Is it just me or are the bosses just not fun?

[MorinehtarTheBlue]

I've mulling over this question as Messmer continues to impale me over and over again, and I've come to the conclusion that I don't think I've actually had a fun experience with the bosses in this DLC. I like the DLC overall, the world aesthetic is good, the level design is brilliant and I like what I've seen so far of the new lore.

The bosses though just feel... like work? I don't quite know how to put it into words, but they seem designed to be hard in the most irritating way possible. I have not yet faced a boss that wasn't a stamina blender, either slashing away with a weapon barely fast enough for the eye to follow or charging around the room with massive hitboxes sending my camera into hysterics.

The DLC appears to double down on the worst aspects of the late game boss design of the base game, lots of AoE attacks, grabs that do massive amounts of damage, overly chunky boss healthbars, barely any downtime between attacks etc etc. It leads to fights that feel less like a challenge and more like a chore, I don't *want* to best Messmer the way i did Radhan or Godfrey, I more just want to get past him to continue playing the parts of the DLC I actually enjoy.

It especially doesn't help that From apparently dug out the unreleased Sekiro DLC notes as the basis for this DLC, as every man sized boss now zips around the arena like lady butterfly and fights devolve into streams of flashing colours, random damage and FPS drops. I like Sekiro and really enjoyed playing it, but it worked because it was an action game with specific mechanics based around deflection and posture.

That game design here upends any pretence ER had of being an RPG, as you're basically screwed unless you play the game the way the boss designer intended... even though that's not the point of an RPG and wasn't an issue in the base game until very very late the day.

As you can probably tell from the comment I'm disappointed in the DLC, and hope From can learn from the reaction to SoE when designing future games. I am though genuinely interested in other people's experiences in SoE, do you agree with me about the bosses or did you find them challenging in genuinely interesting ways?

[Capt_Lycanthro]

I mean like every From game, and especially the DLCs it only feels that way until it clicks. And, then you get so into it by the time the next one comes around you've forgotten how painful it was.

[Casul Gamer]

I agree. I'm not a fan of the DLC bosses and also some of the normal enemies who has insane amounts of poise, damage, and health. Also crazy AoEs and multihit combos

I've come to realize that different people have different tolerances for difficulty. Some of it comes down to skill level, but this isn't the only factor. One guy was saying he loved the DLC and talked about how he spent 2 hours on one boss and it was a great experience for him.

[Mike]

I have been liking the DLC bosses much more then some of the bosses in the base game. My opinion overall is the opposite where I like the DLC much more then the base game.

To each their own I guess.

[Flying Fish]

For work you get paid

While we pay for getting to fight bosses

It's more like self torture for no reason you gain nothing from it and struggle for no reason

A bit like life rly

[BingusDingus]

Only boss I enjoyed was Midra, rest just feel overly spammy and gimmicky.

[Dimosa]

I can steam roll through the entire DLC, except for the bosses. I never feel like "Ow i just missed a attack or dodge here or there" It is always the relentless aggression, dodging for twenty minutes to get a single hit in, that does little to no damage, and the boss taking off 1/3 of your hp bar. Good boss design is not turning them into bullet hell bosses, it takes skill to make a good and challenging boss, and to me it feels like in DS3 and Elden Ring they just turn the speed and aggression to 11 and call it a day. This worked great for Sekiro, due to its design. Not that good for DS3, and even worse for ER.

[MorinehtarTheBlue]

Originally posted by Capt_Lycanthro:

I mean like every From game, and especially the DLCs it only feels that way until it clicks. And, then you get so into it by the time the next one comes around you've forgotten how painful it was.

See I've had that happen to me before, but usually its after I've finished the fight and am cooling off. This time it hasn't happened for any of the fights I've completed (Rellana, Putrid Knight, Dancing Lion etc.) and I don't think it will happen in the future.

Regardless, thank you for your comment

[BKo]

Messmer is one of the few fun ones, so you must be having a really bad time. He has a lot of openings compared to the others, I've found.

[MorinehtarTheBlue]

Originally posted by Dimosa:

I can steam roll through the entire DLC, except for the bosses. I never feel like "Ow i just missed a attack or dodge here or there" It is always the relentless aggression, dodging for twenty minutes to get a single hit in, that does little to no damage, and the boss taking off 1/3 of your hp bar. Good boss design is not turning them into bullet hell bosses, it takes skill to make a good and challenging boss, and to me it feels like in DS3 and Elden Ring they just turn the speed and aggression to 11 and call it a day. This worked great for Sekiro, due to its design. Not that good for DS3, and even worse for ER.

Honestly I agree here, the rot for me really set in around DS3 and *especially* the ringed city. I think base Elden Ring does a good job with boss balance until fire giant though, which is why I'm a bit shocked its got this bad in the DLC. It must have been a purposeful decision

[Punkin Spice]

Yeah, honestly, "I just want this to be over with" is not really a good feeling and makes me a little sad. The bosses feel like they felt obliged to have some high standard of difficulty but didn't really execute it in a way that feels meaningful.

On the plus side, I feel like its all fixable without massively changing anything. A few small tweaks here and there would really improve these fights imo

[DeuceBane]

There were 2 bosses I didnt enjoy, but I reaaaly didnt enjoy them. Pretty much everythig I thought was pretty sick ngl

[Ω Arkandor]

The final boss is one of the most unfun experiences i have ever had in a videogame. I just genuinely want to know what the absolute idiot that made his second phase was thinking. It feels like im playing a modded game.

[Gienah Corvi]

Do yourself a favor if you want to beat it:

All Revered Spirit Ash locations:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iQMHzBdTHAc

All Scadutree Fragment locations:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7bxxM3wBsrQ

All map locations:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=owKtKoKHlUk

Spent the day doing that. Then killed Gaius, Mesmer and Bayle thrice in a row. Then mopped up Romina's pitiful self.

+9 Revered Spirit Ash Mimic decimates.

[Taddy Mason]

yeah, i hope they go back to their roots of "tough but fair" boss fights and stop going down this road of 4-7 hit combos with a tiny window to get a hit in before you're back to dodging/blocking/running from attacks for the next 10-20 seconds in the hopes you don't get 1 shot by the boss.

the fights used to be more of a back and forth-almost like a dance between you and the boss or other enemies. those days feel long gone and it's more "wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, ok strike, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, ok strike, wait, wait, wait."

[Chris1]

The problem is all the bosses use all the same mechanics. Wide AoE attacks, hyper aggression, arena filling attacks, zooming across the entire arena to smack you in the face with multi-hit combos. It's all the same.

To top it all off, most of them have the same "second phase one shot arena filling death move", so even if you pass part 1, now you have to bash your head against the wall with this phase-2 only special attack which requires just the right timing to dodge.

Lots of players seem to enjoy this sort of "challenge" but if you don't it is going to feel like work, and you aren't wrong for being on either side of this argument.