What's wrong with using Spirit Summons?

[Bigboss PC Faster]

?

[Nihrahk]

Nothing wrong with them. Play the game however the hell you want.

[Truth Bringer]

引用自 Rust Vendor：

引用自 Truth Bringer：

It depends what you want from the game.

1.If you want to just have the game be as easy as possible nothing. There is nothing wrong with it.

2.If you want to play the way our lord and savor miyazaki intended it then the point of the game is to learn to overcome your struggles so you can be stronger and plant seeds for others who haven't reached your ability then you have to earn this. This shows them they can if they want to do it as well.

3. If you just want to challenge yourself then yes it cheapens the game.

4. If you just want to be goofy and weird and not care then don't care.

Took me a minute to get over the nausea after this cringe, but Miyazaki uses summons, he literally said so just a few days ago. You people are psychotic and live in a fantasy world of your own making.

i didn't miyazaki has also said what i said. You know he can use summons and mean what he said. Maybe he just felt like using summons even people who can beat the game at level 1 or with no deaths or anything still use summons sometimes for the fun of it.

[YUREKA]

Miyazaki said he uses every scrap of aid in the game to complete it. Play the game the way you like.

[Autoro]

引用自 Truth Bringer：

引用自 Rust Vendor：

Took me a minute to get over the nausea after this cringe, but Miyazaki uses summons, he literally said so just a few days ago. You people are psychotic and live in a fantasy world of your own making.

i didn't miyazaki has also said what i said. You know he can use summons and mean what he said. Maybe he just felt like using summons even people who can beat the game at level 1 or with no deaths or anything still use summons sometimes for the fun of it.

You kinda missed the forest for the trees, there... Point of the statement is if Miyazaki is using all these mechanics in his own time with the game, and then going on to say that the series is about "Overcoming difficult trials"... Ever consider that he is including the mechanics he himself uses as means to overcome said trials?

Because that is my takeaway from him saying ER, and DS are about overcoming difficult situations and succeeding, while still using spirit ashes, scadutree fragments, magic, etc, etc, etc... Like it's okay to ask for help, or to use all available tools to beat the game, eh?

[Haru]

I think discussing the legitimacy of tools or features within the game is just plain silly and a waste of breath.

Discussing the implementation of those tools and whether or not they're good or bad is always a good thing though. I can provide plenty of reasons for why I think spirit ashes are pretty poorly implemented.

But that has no bearing on whether or not people should or shouldn't use them. It's a game.

[WingZero]

I noticed that the bosses are focusing less on the sumons and more on the main player

[Kawalorn]

引用自 Red：

引用自 Loopy：

So much delicious summoner cope in this thread. It's okay to admit you're average at the game. Relax.

what is even the point in this statement? The game is a piece of entertainment...average, bad, good?

Unless you are the top 1% making an income off streaming challenge runs no one cares how good you are

The point of this statement is that people who use Ashes are so vitriolic towards people who don't because they hate being pointed out that Ashes are an easy mode. People forbidding others from using Ashes is a myth made up by Ash users who are mad at those who don't.

[Bert Bertsson]

https://www.eurogamer.net/dont-worry-even-miyazaki-struggled-with-elden-rings-high-difficulty

"I want to preface this by saying I absolutely suck at video games, so my approach or play style was to use everything I have at my disposal, all the assistance, every scrap of aid that the game offers, and also all the knowledge that I have as the architect of the game ... the freedom and open-world nature of Elden Ring perhaps lowered the barrier to entry, and I might be the one who's benefiting the most from that, as a player, more than anyone else."

Miyazaki uses spirit summons himself.

Play the game how you want to play it. As long as you are having fun ignore all the people who are salty you didnt play a game to a set of limitations they set on themselves.

[Kawalorn]

引用自 Dusty13B：

引用自 Loopy：

Nothing, it just significantly reduces the fun in the game as bosses were not designed for summoning. It's a tool for help for people who cannot do it alone. That's okay, but it's not the integral crucial mechanic the summoners pretend it is. Bosses were always meant to be fought 1v1, it's THE trademark of a FS game.

Bayle wasn't intended to be fought 1v1. If you did, you missed out on some of the best VA in any souls game.

Bayle is inteded to be fought 1v1. I got one of the hardest bosses down to quarter health on my first try when I summoned Igon just to hear if he had any cool dialogue. Bayle payed almost no attention to me the entire fight. Things like that shouldn't happen.

[Truth Bringer]

引用自 Autoro：

引用自 Truth Bringer：

i didn't miyazaki has also said what i said. You know he can use summons and mean what he said. Maybe he just felt like using summons even people who can beat the game at level 1 or with no deaths or anything still use summons sometimes for the fun of it.

You kinda missed the forest for the trees, there... Point of the statement is if Miyazaki is using all these mechanics in his own time with the game, and then going on to say that the series is about "Overcoming difficult trials"... Ever consider that he is including the mechanics he himself uses as means to overcome said trials?

Because that is my takeaway from him saying ER, and DS are about overcoming difficult situations and succeeding, while still using spirit ashes, scadutree fragments, magic, etc, etc, etc... Like it's okay to ask for help, or to use all available tools to beat the game, eh?

Listen i think you have it wrong i dont really give two ♥♥♥♥♥ about what someone else does in their game. I agree with you as long as they are challenging themselves and they are actually putting in effort to do their best then who cares? It is the spirit of the game. The only people i have ever and will continue to tell to git gud are the people who don't put in any effort and then cry about it on the forums and wants the game changed not out of balance or improvements but out of laziness and being entitled.

If those people think elden ring isn't casual enough for them then they should go find another game because this game is clearly not for them. If they can't be bothered to either get one of the hundreds of one shot builds, have ashes, DO something when they summon a player or npc and not let them just beat it for them, and use the weaknesses of the bosses then i have 0 pitty for them. none and i am tired of pretending like i care about them, their feelings. and their opinions honestly.

Just to be clear this is only when they don't do any of that and complain or ask for changes

[Ichi-niiPL]

I've not used any summons but i'm starting to consider using one just to be done with that damn Radahn fight XD

[Haru]

引用自 Ichi-niiPL：

I've not used any summons but i'm starting to consider using one just to be done with that damn Radahn fight XD

Had a similar experience, haha. I watched him massacre some ashes for fun, and to be honest they do not offer much help in this fight. Would suggest an accurate ranged spirit summon if anyone is going to use them.

NPCs spend more time running after him than actually hitting him. It's funny to watch.

In the end, I adapted my play style, without having to alter my build. Got him within an hour.

[Kandidaten]

引用自 Kawalorn：

引用自 Red：

what is even the point in this statement? The game is a piece of entertainment...average, bad, good?

Unless you are the top 1% making an income off streaming challenge runs no one cares how good you are

The point of this statement is that people who use Ashes are so vitriolic towards people who don't because they hate being pointed out that Ashes are an easy mode. People forbidding others from using Ashes is a myth made up by Ash users who are mad at those who don't.

But you wouldn't play other games without using the game mechanics most likely? I don't get why this one is so divided. Of course it is harder if you don't use what the game gives you. Why not have no Crimson Tear flasks, or physick, the game gets harder then, too.

[EF_Neo1st]

引用自 Kandidaten：

引用自 Kawalorn：

The point of this statement is that people who use Ashes are so vitriolic towards people who don't because they hate being pointed out that Ashes are an easy mode. People forbidding others from using Ashes is a myth made up by Ash users who are mad at those who don't.

But you wouldn't play other games without using the game mechanics most likely? I don't get why this one is so divided. Of course it is harder if you don't use what the game gives you. Why not have no Crimson Tear flasks, or physick, the game gets harder then, too.

It is more a demonization of those who say spirit ashes are easy mode (because it is, it breaks the enemies and bosses AI as these are not made to handle more than 1 single target) and mimic being the most broken of them all as the player can combine an OP build with the mimic tankyness while not needed to even try to engage the fight as the mimic can deal with it entirely or at least for the mosst part.
Still, "at least a good part" (myself included) are not against those who use spirit ashes as much as not being against those who ask for help at the forum or just summon someone randomly ingame, what "at least good part" (myself included) say is that it is easy mode, because it is and easier than any OP build (that also makes the game easier too) because of breaking the enemies and bosses AI leaving a lot more openings and mostlly free openings to attack, heal or even just to learn the boss in case the spirit aash dies fast, at least some time to watch the boss attack from another angle to understand it better and easier in a way that would be impossible to watch if it was just the player and the boss.
What "at least a good part" (myself included) dont agree is with those who say the game is easy, or "certain boss was easy" when those played with spirit ash or even summoning 1 or 2 players for help, it "sure was easy because that player played on easy mode" and is the same thing as if the game had difficulty settings menu and that player selected easy mode (those that get help from players and brag about beating it solo are the worst, they dont even give credit to the other player or the other 2 players that helped when they brag about beating the boss easy or beating solo when they did not).

[Nemerlight]

Use summons but tell people you did it solo like everyone else in here