Do NOT approach the Shadow Keep!

[CJones]

This is some ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ game design. Whoever is responsible for this needs to be fired.

So it turns out a BUNCH of stuff in the game is permanently locked out if you approach the entrance of the Shadow Keep. LOTs of NPC quests are automatically failed if you haven't already finished them. You also lose out on the ability to summon Leda for the Rellana fight. Probably other stuff I don't know about.

You don't have to kill anyone, talk to anyone, or do ANYTHING more than just walk near the entrance of the Shadow Keep for this to happen.

This really makes me mad. There is NOTHING in the game to suggest you will be screwed out of a bunch of content just for going exploring. You don't even have to kill any bosses to get there.

This makes me want to just quit the DLC. Phenomenally stupid game design.

[m_train1]

Originally posted by Tr3m0r:

Originally posted by dragon15:

its fine if you didnt do your research you are supposed to be punished for it.
this game isnt a walk in the park like the witcher 3.

Huh? Actually people researching game walk through and spoilers is not something I'd use to argue against hand holding as it's exactly that. Its quite easy to understand people being upset with some of this as usually it's a matter of killing that prompts consequence, not exploration. The game encourages exploration and it has negative consequences not alluded to by anything. This has nothing to do with hand holding lol.

Research means in game research. Read item and gear description, listen to dialogue and take notes to remember. Absurd to think anyone means looking up walkthroughs.

[Armando Broncas]

Originally posted by dragon15:

its fine if you didnt do your research you are supposed to be punished for it.
this game isnt a walk in the park like the witcher 3.

This is peak sectarian speech.

[Armando Broncas]

Thanks for the heads up OP

[Armando Broncas]

Originally posted by Tr3m0r:

Originally posted by dragon15:

its fine if you didnt do your research you are supposed to be punished for it.
this game isnt a walk in the park like the witcher 3.

Huh? Actually people researching game walk through and spoilers is not something I'd use to argue against hand holding as it's exactly that. Its quite easy to understand people being upset with some of this as usually it's a matter of killing that prompts consequence, not exploration. The game encourages exploration and it has negative consequences not alluded to by anything. This has nothing to do with hand holding lol.

You know what is funny? doing "research" and finding info on the net is "hand holding" a long time ago it was considered cheating, this is why I said its peak sectarian speech, is completely devoid of reason.

[m_train1]

Originally posted by Armando Broncas:

Originally posted by Tr3m0r:

Huh? Actually people researching game walk through and spoilers is not something I'd use to argue against hand holding as it's exactly that. Its quite easy to understand people being upset with some of this as usually it's a matter of killing that prompts consequence, not exploration. The game encourages exploration and it has negative consequences not alluded to by anything. This has nothing to do with hand holding lol.

You know what is funny? doing "research" and finding info on the net is "hand holding" a long time ago it was considered cheating, this is why I said its peak sectarian speech, is completely devoid of reason.

It means research in game. Read item and gear description, listen to dialogue. No one is ever talking about looking it up online. That's just your insecurities and low self esteem talking.

[.]

It doesnt break ALL of the quests fake new, FJB!

[Zoid13]

didn't break anything for me i got that rune breaking message early on and still did all the quests...
i did miss some of the invasion parts of leda's quest because i just didn't see the runes on the floor in the castle but the quests continue anyway you just miss an item lol

the only thing that changes stuff is "burning a particular thing" much like "burning a particular thing" in the base game :P

started a new play-through. that's why from games are great. they don't care about you missing things or even whole zones. they expect it. and IMO its fantastic. keeps new runs fresh and can always find something new. (unless you look everything up and spoil it for yourself because ubisoft has trained you to need to know and get everything in 1 run lol)

other companies need to mark everything on the map and handhold you to every point in the game they spent money developing.

[Morton Koopa Jr.]

lol hadnt yet fought the lion. I couldn't get the redmane chick to help.
And I didn't even get it from going up to the keep; it triggered when I walked to the dead furnace golem.

That said, what is up with op?

[mpcgannon]

Originally posted by Rock:

It's not just the front of Shadow Keep. There is another path to the Shadow Keep which results into the same "event" happening.

I did that first. I was ELATED to realize what I stumbled upon. I'm pretty much here for the Legacy Dungeons and Shadow Keep is candy.

[mpcgannon]

Originally posted by CJones:

This is some ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ game design. Whoever is responsible for this needs to be fired.

So it turns out a BUNCH of stuff in the game is permanently locked out if you approach the entrance of the Shadow Keep. LOTs of NPC quests are automatically failed if you haven't already finished them. You also lose out on the ability to summon Leda for the Rellana fight. Probably other stuff I don't know about.

You don't have to kill anyone, talk to anyone, or do ANYTHING more than just walk near the entrance of the Shadow Keep for this to happen.

This really makes me mad. There is NOTHING in the game to suggest you will be screwed out of a bunch of content just for going exploring. You don't even have to kill any bosses to get there.

This makes me want to just quit the DLC. Phenomenally stupid game design.

This is actually nice. I thought this would be rage bait or complaints but this is a nice warning.

[Petrus Minor]

Originally posted by m_train1:

Originally posted by Armando Broncas:

You know what is funny? doing "research" and finding info on the net is "hand holding" a long time ago it was considered cheating, this is why I said its peak sectarian speech, is completely devoid of reason.

It means research in game. Read item and gear description, listen to dialogue. No one is ever talking about looking it up online. That's just your insecurities and low self esteem talking.

You went from "I doubt they're talking about Wikipedia" to "NO ONE is ever talking about Wikipedia" in the space of a couple comments.

Something triggered you in the interim, but that would have been obvious even without the dramatic shift in tone. It's always the triggered guys who launch into accusatory diatribes about "insecurities & low self esteem" at a moment's notice.

Anyway, nothing in SotE's dialogue -- much less its item & gear description, lol -- forewarned me that by simply approaching the Shadow Keep I would provoke a major event, the consequences of which I'd then have to research in order to make the best of my lack of omniscience.

Contrary to your (second) statement, defenders of FromSoft's purposeful ambiguity are nearly always referring to wiki-style homework when chastising complainers for their lack of hustle. & while I agree wholeheartedly that ambiguity makes for intriguing replays, I also sympathize with those who find it frustrating that so much is left to chance in a first playthrough.

[Halfalfasleep]

It should've happened after you fought the boar boss, but I don't think it breaks any quests if you just don't talk to them? You just miss dialogue.

[Virake]

not even Shadow Keep, I triggered this on the south road to the Cathedral of Manus Metyr.

[Morton Koopa Jr.]

lol when ppl necro threads just to try and prove someone wrong about something.