Best Scaling for Fist Weapons?

[An Irate Walrus]

As a follow-up to my build inquiry thread: I've decided to go with fist weapons (I finished DS2 caestus-only, so this isn't entirely new, but it's getting me away from my current katana addiction).

I'm currently using Spiked Caestus +7, but I'm curious where the best scaling (and if possible, stat effect procs) is in this weapon class. The Spiked Caestus inflicts bleed, which is a nice bonus whilst pummeling my enemies into submission, but if y'all know of something better (I'm currently STR-forward, but have no issue switching to quality; I beat the game "legit" six times, and have been farming the Mogh birb since to bypass the leveling concerns in-game), I'd appreciate hearing it.

[Urist Microcline]

For the Spiked Caestus specifically an Occult infusion with 80 Arcane will give you the best combination of physical damage and bleed. A +25 Occult Spiked Caestus with 80 Arcane does 455 physical damage with 88 Bleed.

In comparison to pure physical damage, a +25 Heavy Spiked Caestus (which is better than Keen) at 80 Strength does 477 physical damage with 45 Bleed.

A +25 Quality Spiked Caestus only overtakes Heavy at 60 Strength & 60 Dexterity which is 483 physical and 45 Bleed.

[Hemlock]

Hmmmm.

https://eldenring.wiki.fextralife.com/Venomous+Fang

This with occult scaling. A first class ticket to spread deadly poison all around the Lands Between (it hurts like rot).

Also you can literally loot it like 15 minutes after leaving the cavern of knowledge but yeah you can beat all the bosses with this except the blob.

Heeeeerm why i posted like....nevermind....

[Zogtar]

Star Fists are what a lot of gamers swear by, but I personally am a big fan of the Iron Ball. But in that case you could compare your wants*, pierce & bleed vs strike. Throw around different infusions if you wanna get crazy.

I found the veterans prosthesis to be the worst of the fists weapons, but I'm sure someone else will "um acshully" me.

[LuckyCheshire]

Gotta agree with Hemlock, the Venomous Fang is awesome. Especially with a Bleed infusion. Arcane is going to be your main stat in that case, followed by Strength iirc. It's kind of difficult to come across its dungeon randomly, so you may need to look up a guide.

[Fineous🔥]

Originally posted by Zogtar:

I found the veterans prosthesis to be the worst of the fists weapons, but I'm sure someone else will "um acshully" me.

Problem with those is you get them from Niall nearly the end of main game but they are quite good.

[LuckyCheshire]

Originally posted by Zogtar:

Star Fists are what a lot of gamers swear by, but I personally am a big fan of the Iron Ball. But in that case you could compare your wants*, pierce & bleed vs strike. Throw around different infusions if you wanna get crazy.

I found the veterans prosthesis to be the worst of the fists weapons, but I'm sure someone else will "um acshully" me.

Nope, Veteran's Prosthesis sux lol

[Urist Microcline]

Originally posted by Hemlock:

Hmmmm.

https://eldenring.wiki.fextralife.com/Venomous+Fang

This with occult scaling. A first class ticket to spread deadly poison all around the Lands Between (it hurts like rot).

Also you can literally loot it like 15 minutes after leaving the cavern of knowledge but yeah you can beat all the bosses with this except the blob.

Heeeeerm why i posted like....nevermind....

I'd highly recommend putting Poison infusion on the Venomous Fang. The Poison infusion makes the Deadly Poison from Venemous Fang last as long as regular Poison which is 3 times as long.

[nfinite.recursion]

Originally posted by Zogtar:

Star Fists are what a lot of gamers swear by, but I personally am a big fan of the Iron Ball. But in that case you could compare your wants*, pierce & bleed vs strike. Throw around different infusions if you wanna get crazy.

I found the veterans prosthesis to be the worst of the fists weapons, but I'm sure someone else will "um acshully" me.

I'm one of the many that swear by Star Fists. They're ugly as hell and will probably throw off most fashion-conscious players, but they're better than spiked caestus on STR builds in almost every way. It has native bleed buildup and does more stance damage. (I think)

On my RL 138 co-op toon I use Hookclaws as my primary and Star Fists as a backup in case I get summoned to Radagon / Elden Beast so I can more easily break their stance. Hookclaws, after all, really suck at breaking stance.

[ExTremZ]

for PvP are only Raptor Talons a valid options since heavy into heavy and running heavy into heavy is a true combo, combined with the bloodflame blade on a heavy build for extra tankyness

Venomous Fang are also fun on a build centered around them, so dmg buffs so succesful attacks and poison nearby, running heavy into heavy is true aswell, okkult with a arc heavy build easily one combos most phantoms, if they arent overleveled.

i just play pvp so i dont know how they can be optimal for pve.

[Willcutus]

Do claws count? Dex/Arc build with Raptor Claws and Bloodflame Blade is all you need.

[𝑀𝓊𝑔𝑒𝓃]

Occult starfist and occult blood hound / raptor claws , also occult venomous fang

[An Irate Walrus]

Originally posted by Willcutus:

Do claws count? Dex/Arc build with Raptor Claws and Bloodflame Blade is all you need.

100% they do.

I'm reading all suggestions, but I should have clarified at the outset: this is a PvE-focused build I'm thinking of taking into the expansion.

[Willcutus]

Originally posted by An Irate Walrus:

Originally posted by Willcutus:

Do claws count? Dex/Arc build with Raptor Claws and Bloodflame Blade is all you need.

100% they do.

I'm reading all suggestions, but I should have clarified at the outset: this is a PvE-focused build I'm thinking of taking into the expansion.

My favorite way to kill Shardbearer Blood Omen Mohg before he can hit phase 2 is to Raptor Claw bleed him to death.

[Greywander]

Originally posted by Willcutus:

Do claws count? Dex/Arc build with Raptor Claws and Bloodflame Blade is all you need.

There's no reason to invest in Arcane for this build, just so long as you have enough to cast Bloodflame Blade. You can't buff a weapon if you put an Occult/Blood/Poison affinity on it, so the weapons themselves won't scale with ARC at all or get more bleed from ARC. Likewise, Bloodflame Blade does not scale with ARC at all either; in fact, like all other weapon buffs, it scales exclusively with Faith, regardless of the seal you're using.

A DEX/FTH build actually works pretty well for a "magic swordsman" type of build, especially with paired weapons like claws and fists (since the buff applies to both hands). It's not just Bloodflame Blade, you also have access to a variety of other weapon buffs that will allow you adapt to whatever you're fighting. Bloodflame for setting enemies on fire (Miranda flowers, finger creepers) and those weak to bleed. Order's Blade for skeletons, death birds, and other undead. Black Flame Blade for bosses. Electrify Armament for fighting in the rain/lakes or against abductor virgins. And so on.

Faith builds also have access to a nice elemental variety across incantations, affinities, and FTH-scaling unique weapons. This will give you the broadest toolset for handling the DLC.

I'm planning to do a STR/FTH build myself along these same lines, but I'm going to opt for the Great Stars and Icon Shield for a sort of regen tank build.

One last note, definitely give the Grafted Dragon a try. It's a surprisingly effective weapon, and the weapon art will shred things like tree spirits and avatars. It's the only fist weapon that isn't paired, so you'll need to pair it up with another fist weapon to dual-wield. Although, this gives you more flexibility as you can also switch to dual-wielding the paired fist weapon. So, for example, you could have both a seal and the Grafted Dragon in the off-hand, allowing you to use the seal to buff your main paired weapon, or switch to the dragon when unbuffed. (The Grafted Dragon allows you to use its skill in the off-hand, similar to shields, hence why I'd put it there instead of the main hand.)