buy future games of this genre. It is okay to walk away from something you don't enjoy.

[Sgt nameless69]

[/quote]
don't need anyone to agree with me to know i enjoyed the game so much so that im playing it through again from scratch atm lol [/quote]

If you don't need anyone to agree with you then why is this your 2nd response to a comment explaining why you like it? No one is trying to convince you not to.

[tmg]

Originally posted by p0k314NET:

This DLC is FromSoftware's worst-rated product in the last 15 years. Something like this didn't appear out of nowhere and unfortunately it says a lot about the serious internal problems of this studio.

https://opencritic.com/game/16525/elden-ring-shadow-of-the-erdtree

orly?

[p0k314NET]

Originally posted by tmg:

Originally posted by p0k314NET:

This DLC is FromSoftware's worst-rated product in the last 15 years. Something like this didn't appear out of nowhere and unfortunately it says a lot about the serious internal problems of this studio.

https://opencritic.com/game/16525/elden-ring-shadow-of-the-erdtree

orly?

I understand that you are a teenager and that you treat opinions on a marketing platform as a determinant of opinions and product quality. This is very typical for this age. You might as well check the rating on FB and other social and marketing garbage.

Go to https://steamdb.info/ and check how situation look like. For clarity, I would like to point out that FS exists there under several different names, so you need to dig a little deeper. Shadow of the Erdtree Edition is the worst rated FS production since Ninja Blade from Nov 2009. And we are talking about a control group of several dozen thousand customers.

[BingusDingus]

Originally posted by tmg:

Originally posted by p0k314NET:

This DLC is FromSoftware's worst-rated product in the last 15 years. Something like this didn't appear out of nowhere and unfortunately it says a lot about the serious internal problems of this studio.

https://opencritic.com/game/16525/elden-ring-shadow-of-the-erdtree

orly?

Nobody cares about paid critic reviews lmao, have never trusted an actual critic review in forever. Also never trust youtubers that get a review code, because of course they are not going to dunk on something if it means never getting another.

EDIT: I've actually seen youtubers not even make a video on a game that they got a review code for because it was so bad they knew they'd get chewed out if they gave a good review and would of never gotten another if they gave their honest opinions on it. I remember ACG admitting to this on one game just over a year ago if i remember correctly.

[楊玄。杨玄。LangrisserWWE]

This is amusing as usual.

[Chibbix]

Originally posted by Pescado:

So, here we are, I finally completed the entire DLC with the final boss included. This said, I think Elden Ring is an incredible game brought down by bad bosses.

These bosses never feel satisfying to beat, neither do they feel like a challenge like those of Sekiro, Bloodborne or DS3. They aren't tests of skill, but rather of how fast you can memorise all their moveset... the cause? Delayed attacks and how unnaturally the bosses move.

This is the single worst thing about Elden Ring for me. Delayed attacks can be a good tool to catch the players off guard when they aren't paying attention, the dancer of the boreal valley is a great example of an incredible boss that uses an irregular rythm and delayed attacks to surprise the player.

But what happens when virtually every single combo of every single boss spams them? That you completely break the rythm of the fight.

Let's take Slave Knight Gael, a true last boss that tests all you have learned through DS3, however, he couldn't be more different from ER bosses. His combos are relatively short (between 3 and 6 attacks), with only one important delayed attack and very little AoE, as well as very telegraphed finishers with big gaps to hit back.

This is what makes a good boss, he has rythm. The entire fight is an epic back and forth, a dance of death where he desperately tries to kill you as you grit your teeth through his phases, dodging as you can and punishing him. Most importantly, you have more than enough time to strategise and heal in between combos, or punishing him with a combo.

Now let's take ER DLC bosses... not a single one has rythm, why? Every single attack is a cheesy delayed attack, every 3 attacks 1 is a crazy AoE, every combo is 20 seconds long so you just sit there with your thumb up your ass waiting for him to finish so you can poke him once. Oh, and let's not forget even after they finish their combos, if you as much as touch the estus button half the time they will instantly turn around halfway through their animation and hit you with another 20 hit combo.

And let's not forget how now every single boss has to zoom across the arena every single time he gets bored, meaning you can spend half the fight chasing a boss around as he spams his ''beyblade of death'' attack on you.

ER bosses (and specially those of the DLC) are clearly meant to be fought by 2 people, a summons and you, this sucks if you prefer to solo them and becomes incredibly obvious when even the most bassic attacks of the easiest DLC bosses have giant reach and cover 210º, hitting you even behind the boss.

This also messes completely with the balance up, with bosses doing ridiculous damage and having ridiculous healthpools (and don't you dare summon someone or it gets even worse).

So in the end these bosses aren't fun and don't feel rewarding. They are so grossly agressive and overpowered that after beating the last DLC boss I felt nothing, in fact I didn't feel anything with none of the DLC bosses, they felt like boring roadblocks rather than engaging fights. This is due to how lacking they are in Rythm.

Weirdly enough, even the DLC bosses were relatively simple to beat, with the last boss being the only one that took more than 10 tries, so I don't think difficulty is the issue. And I think these bosses wouldn't be bad if we had Bloodborne's rally mechanic and mobility.

This is so sad because everything else about the game (except the subpar soundtrack) is almost perfect, and it kinda sucks the bosses are so boring and gnerally bad. God bless.

Just beat DS3, like 90% completion.

Bosses were kind of really really easy as a caster. Few of the magic resistance ones gave me trouble. Playing through as a str build now and it's like a joke. Smogh's hammer just annihilates everything with ease, and I'm not using FP estus, so I rarely drop below 7 of them in any fight.

Can't say any of the bosses hold a candle to Commander Gaius, let alone the final boss.

Oh, also, I thought the final boss of the rings city was, like, the halfway point or something. Laughably easy. apparently both of my characters are "underlevel'd" for the dlc, too. They both level 79.