Random Lore Time : Sellen, Ranni, and Seluvis

[SadPlatty©]

Spoiler Alert for those who haven't completed the Sorceress Sellen/Ranni lines





So I was thinking about this a bit recently, and was wondering what others (interested about lore anyway), thought. Basically - I am wondering if there is any connection between her quest-line and Ranni.

As we know - Ranni had tossed-aside her corporeal flesh and possesses the puppet body when we meet her, as she chose not to be an Empyrean. Cool bananas. Why does this matter here though? Well, let us take a look at Sellen for a moment.

During her quest, she is being pursued by Witch-Hunter Jerren, and because of this - she during her time in Witchbane Ruins then gives us her Primal Glintstone. Now, what does this do again? Oh yeah - you take it to a puppet of herself that Seluvis prepared.

So we see thus far, both are Witches that also no longer inhibited physical bodies, but puppets that where probably both constructed by Seluvis - as we know he also hung around with Gideon some time ago and they stopped that friendship when Seluvis took Dolores from him. Granted - it is a stretch maybe to say that Seluvis was involved in Ranni's puppet body, but he somehow did also become one of her advisors (even has his own tower near hers).

Lastly - Ranni isn't completely oblivious, she knows that Seluvis is doing something when you attempt to give her the Amber tonic (considering she immediately is like "You two need to put your ♥♥♥♥♥ away, then make like a tree and get the ♥♥♥♥ outta here".

So what is it that I am looking to discuss here?
- Seluvis : What are the odds he constructed Ranni's current body?
- Sellen : How did she know Seluvis? Did she know Ranni? Maybe she was studying the same magic Ranni uses, hence them both being considered Witches? What is the possibility that Sellen tried the same exact thing as Ranni, but wasn't powerful enough to withstand the required magical power? Ranni gave her Empyrean body and power while Sellen had a dead body and limited power (and maybe this is also why she becomes the Graven Mass).
- Ranni : More or less covered in the other two - did she know them from before, and/or how (if related) would Sellen have learned of Ranni's magical accomplishment of "rebirth" in another vessel?

[John Titor]

Originally posted by SadPlatty©:

...Granted - it is a stretch maybe to say that Seluvis was involved in Ranni's puppet body, but he somehow did also become one of her advisors (even has his own tower near hers)...

Maybe not. He does, after all, plot to make her HIS puppet. Perhaps he hand a hand in creating her body?

...So what is it that I am looking to discuss here?
- Seluvis : What are the odds he constructed Ranni's current body?

I calculate a 38.387% chance.

- Sellen : How did she know Seluvis? Did she know Ranni? Maybe she was studying the same magic Ranni uses, hence them both being considered Witches? What is the possibility that Sellen tried the same exact thing as Ranni, but wasn't powerful enough to withstand the required magical power? Ranni gave her Empyrean body and power while Sellen had a dead body and limited power (and maybe this is also why she becomes the Graven Mass)...

Sellen and Seluvis studied at the college, Rennala is queen mum headmistress, Ranni is Rennala's daughter. I'm sure they all passed each other in the halls at some point.

[SadPlatty©]

Originally posted by John Titor:

Originally posted by SadPlatty©:

...Granted - it is a stretch maybe to say that Seluvis was involved in Ranni's puppet body, but he somehow did also become one of her advisors (even has his own tower near hers)...

Maybe not. He does, after all, plot to make her HIS puppet. Perhaps he hand a hand in creating her body?

Which actually kinda makes it more interesting to think of what the potion actually does. If she is already in a puppet body of his creation, is he just gunna put her in another one? Or is the potion's purpose to basically obliterate their conscious mind (sorta like what happens to Nepheli where she goes to sleep and winds up there).

...So what is it that I am looking to discuss here?
- Seluvis : What are the odds he constructed Ranni's current body?

I calculate a 38.387% chance.

- Sellen : How did she know Seluvis? Did she know Ranni? Maybe she was studying the same magic Ranni uses, hence them both being considered Witches? What is the possibility that Sellen tried the same exact thing as Ranni, but wasn't powerful enough to withstand the required magical power? Ranni gave her Empyrean body and power while Sellen had a dead body and limited power (and maybe this is also why she becomes the Graven Mass)...

Sellen and Seluvis studied at the college, Rennala is queen mum headmistress, Ranni is Rennala's daughter. I'm sure they all passed each other in the halls at some point.

True - wasn't even thinking about that; makes it interesting to then consider that it could very well be possible that they also had the same mentor/instructor as well; and thus it could be a DLC thing where they expound more on the mentors teaching all of our demi-god/tarnished wizards their crazy stuff.

[John Titor]

Originally posted by SadPlatty©:

Originally posted by John Titor:

Maybe not. He does, after all, plot to make her HIS puppet. Perhaps he hand a hand in creating her body?

Which actually kinda makes it more interesting to think of what the potion actually does. If she is already in a puppet body of his creation, is he just gunna put her in another one?...

I suspect he would have just used the one she's in, as you don't see a second anywhere, to my knowledge.

[SadPlatty©]

Originally posted by John Titor:

Originally posted by SadPlatty©:

Which actually kinda makes it more interesting to think of what the potion actually does. If she is already in a puppet body of his creation, is he just gunna put her in another one?...

I suspect he would have just used the one she's in, as you don't see a second anywhere, to my knowledge.

I guess little Ranni had to come from somewhere - maybe he has a bit more going on upstairs than just "enjoying" the company of his puppets.

As a wise old codger once said "You're welcome to use whatever you find. (Whispers) ...Even the doll, should it please you..."

[John Titor]

Kind of off-topic, here's something to think about: There's a seemingly random puppet in the basement that doesn't really belong to anyone that I can tell. Later you give Boc a larval tear, he transforms, and his new body is the same model as that puppet (the face anyway, and even the hat). What's going on there?

[Holografix]

Originally posted by SadPlatty©:

So what is it that I am looking to discuss here?
- Seluvis : What are the odds he constructed Ranni's current body?
- Sellen : How did she know Seluvis? Did she know Ranni? Maybe she was studying the same magic Ranni uses, hence them both being considered Witches? What is the possibility that Sellen tried the same exact thing as Ranni, but wasn't powerful enough to withstand the required magical power? Ranni gave her Empyrean body and power while Sellen had a dead body and limited power (and maybe this is also why she becomes the Graven Mass).
- Ranni : More or less covered in the other two - did she know them from before, and/or how (if related) would Sellen have learned of Ranni's magical accomplishment of "rebirth" in another vessel?

1. Does Seluvis actually construct a puppet? I believe he merely has a person drink a potion, right? Which means that you are under the impression that Ranni's quad-armed body was once an actual flesh being?

2. Sellen met Seluvis at the Academy. Seluvis helped Sellen after she was expelled. Seluvis has a Sellen puppet in his puppet horde. Was Sellen a twin? When speaking with Sellen, she was surprised to hear from Seluvis again.

3. Ranni is the daughter of Rennalla and Radagon, and is Carian Royalty. The Carian Royalty controlled the Academy until Radagon left to be with Marika. Ranni probably knows Seluvis through Radagon as Seluvis is wearing one of those face masks bearing Radagon's seal. I don't know if Ranni knew of Sellen at all.

[SadPlatty©]

Originally posted by John Titor:

Kind of off-topic, here's something to think about: There's a seemingly random puppet in the basement that doesn't really belong to anyone that I can tell. Later you give Boc a larval tear, he transforms, and his new body is the same model as that puppet (the face anyway, and even the hat). What's going on there?

Interesting - Boc is surprisingly one of two NPCs I haven't completed yet but was aware of/started his line (other being the eyes woman).

The fact he gets a new body after the tear makes me think more along the lines of Rennala though (rebirth). If memory serves correctly - her Great Runes sole purpose is to prevent "imperfections" that would ultimately lead to either death or living that Albinauric life; though that fact that it matches the puppet and Boc is seemingly fine does sorta form a plot-hole in that theory.

Originally posted by Holografix:

1. Does Seluvis actually construct a puppet? I believe he merely has a person drink a potion, right? Which means that you are under the impression that Ranni's quad-armed body was once an actual flesh being?

He does have them drink the potions, but in the case of who you present to him for the blue one (Nepheli or Eater), you can eventually get their puppet later for your collection (with one being from him). Also - I know quad-arms wifu is the puppet, she cast her real body aside, and her puppet is actually more so designed after her mentor.

Originally posted by Holografix:

2. Sellen met Seluvis at the Academy. Seluvis helped Sellen after she was expelled. Seluvis has a Sellen puppet in his puppet horde. Was Sellen a twin? When speaking with Sellen, she was surprised to hear from Seluvis again.

For this - it makes sense they met there, but I wonder if they had also already started down their "magical paths" there also. Azur and Lusat started putting Glintstone in their bodies and replacing bits with the stuff to hold more power - and Sellen made a "Primal Glintstone" that was literally her essence to reanimate in the puppet. At that point, Seluvis could basically make new larger vessels (if he made Ranni's and can make them non-human-ish), which could then in theory be made of or have more glintstone lodged in it for "UNLIMITED_POWER.palpatine".

Maybe this was supposed to be the start of something beautiful, but Sellen miscalculated how much power she was messing with, thus she got Grave-Massed as wizards seem to do.

Originally posted by Holografix:

3. Ranni is the daughter of Rennalla and Radagon, and is Carian Royalty. The Carian Royalty controlled the Academy until Radagon left to be with Marika. Ranni probably knows Seluvis through Radagon as Seluvis is wearing one of those face masks bearing Radagon's seal. I don't know if Ranni knew of Sellen at all.

That is possible also - didn't even think about the mask's similarities. And yeah, it is hard to say with virtually no evidence lol, but that's why it's a theory. Though I could see ranni being interested in what Sellen is doing or vice-versa as some students are like that (fascinated by each-others work, and for good reason).

[vamirez]

Contains spoilers: From Sellen's questline we know that she was cast out of the academy because she wanted to pursue forbidden practices/studies. These practices resulted in the creation of those mage-balls which are basically several mages melded together. This is why Rennala outlawed these practices. If we install Sellen as academy headmistress at the end of her quest, she goes right back to that stuff and well - she becomes a ball. This being her main interest means that Sellen was not actually interested in killing off her body like Ranni did. However, during the quest you help her to escape her torment/punishment by killing her and transferring her into a doll. The only dollmaker around seems to be Seluvis, so they probably know him (he is a famous mage...) and find his expertise useful. Ranni probably tolerated his more sinister proclivities...