What is the most nerfed weapon/spell/ash in PvE?

[CazadorDeLobo]

Before Fromsoftware invented the idea of separating balance of PvP from PvE, they were dispensing nerfs of the highest caliber onto the most cried-about tools at a single-players disposal, because communism or something along those lines. I don't mean to be divisive but that's literally what happened.

What have you tried playing with lately that is just utterly pointless? For me, it's dual-wielding, curved swords, bleed, great hammers, and any build that isn't Cold or Heavy affinity.

Also, all fire damage is weak AF. What happened there?

[mpcgannon]

Hoarfrost stomp is more like virginfrost stomp

[CazadorDeLobo]

Originally posted by mpcgannon:

Hoarfrost stomp is more like virginfrost stomp

ayyyy

[An Irate Walrus]

Rivers urf Bluurd.

[CazadorDeLobo]

Originally posted by An Irate Walrus:

Rivers urf Bluurd.

I never got to use it pre-nerf, and when I did get to it, it's just double-slash with that one Ninjutsu from Sekiro applied. I can imagine people spamming this and then quickstepping out of its reach. That it was nerfed across the board is unbelievable, and that they didn't revert PvE nerfs after separating the two is plain amateur. I demand the brokenness that it was, and unnerfed bosses.

[DayLight1943]

the most dramatic nerf i can think of is sword of night and flame. most things that have been nerfed are still totally usable in both pve and pvp. sword of night and flame is a big exception to this. stuff that got nerfed like powerstancing, bleed, or rivers of blood are still totally usable and super strong in pve, the nerf was totally fine. the only reason a player might feel the need to avoid these things are if they only want to play with the absolute strongest, most OP and most meta setups, which is totally fine, but most people dont approach buildmaking in that way, especially not for solo pve.

the funny thing about sword of night and flame is, it really wasnt super strong in pvp. it was relatively easy to dodge, and while it did lots of damage, so do a million other weapon arts. nobody was complaining about it or asking for a nerf - fromsoft nerfed it because it was obviously one of the strongest weapons in pve and it was the top choice for speedruns at launch. this holds true for hoarfrost stomp as well. not praticularly strong or complained about in pvp, and was nerfed because it was a top choice for cheesing pve. a third great example of this is flame of the redmanes - nerfed specifically because it was used to cheese pve. nobody complained about it in pvp, it wasnt to strong in pvp, and in fact the nerf made it useless in pvp and people now complain that its useless in pvp AND pve. nerfed 100% for the sake of single player pve, period.

its also of note that many of the "pvp focused" nerfs were reversed or lessened in pve when the separate pvp scaling was introduced, and you can only assume that the nerfs that were left alone are how fromsoft wants the game for the sake of pve and is not a concession for the sake of pvp.

and on top of that, each major patch has continued to implement nerfs and balance changes that effect pve, despite the existence of separate pvp balancing. in fact, the list of changes that apply to both pve and pvp is usually significantly longer than the list of pvp exclusive changes.

[CazadorDeLobo]

Originally posted by DayLight1943:

in fact, the list of changes that apply to both pve and pvp is usually significantly longer than the list of pvp exclusive changes.

Well-written comment. To this specific part, I will levy the criticism that they do not interact with the community on a level that could possibly ever make PvP balance and patches for the sake thereof viable.

[DayLight1943]

Originally posted by CazadorDeLobo:

Originally posted by An Irate Walrus:

Rivers urf Bluurd.

I never got to use it pre-nerf, and when I did get to it, it's just double-slash with that one Ninjutsu from Sekiro applied. I can imagine people spamming this and then quickstepping out of its reach. That it was nerfed across the board is unbelievable, and that they didn't revert PvE nerfs after separating the two is plain amateur. I demand the brokenness that it was, and unnerfed bosses.

rivers was partially un-nerfed but not all the way. rivers is one i was talking about when some changes were reversed after pvp exclusive balance was implemented - fromsoft realized they nerfed it to much for the sake of pvp, slightly reduced the nerf, and its totally fine now. very strong, extremely serviceable main weapon that will give you tons of bleed procs.

rivers in its current state is how fromsoftware wants it to be, in single player pve. the reduction in strength between now and launch is not a concession for pvp.

[CazadorDeLobo]

Originally posted by DayLight1943:

Originally posted by CazadorDeLobo:

I never got to use it pre-nerf, and when I did get to it, it's just double-slash with that one Ninjutsu from Sekiro applied. I can imagine people spamming this and then quickstepping out of its reach. That it was nerfed across the board is unbelievable, and that they didn't revert PvE nerfs after separating the two is plain amateur. I demand the brokenness that it was, and unnerfed bosses.

rivers was partially un-nerfed but not all the way. rivers is one i was talking about when some changes were reversed after pvp exclusive balance was implemented - fromsoft realized they nerfed it to much for the sake of pvp, slightly reduced the nerf, and its totally fine now. very strong, extremely serviceable main weapon that will give you tons of bleed procs.

rivers in its current state is how fromsoftware wants it to be, in single player pve. the reduction in strength between now and launch is not a concession for pvp.

There's also the heavy bias on Katanas in their games that rubs me the wrong way

[jasonbarron]

I'm just starting to play again after a 1+ year absence. How's Adula's Moonblade now? Still good or nerfed to uselessness?

[Alby]

yea RoB was heavily nerfed. not to the point where it's completely useless (it's still a very good pve weapon). but pre-nerf, oh laddie. that thing was a nuclear weapon. +10 RoB w/ max mimic tear & RoB I was able to beat malenia first time I ever fought her. never even knew about the waterfowl attack because she went down too fast to use it. it even melted bosses immune to bleed. yea yea, I know BuT YoU DiN't BeAt tHe Game The RiGhT WaY.

good lord. it makes me excited to see all the broken weapons the DLC is going to have

[cybercybercybercyber4]

my vote goes to flame of redmanes.

that thing lost everything it was used for, most other things remained atleast a part of what made them so strong.

[CazadorDeLobo]

Originally posted by cybercybercybercyber4:

my vote goes to flame of redmanes.

that thing lost everything it was used for, most other things remained atleast a part of what made them so strong.

I tried that the other day, and next to Flaming Slash, it's a meme of an attack. It's a very, very bad Ash of War. I don't even understand what it would be used for, other than roleplaying I guess

[echo_ML]

Hot take but bloodhound's step sucks now, i never got to use it in its prime but right now it's a hollow shell of what it once was

[cybercybercybercyber4]

Originally posted by echo_ML:

Hot take but bloodhound's step sucks now, i never got to use it in its prime but right now it's a hollow shell of what it once was

im using it currently on my whip and id disagree but the reason isnt obvious.
when performing a normal dodge roll the action only procs when releasing the button, which will cost a few frames, you dont need to release the button to perform BHS or quickstep.

After a while, youll condition yourself to use BHS when the impact is imminent or roll if it isnt, so in combination with the roll youll essentially end up with like 20 i-frames, and both windows overlap a little, so it doesnt need to be spot on.

when trying to gain distance, you can alternate between BHS and roll, starting with BHS.

[Legiondorf]

Just carry a great shield at ALL times even if back bar. The amount of red clowns I see dying to easy fights and not having shields. So yeah lets encourage great shield nerfs lol.