Fromsoft quest design is terrible

[Vipus]

I hate how easy it is to miss quests in this game. The damn map is gigantic and it's ridiculous that, by simply exploring, you can get cut off from important story bits that might finally flesh out the barely existent story and make the player give a ♥♥♥♥ about the characters, events and places of this world.

Even the actual maps you have access to have awful readability and do a terrible job at differentiating places with actual important stuff from those gigantic empty fields with absolutely nothing interesting on them.

Worst of all, you get a single save file for what was already an extremely long game (maybe even TOO long) that most people will only ever have the time to play through a single time.

It happened to me in the base game and now in the DLC. And, supposedly, this is one of the more interesting stories in the dlc. But now I'll have to watch it on youtube because I crossed a damn rope bridge.

It's like this game punishes you for not using a guide.

What terrible game design.

It's high time people stopped giving Fromsoft a pass for it with the excuse that "It's supposed to be quirky and convoluted. Why didn't you use a guide? xp".

[kl250d]

Buddy, we all know its ♥♥♥♥. Just collect it all the next playthrough, or ask someone if they can drop you the gear if they dont want it.

Nothing else can be done outside that

[Nukular Power]

i've had it personally with the "your own story" style of the souls series. I get it, Miyazaki grew up making up his own stories from D&D books, but now I'm ready to actually hear the story he made up instead of having to piece it together myself.

[Zoid13]

i don't find them terrible at all. quite the opposite i think they are amazing.

its more organic and on the player to explore and workout the clues and hints that get dropped both my environmental queues and the cryptic hint filled dialogue of the npc's

its also great for replay. you can find stuff you missed multiple throughways later.

people that say you need guides and whatnot to play from-soft games make me sad. what other developers do things like having an illusory wall behind an illusory wall that opens into a whole +1 or 2 zones and hours of content. every other developer has the mindset of "hey we spent X millions making these zones and quests, lets force the players to go do them in a way that's impossible to miss"
Fromsoft want you to miss things. they want your journey and discoveries to be unique and feel rewarding to work out what to do. they don't spoon feed you and im thankful for it.

i hate other games "greetings traveller! i need you to go collect X item from this man over there, let me mark him on your map so you cant possibly miss him!"
now that kind of quest system i find super lame and doesn't feel rewarding in the slightest.
huur duur i can follow a map icon to get loots im so clevers.
and if thats what you prefer to do. use an external guide. don't ruin the games with ubisoft cooties :)

Fromsoft design is king :D

[Alpharius]

Fromsoft does what fromsoft does. This is something you could've countered by doing your own research. This game has wikis, and thousands upon thousands of hours worth of videos that cover every possible aspect of this game. I recommend using them, they are a resource in your arsenal.

[kl250d]

Originally posted by Zoid13:

i don't find them terrible at all. quite the opposite i think they are amazing.

its more organic and on the player to explore and workout the clues and hints that get dropped both my environmental queues and the cryptic hint filled dialogue of the npc's

its also great for replay. you can find stuff you missed multiple throughways later.

people that say you need guides and whatnot to play from-soft games make me sad. what other developers do things like having an illusory wall behind an illusory wall that opens into a whole +1 or 2 zones and hours of content. every other developer has the mindset of "hey we spent X millions making these zones and quests, lets force the players to go do them in a way that's impossible to miss"
Fromsoft want you to miss things. they want your journey and discoveries to be unique and feel rewarding to work out what to do. they don't spoon feed you and im thankful for it.

i hate other games "greetings traveller! i need you to go collect X item from this man over there, let me mark him on your map so you cant possibly miss him!"
now that kind of quest system i find super lame and doesn't feel rewarding in the slightest.
huur duur i can follow a map icon to get loots im so clevers.
and if thats what you prefer to do. use an external guide. don't ruin the games with ubisoft cooties :)

Fromsoft design is king :D

Mate there's like 6 lines of dialogue per npc its not really that great at all. I wouldnt be surprised if you could fit all voiced lines in the dlc on a piece of A4 paper, not sure if it needs to be double sided or not

[Haru]

I rarely miss the quests or quest progress, and when I do, it's incentive to ask other people about the experience or experience it on another play through. These games are not inherently designed to expect you to do absolutely everything.

[Mad Engineer Kikoumaru]

It's not perfect, but between this and Bethesda's "Quest marker to exactly where you need to go", I choose this.

[RinzlerRules91]

Your right about level size and NPC quests it needs to stop, they need better endings to.

[DarkFenix]

This isn't that kind of game. It's not an RPG where you're expected to clean all the random chores out of your quest log before progressing.

[BingusDingus]

Originally posted by DarkFenix:

This isn't that kind of game. It's not an RPG where you're expected to clean all the random chores out of your quest log before progressing.

You kind of are if you want to even access the DLC. Got to start the Ranni questline to even access Radahn and to access that questline you have to stumble upon Blaidd and hope you're lucky enough to travel back to kale at some point to get the emote for contacting him.

[Zoid13]

Originally posted by BingusDingus:

Originally posted by DarkFenix:

This isn't that kind of game. It's not an RPG where you're expected to clean all the random chores out of your quest log before progressing.

You kind of are if you want to even access the DLC. Got to start the Ranni questline to even access Radahn and to access that questline you have to stumble upon Blaidd and hope you're lucky enough to travel back to kale at some point to get the emote for contacting him.

and youd be wrong. you dont need to do Rannis quest at all to get the Radahn Festival. you can trigger the festival just by finding the 2 lift of dectus halves and activating the lift.

[BingusDingus]

Originally posted by Zoid13:

Originally posted by BingusDingus:

You kind of are if you want to even access the DLC. Got to start the Ranni questline to even access Radahn and to access that questline you have to stumble upon Blaidd and hope you're lucky enough to travel back to kale at some point to get the emote for contacting him.

and youd be wrong. you dont need to do Rannis quest at all to get the Radahn Festival. you can trigger the festival just by finding the 2 lift of dectus halves and activating the lift.

Yeah, if you want to wait until you're halfway through the game and massively overleveled for the fight.

[Rain]

Originally posted by BingusDingus:

Originally posted by Zoid13:

and youd be wrong. you dont need to do Rannis quest at all to get the Radahn Festival. you can trigger the festival just by finding the 2 lift of dectus halves and activating the lift.

Yeah, if you want to wait until you're halfway through the game and massively overleveled for the fight.

You can also go to Hogwarts, go down the elevator to the Iron Maiden, get teleported to Volcano Manor, do an easy af Boss. Then you're in Altus and festival is triggered and Radahn is there. Doable on a RL1 character

[BingusDingus]

Originally posted by Rain:

Originally posted by BingusDingus:

Yeah, if you want to wait until you're halfway through the game and massively overleveled for the fight.

You can also go to Hogwarts, go down the elevator to the Iron Maiden, get teleported to Volcano Manor, do an easy af Boss. Then you're in Altus and festival is triggered and Radahn is there. Doable on a RL1 character

Wouldn't say they're easy asf. Only really easy if you're using a fast weapon and using a lightning infusion, but even then since there's 2 of them you'll get ganked.

[Rain]

Originally posted by BingusDingus:

Originally posted by Rain:

You can also go to Hogwarts, go down the elevator to the Iron Maiden, get teleported to Volcano Manor, do an easy af Boss. Then you're in Altus and festival is triggered and Radahn is there. Doable on a RL1 character

Wouldn't say they're easy asf. Only really easy if you're using a fast weapon and using a lightning infusion, but even then since there's 2 of them you'll get ganked.

You do know that Fromsoft nerfed gank AI to the ground to a point where it's basically you fighting 1v1 and everyone around you is just looking at you beating up their ass? Please, there is not a real gank fight in that game anymore.