Ringed City DLC is better

[Joeycentral]

As someone who loved the ♥♥♥♥ out of Elden Ring and played the game constantly for a year and a half, I am slightly disappointed with the DLC. No, it isn't because it is too difficult. I beat all the main game's bosses no hit with just about every build you can think of without summons including Malenia. Hell even the artificial difficulty like the ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ camera angle in boss fights like Golden Hippo and Dancing Lion or the true combo ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ in the final boss fight I can forgive.

What I hate is the exploration. It's almost as if you absolutely need guides in order to not wander around for many hours like an idiot wondeirng where you have to go to find the next boss.

I beat the final boss of the DLC, yet I left 50% of the other bosses alive because these areas require extensive exploration. Sorry, but I dont want to spend many hours exploring and going back to previous dungeons just to find out that I missed one little turn that leads to an elevator that takes you down to another area, or you have to collect an emoji in a random location and you use that emoji to unlock another secret area. How the ♥♥♥♥ are you going to know that without using guides?

Ringed City did not have this problem. It was linear, areas were fun to explore, and boss designs were soo much better especially Slave Knight Gael compared to the sorry excuse of a second phase this final boss has. It's not even a contest when it comes to whether The Ringed City is better than SOTE and that comes from someone who considered Elden Ring better than DS3.

[hemorrhage911]

Originally posted by JocularJosh:

Originally posted by hemorrhage911:

I'm sorry, is there suddenly going to be new content added in to fix the core problems of this DLC?

We're not talking about some broken weapon that needs nerfed.

No, but people who actually spent some time in the DLC and try to understand it fully will start to pump out their reviews which will, most likely, majorily be positive.

That'S what happens with every new game nowadays. People who are upset over something will immediately write a negative review while most other people are still enjoying the content before they pump out their positive reviews.

It's no rocket science, really. The "core" issue, according to most negative reviews, seems to be the difficulty which they already adressed with a patch and is definitely user-error since most people didn't even TRY to explore and use the new items that have specifically been designed as your level up system for the DLC.

Maybe these same players explore the DLC more and then find the near empty areas or the fact that the loot they missed is just another stupid stone and string and realize it was even worse than they initially thought and the problems go beyond difficulty....

This DLC is concentrated snowfields expanded. What is generally considered the worst part of the base game is now a $40 DLC.

[JocularJosh]

Originally posted by hemorrhage911:

I specifically addressed the claim that it's getting mixed reviewss because of casual players. It was the same for Dark Souls 3, they didn't get these reviews lol It was generally considered tough but fair by even casuals. It was a mostly positive review game. There were more NEW players that hopped into Dark Souls 3 than there were that bought previous Souls games. that's the jump.

And even then going from 100k to 1 milion players is an even bigger jump.
that is around 10 times the players on PC alone, not even with consoles in mind which usually attract even more people.

You can NOT compare these stats. You just can't.

Also have you EVER checked the reviews for any Dark Souls DLC? They don't even come close to the amount of reviews this DLC has already and a lot of people are still playing it.
Hell, look at ashes of ariandel for DS3. It has MIXED reviews with people calling it too short and just too little in general.

Originally posted by hemorrhage911:

And even still, Elden Ring base game which tripled the size didn't get mixed reviews, it got mostly positive. Those same players are now saying, the base game was great....this DLC feels so hard it's unfair.

Exactly my point. Every DLC has been known to be harder than the base game.
The base game was already pretty rough for most casuals but spirit ashes saved them.
The DLC topped that. And on top of the higher difficulty you now have a different way to level which most people didnt even bother to look into at first.

[JocularJosh]

Originally posted by hemorrhage911:

Originally posted by JocularJosh:

No, but people who actually spent some time in the DLC and try to understand it fully will start to pump out their reviews which will, most likely, majorily be positive.

That'S what happens with every new game nowadays. People who are upset over something will immediately write a negative review while most other people are still enjoying the content before they pump out their positive reviews.

It's no rocket science, really. The "core" issue, according to most negative reviews, seems to be the difficulty which they already adressed with a patch and is definitely user-error since most people didn't even TRY to explore and use the new items that have specifically been designed as your level up system for the DLC.

Maybe these same players explore the DLC more and then find the near empty areas or the fact that the loot they missed is just another stupid stone and string and realize it was even worse than they initially thought and the problems go beyond difficulty....

This DLC is concentrated snowfields expanded. What is generally considered the worst part of the base game is now a $40 DLC.

Again, very subjective take.
The base game already was considered "empty".
The vast majority of items you can find are pretty much useless.

And that's precisely what people like me love. I explored because I wanted to see the world, not because I thought I'd find some top-tier item.

[Haru]

Minus some technical issues, the DLC difficulty is perfectly fine.

[JocularJosh]

This whole conversation is hilarious considering Ashes of Ariandel has a lower review score than SotE lol

That fact alone literally destroys your entire point.

[Trash Panda]

Originally posted by hemorrhage911:

Originally posted by Porcelain:

Ringed City reused a ton of assets from the base game. They even reused the Dragonslayer Armor boss fight, like this isn't a new occurrence and the people who defecate on Elden Ring for reusing assets completely ignore Ringed City's same issue.

They reused Dragonslayer Armor...once. And that was to get you his armor.

The idea that this equivalent to multiple ulcerated tree spirits and magma wyrms is you reaching. Just stop.

And im gonna quote you "THERES A LORE REASON FOR IT!" Whew thats all you need to end that debate so thats all im gonna use. Didn't read the rest.

[Joeycentral]

Originally posted by Trash Panda:

Originally posted by MɾSɾ3ɳιƚყ_97:

Dark Souls 3 just did it best first....unique bosses in the base game, great boss fights. ELDEN RING base game, a lot of re-skinned bosses, overly used, Boring.....

ER DLC did give us some new decent bosses but most of them are still pretty bad not gonna lie, they don't comapre to DS3 by a mile....

As somsone that loved DS 3....Elden Ring is better. I played DS 3 like a cracked out cocaine addict. I played that game even more when the DLC dropped, it is a great game, but Elden Ring does what DS 3 tried to do, but did it better and made it more widely accessible to a greater audience of players.

The only original fights in all of DS are Sister Freyja and her Dad, Gale and the Twin Princes, base game is good, but boring. Most weapons are bad or have extremely boring move sets. The Pvp meta was like 8 builds and most of them were "use fire" or "play with the op katana" or "straight sword meta broken hacks".

As far as challenge? Midir was fun, Gale was hard, Nameless King and Dancer was neat. Everything else is just meh. Every boss or damn near every boss is beyond parriable, stunable and extremely susceptible to FIRE. It's exploration was just a better version of DS 1 and 90% of the secrets were hidden behind a bad secret door or wall or you rolled slightly askew off an elevator and landed on a platform.

The DLC? EVERYONE ran past everything until you got to an elevator, a door or a bonfire. Very few times did i fight through the mobs because it was fun. Ringed City as a whole was great, but compared to SOTE or BB its lackluster. It's got a great final boss, beautiful settings, but a ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ tier last boss (like all souls games besides BB), basic linear exploration, every area has 1. its own knight with a twist 2. <Insert salamander here> but it does X different thing 3. A mob that grabs you or pushes you and 4. Some overt big enemy that moves far too fast or hits too hard. Sometiems its the same NPC but slightly different. The Quests were basic and bad and even MORE obscure then ER's are by ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ MILES.

Elden Ring is just improved DS 3 that is vastly more succesful (this is just fact based on copies sold and average review), widely more played by a larger group of people, more accessible and a far greater weapon/skill/AOw variety to play with on top of a decent open world experience, beautiful setting design and an interesting story.

Can you explain why you think SOTE is better than Ringed City?

[hemorrhage911]

Originally posted by JocularJosh:

Originally posted by hemorrhage911:

I specifically addressed the claim that it's getting mixed reviewss because of casual players. It was the same for Dark Souls 3, they didn't get these reviews lol It was generally considered tough but fair by even casuals. It was a mostly positive review game. There were more NEW players that hopped into Dark Souls 3 than there were that bought previous Souls games. that's the jump.

And even then going from 100k to 1 milion players is an even bigger jump.
that is around 10 times the players on PC alone, not even with consoles in mind which usually attract even more people.

You can NOT compare these stats. You just can't.

Also have you EVER checked the reviews for any Dark Souls DLC? They don't even come close to the amount of reviews this DLC has already and a lot of people are still playing it.
Hell, look at ashes of ariandel for DS3. It has MIXED reviews with people calling it too short and just too little in general.

Originally posted by hemorrhage911:

And even still, Elden Ring base game which tripled the size didn't get mixed reviews, it got mostly positive. Those same players are now saying, the base game was great....this DLC feels so hard it's unfair.

Exactly my point. Every DLC has been known to be harder than the base game.
The base game was already pretty rough for most casuals but spirit ashes saved them.
The DLC topped that. And on top of the higher difficulty you now have a different way to level which most people didnt even bother to look into at first.

Dark Souls 3 sold 8 million before it jumped to 10 million the past couple years. Dark Souls 1 and 2 sold around the same. It was a pretty big jump and, again, new players didn't bomb the reviews.

And yes you can compare - Souls games have ALWAYS been known for it's difficulty. Yet casual players/new players embraced these games and reviewed them well.

There are fundamental design problems that many feel the bosses have in the DLC that is making the difficulty feel unfair. Some complained about this in the base game and many now feel like that with the DLC.

There are problems that won't be able to get fixed in the DLC unless they go in and rework bosses and add in new content. The most they are going to do is nerf health and power of some bosses, but that doesn't change the issue with their design.

[Richard]

Slave Knight Gael
was the only good boss in that dlc

[SoulSlayer]

Originally posted by JocularJosh:

Originally posted by hemorrhage911:

This is the first DLC where I'm seeing fans this divided on if it's even on par with the base game let alone if it's the best DLC or not.

That's because ER is their most successful game yet that attracted A LOT of casual gamers to the mix.

Pretty much every DLC they made, so far, has been harder than the base game so FromSoft veterans expected as much from this DLC. The casual gamer didn't. Hence so many people complaining around here.

There was always someone complaining when a new DLC dropped. Every single DS2 DLC had people whining and calling it trash, the only difference to ER being that SotET is already WAY more popular than even DS2 itself.

ER is also majority of players first souls like game.

[YosemiteBear]

Originally posted by Joeycentral:

Originally posted by juicy:

it's not when you realize you can literally run through the ringed city dlc not killing anything.


On top of the ringed city also having only 3 worthwhile bosses and 1 garbage gimmick pvp boss

Those 3 bosses are literally better than just about every single boss in this game's DLC. Quality > Quantity.

now thats cope. do you have access to the biggest copium mine if so can i have access to it.

[hemorrhage911]

Originally posted by JocularJosh:

This whole conversation is hilarious considering Ashes of Ariandel has a lower review score than SotE lol

That fact alone literally destroys your entire point.

Ashes of Ariandel is criticized for it's length, not for it's design or it's content. It's a legitimate criticism. Many felt it was overpriced for being so short.

It's not criticized as much anymore because you can get it bundled and it's connection to the ringed city.

[hemorrhage911]

Originally posted by SoulSlayer:

Originally posted by JocularJosh:

That's because ER is their most successful game yet that attracted A LOT of casual gamers to the mix.

Pretty much every DLC they made, so far, has been harder than the base game so FromSoft veterans expected as much from this DLC. The casual gamer didn't. Hence so many people complaining around here.

There was always someone complaining when a new DLC dropped. Every single DS2 DLC had people whining and calling it trash, the only difference to ER being that SotET is already WAY more popular than even DS2 itself.

ER is also majority of players first souls like game.

Yet the base game didn't get review bombed....

Wonder why that is.

[Joeycentral]

Originally posted by YosemiteBear:

Originally posted by Joeycentral:

Those 3 bosses are literally better than just about every single boss in this game's DLC. Quality > Quantity.

now thats cope. do you have access to the biggest copium mine if so can i have access to it.

Can you name me some bosses aside from Messmer that are comparable to the bosses in the Ringed City DLC?

[JocularJosh]

Originally posted by hemorrhage911:

Dark Souls 3 sold 8 million before it jumped to 10 million the past couple years. Dark Souls 1 and 2 sold around the same. It was a pretty big jump and, again, new players didn't bomb the reviews. .

I didnt deny that it was a big jump, I simply stated that it's not comparable to the jump ER brought to the table.
Even the DLC alone already sold more than 5 milion copies in less than one week. That is already half of what DS3, the base game, sold altogether in its lifetime.

As for reviews you are talking about the base game now. Both games have a very positive rating with ER having WAY more reviews altogether.
As for DLCs, as I already stated Ashes or Ariandel is actually worse reviewed than SotE.
Not much to say there since you didn't adress that.

Originally posted by hemorrhage911:

And yes you can compare - Souls games have ALWAYS been known for it's difficulty. Yet casual players/new players embraced these games and reviewed them well.

Because ER is their easiest game yet.
The DLC ranks up the difficulty by a lot and on top of that has a new leveling system that most people seemed to have ignored for some reason.
Something I, once again, already explained to you.
There is a reason I disect your comments the way I do. That way I can respond to everything you say. Unlike you.

Originally posted by hemorrhage911:

There are fundamental design problems that many feel the bosses have in the DLC that is making the difficulty feel unfair. Some complained about this in the base game and many now feel like that with the DLC.

Subjective.
Lots of people don't complain about it.
I'd even go as far as saying the vast majority of people don't complain about it and that is the reason why the ratings for the DLC are going up as more time passes.

Look at the reviews of Ashes of Ariandel. Go ahead. Amuse me.

Originally posted by hemorrhage911:

There are problems that won't be able to get fixed in the DLC unless they go in and rework bosses and add in new content. The most they are going to do is nerf health and power of some bosses, but that doesn't change the issue with their design.

Again, subjective.