Struggling as a magic user

[lzarubina7]

I finished the game as a melee character and started a new playthrough as a prisoner. I'm level 79 now, vigor 40, mind 22, int 32, currently I'm leveling int to get to use comet azur and other stuff, I have a moonveil and a shield. And it is way harder than it was as a vagabond.
Basically I feel like I'm still melee but way weaker, because I never have enough fp to kill anyone except the weakest mobs. I have way less healing because I have to use fp so I have to use cerulean tears. I can't wear any proper armour because I don't have the resources to upgrade stamina.
I felt this way since limgrave, I literally could not defeat margit using magic, I defeated him only when I used all my flasks as hp healers, grabbed a sword and didn't lose time to cast, now I'm on the plateau. When does the easy fun mage mod start? What I'm I missing?

[Sparhawk 59]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y81nfnKNSrg

[Serulean]

Magic builds suck unless you use guides to get op items earlier. Just play strength build and trivialize everything with stuns and guard breaks, or dex/arcane build for huge bleed procs.

[cybercybercybercyber4]

Use magic glintblade and/or carian slicer, those two are very cost effecient.

Yes your starter spell is one of the best spells in the game and you could just keep using it until the end.

But just for confirmation, i agree that magic is not as OP as some people want others to believe.

[Boss]

The reality of the situation is people that have very little experience playing mages have told you, repeatedly, that they're easy mode. The truth is completely and utterly different.

You'll be able to cheese some bosses and in multiplayer (and sometimes PvP) will have an easier time. Outside of that, prepare for pain.

[Senki]

Originally posted by Boss:

The reality of the situation is people that have very little experience playing mages have told you, repeatedly, that they're easy mode. The truth is completely and utterly different.

You'll be able to cheese some bosses and in multiplayer (and sometimes PvP) will have an easier time. Outside of that, prepare for pain.

No, it's the exact opposite. People that have actual experience playing mages and who already know how to make them op showed everyone that they are op and new players go in expecting to be op by default.

Mages when built correctly are actually much easier than melee especially in boss fights, problem is getting there first.

[Boss]

Originally posted by Senki:

Originally posted by Boss:

The reality of the situation is people that have very little experience playing mages have told you, repeatedly, that they're easy mode. The truth is completely and utterly different.

You'll be able to cheese some bosses and in multiplayer (and sometimes PvP) will have an easier time. Outside of that, prepare for pain.

No, it's the exact opposite. People that have actual experience playing mages and who already know how to make them op showed everyone that they are op and new players go in expecting to be op by default.

Mages when built correctly are actually much easier than melee especially in boss fights, problem is getting there first.

This isn't true. Because that same logic can be applied to melee builds.

I'm sorry. Bleed builds, or high strength, high vit builds that don't have to waste points on going well beyond soft cap of 40 in a damage stat, and don't need to invest in mind, have always been superior to the nightmare of trying to play a mage.

Especially since mages have slower attacks than any ultra weapon.

[WhiteMamba]

Everything can be op in this game if you aim for it, but playing normally sorcery is definitely not op. In fact many enemies are waaaay harder when you try to fight them at range. They respond different, have different combos at range. For example Elemer/Bell Bearing Hunter - he is sooo much easier up close, where you dont have to deal with his floating red sword behind your back.

For now you have to treat sorceries like addition and not as a main weapon.
1. Upgrade your staff as much as you can / get meteorite staff
2. Get as many memory stones as you can - the more spells, the better you are equipped for different situations
3. Talismans: Radagon's Icon is a must, too many enemies read your inputs and will have too quick counters.
4. Level int higher. You want Comet.
4. Spells: everyone has their own favourites. What I'd equip at your level would be: rock sling (good tracking, stagger ability), carian slicer (quick mele with high damage), star shower (for enemies that dodge a lot), Glintstone Pebble (pew pew option), Gavel of Haima (dont sleep on this spell - it has hyperarmor, high poise damage and stagger). Adula Moonblade (if you progressed enough to have it). There are many other good options such as Night Shard (its invisible for enemies), Loretta Greatbow for sniping from long distance

[Senki]

Originally posted by Boss:

Originally posted by Senki:

No, it's the exact opposite. People that have actual experience playing mages and who already know how to make them op showed everyone that they are op and new players go in expecting to be op by default.

Mages when built correctly are actually much easier than melee especially in boss fights, problem is getting there first.

This isn't true. Because that same logic can be applied to melee builds.

I'm sorry. Bleed builds, or high strength, high vit builds that don't have to waste points on going well beyond soft cap of 40 in a damage stat, and don't need to invest in mind, have always been superior to the nightmare of trying to play a mage.

Especially since mages have slower attacks than any ultra weapon.

no it can't be applied to melee builds as well because melee builds also need to know the enemy move sets much more than mages do

Outside of a few rare cases all mages need to do is run away and spam ranged things regardless of the enemy move sets. You can kill malenia by literally only running away and spamming night comet without ever learning how to dodge a single move she has.

A bleed/high str/whatever melee build will still need to learn how to dodge at least most of the things enemies do to win easily. You can have all the damage and stagger you want but you'll still be in a lot more danger than mages

ofc there are also some melee ashes of war that can be used to basically have the playstyle of a mage like blasphemous blade/fallingstar jaw but I'm talking about builds that focus on melee hits

[buttchin]

Originally posted by lzarubina7:

I finished the game as a melee character and started a new playthrough as a prisoner. I'm level 79 now, vigor 40, mind 22, int 32, currently I'm leveling int to get to use comet azur and other stuff, I have a moonveil and a shield. And it is way harder than it was as a vagabond.
Basically I feel like I'm still melee but way weaker, because I never have enough fp to kill anyone except the weakest mobs. I have way less healing because I have to use fp so I have to use cerulean tears. I can't wear any proper armour because I don't have the resources to upgrade stamina.
I felt this way since limgrave, I literally could not defeat margit using magic, I defeated him only when I used all my flasks as hp healers, grabbed a sword and didn't lose time to cast, now I'm on the plateau. When does the easy fun mage mod start? What I'm I missing?

Magic builds are never fun because most bosses are designed for melee
I only use magic/incantation just as a cosmetic
I always use black blade, lighting bolt and flame clense me with my guts greatsword build

[Sc0rpiTr0n]

Originally posted by Senki:

Outside of a few rare cases all mages need to do is run away and spam ranged things regardless of the enemy move sets. You can kill malenia by literally only running away and spamming night comet without ever learning how to dodge a single move she has.

A bleed/high str/whatever melee build will still need to learn how to dodge at least most of the things enemies do to win easily. You can have all the damage and stagger you want but you'll still be in a lot more danger than mages

As a magic enjoyer I am with you 100%.

Only players who don't have enough experience
playing mage will say mages are NOT easy mod.

But playing mage requires some experience. It will not be easy for first time player.
Strength/Faith is probably easiest for first time players.

Originally posted by buttchin:

Magic builds are never fun because most bosses are designed for melee

I must disagree on that.
Only time when I feel melee is more effective than spells is against
Rennala and maybe second phase Malenia (Night Comet is still highly effective).
Edit: forgot to add Smarag as well.

Other bosses may be designed for melee but will die easily to
Comet, Night Comet, Shard Spiral spam.

And I mean solo, no summons whatsoever.

Thing is mages show their true power closer you are to the end.
You simply will not have right spells, equipment and stats early in the game.

Just my opinion. Don't shoot :-)

[Mythily]

As a full faith caster, I agree it isn't easy. A good amount of enemies dodge slow projectiles, making it usually pointless to fight them at range. Shielded enemies are a big pain if you don't have ambush shard. Another thing to keep in mind is how different ranged combat is from melee.
Take that rune bear boss for example. Fighting that as a mage/ranged caster is a nightmare. That one likely took me the most tries so far out of all the optional bosses I've fought.

There is one thing I will say though, is the use of summons. If you're playing any ranged build, summons turn it into easy mode. Compared to when you're melee, when anything aggros to your summons, it's free damage without risk because you don't have to pay much attention to when the enemy will change aggro again.
Then again... some optional content deserves spirit ashes "abuse".
I don't understand what the devs thought when designing some of the optional fights.

[Sc0rpiTr0n]

Originally posted by Mythily:

Take that rune bear boss for example. Fighting that as a mage/ranged caster is a nightmare. That one likely took me the most tries so far out of all the optional bosses I've fought.

If I may comment about Rune Bears.
They are formidable opponents but nowhere near nightmare-level you describe.

If you are caster it does not automatically mean you want to stay at range.
It also doesn't mean you can't use melee weapons.
Weapons with Flame or Cold affinities are very powerful.

Against Rune Bears it is best to go under them and keep to their sides.
They are mostly harmless that way and you can hit them with spells (or melee) up close.

When they charge and move away from you hit them at distance.

Originally posted by Mythily:

some optional content deserves spirit ashes "abuse".

I don't feel the same but respect your view.

Duo and trio boss fights got nerfed few patches ago
and I don't see the need to summon Spirit Ashes for anything.

But Spirit Ashes are in the game to be used and they certainly can be amusing :-)

[Lil Grandpa]

It is absolutely easy compared to melee since you don't even have to get close. Pump vig to 30, get the meteorite staff, use carian slicer or glintstone pebble and faceroll through encounters.

[Raitøx]

Originally posted by lzarubina7:

I finished the game as a melee character and started a new playthrough as a prisoner. I'm level 79 now, vigor 40, mind 22, int 32, currently I'm leveling int to get to use comet azur and other stuff, I have a moonveil and a shield. And it is way harder than it was as a vagabond.
Basically I feel like I'm still melee but way weaker, because I never have enough fp to kill anyone except the weakest mobs. I have way less healing because I have to use fp so I have to use cerulean tears. I can't wear any proper armour because I don't have the resources to upgrade stamina.
I felt this way since limgrave, I literally could not defeat margit using magic, I defeated him only when I used all my flasks as hp healers, grabbed a sword and didn't lose time to cast, now I'm on the plateau. When does the easy fun mage mod start? What I'm I missing?

To play caster you also need to level dexterity since it increase casting speed (begin at 10 dexterity up to 70 dexterity also affect using certain items) there is a talisman increasing your casting speed by an equivalent of +30 dex so you need at least 40 dex to be capped.

In truth playing pure int build is ♥♥♥♥ in Elden ring :

- Only a handful of spells are truly useful (or they're just an upgrade from an earlier spell) compared to faith.
- Zero worthwhile utilities spells : retalation spells are useless because the way spell selection work we can't use "reactive" spell properly, Eternal Darkness could be useful if he lasted more than 3 sec and had a bigger vacuum range, meanwhile faith is dancing of joy with all his utilities while also having a large selections of damaging spells....
- To maximize your damage you will have to go glass canon with 0 sustain because most item that increase your magic power either reduce your health, stamina, increase damage taken or even increase your FP cost so you get easily one shot if you make any mistake
- The ranged advantage no longer work in Elden ring because most enemies have : long distance/lighting fast gap closer, arena wide attack or a powerful ranged attack they can spam (like the runebear roar) or they will just perfect dodge all your spells
- "Comet Azur" is a joke with his long cast time, 3 memories slot cost, very short range, high FP cost and it can even easily miss big enemies with a little mobility, "Founding rain of stars" and "Star of ruin" are no better.

If you truly want to play caster i would advise two solutions to not go crazy :
1) You begin to play as a dex build with a priority on getting 40 dex while you gather all the tools and sorceries then you pump Int and become a pure spellcaster
2) Play a faith build and enjoy very rapidly using OP incantations accessible close to the beginning of the game like Black flame, Dragon communion, aspect of the crucible and a lot of utilities you won't ever regret

I truly hope the DLC give some love to sorcery.

Edit : don't forget to abuse summon as a spellcaster it's expected to use the right summon to tank for you (like in D&D or elder scrolls game).

[vamirez]

Originally posted by (Poot) Lil Grandpa:

It is absolutely easy compared to melee since you don't even have to get close. Pump vig to 30, get the meteorite staff, use carian slicer or glintstone pebble and faceroll through encounters.

If you don't have to get close, why use Carian slicer?

What I don't get is that playstyle of just shooting things and then running away, rinse repeat. For one, at some point during zone crawls, FP will run out and you will have to reset or get into melee. Also while you can snipe some enemies, others will charge you and be in your face, and then the caster must be able to melee, too. Hence spells like Carian slicer. Or do you just run away and reset them every time? Isn't that taking a long time and really boring?

Then there is a difference between players who have already played through the game and know how to melee if needed and those that don't. There is another difference when players begin the game with a run to collect certain items or if you don't do that.

The result is what we have here: Some ppl claim magic is easy mode and others can't connect that to their own experience in game.

I can only say, my first playthrough was mage, and I died a ton. And ofc I needed to learn movesets. But maybe I'm an idiot.